JoieDeVivre said:

Gilgamesh18 said:

The market more equitably determines wages for labor. Since many people are willing to do these jobs there labor is cheap. If less people were willing to wages would rise.

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You say that as if people have a choice. If you're working a job with shitty wages it's likely because it's one of your only options.

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Gilgamesh18 said:

The market more equitably determines wages for labor. Since many people are willing to do these jobs there labor is cheap. If less people were willing to wages would rise.

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

Gilgamesh18 said:

The market more equitably determines wages for labor. Since many people are willing to do these jobs there labor is cheap. If less people were willing to wages would rise.

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Nope "the market" generally opts for the lowest possible wages for workers at all costs. Leading to predatory practices during economic crisis.

http://democurmudgeon.blogspot.ca/2012/11/ceo-job-creators-refuse-to-offer-decent.html

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zappaisgod said:

fapjack said:

That's cause the stupid poor people that bitch about shitty treatment of workers are the same stupid poor people that shop at walmart.

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Not for nothing but who the fuck do you think you are telling anybody that it is stupid to shop for the best price?

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

zappaisgod said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

Its impossible with how tight of a grip the major supermarket players have on the sector. Cutting pennies off products with cut throat enthusiasm only erodes the overall wages and economic strength of a society. But capitalism is glorious system comrade, much profit for small set of hands, much happiness for those who get lucky, no?

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It also saves the consumers vast sums of money.  Much profit for small hands?  Do you think one man owns Wal-Mart, by the way?  It isn't so.  Pension funds the world over, often union and public employee pension funds, own Wal-Mart stock and they would be sore pissed indeed if their profits were to be diminished. 

Capitalism provides the greatest amount of prosperity to the greatest amount of people. 

It's like arguing with elementary school children.  You all think corporations are owned by a Martian.  They aren't.  They are owned by regular people.

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Not the "S" on the word hands. Concentrated monetary gain doesnt benefit society in the same capacity more equal ratios of owner worker income ratios would. By no means am I advocating equality, simply more workable wages. Something completely alien to your pissant $18 hour wages, and you wonder why you have no English speaking workers on your sites.

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Gilgamesh18 said:

No one is forcing these people to work for free they are paid. Hopefully if they are smart with expenses and live below there means they should be fine. I know many that do this yes the work is shitty but for many it is temporary as they search for better jobs or save to pursue higher education.

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It is not the wages that is the problem it is the mentality that I need to buy whatever I want cause I deserve it.

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zappaisgod said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

zappaisgod said:

Bodhi of Ankou said:

Its impossible with how tight of a grip the major supermarket players have on the sector. Cutting pennies off products with cut throat enthusiasm only erodes the overall wages and economic strength of a society. But capitalism is glorious system comrade, much profit for small set of hands, much happiness for those who get lucky, no?

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It also saves the consumers vast sums of money.  Much profit for small hands?  Do you think one man owns Wal-Mart, by the way?  It isn't so.  Pension funds the world over, often union and public employee pension funds, own Wal-Mart stock and they would be sore pissed indeed if their profits were to be diminished. 

Capitalism provides the greatest amount of prosperity to the greatest amount of people. 

It's like arguing with elementary school children.  You all think corporations are owned by a Martian.  They aren't.  They are owned by regular people.

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Not the "S" on the word hands. Concentrated monetary gain doesnt benefit society in the same capacity more equal ratios of owner worker income ratios would. By no means am I advocating equality, simply more workable wages. Something completely alien to your pissant $18 hour wages, and you wonder why you have no English speaking workers on your sites.

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Umm I don't much give a shit about society, Captain Borg.  I care about individuals.

Now you got a problem with an $18 an hour wage?  There are no English speaking workers because young American workers have been Montessoried into oblivion

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fapjack said:

zappaisgod said:

fapjack said:

That's cause the stupid poor people that bitch about shitty treatment of workers are the same stupid poor people that shop at walmart.

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Not for nothing but who the fuck do you think you are telling anybody that it is stupid to shop for the best price?

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Walmart isn't the best prices, at least not in my area.  Walmart also has shitty products.  People that don't know their ass from a hole in the ground can keep shopping at that shithole place. You get what you pay for though, with its inconsiderate workers, long lines ass lines, and its garbage selection.  Walmart fucking sucks, and not just because they treat their workers and their merchants like shit.

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JoieDeVivre said:

Gilgamesh18 said:

No one is forcing these people to work for free they are paid. Hopefully if they are smart with expenses and live below there means they should be fine. I know many that do this yes the work is shitty but for many it is temporary as they search for better jobs or save to pursue higher education.

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No one if forcing these people but without education there aren't many other options. You can't save up to afford higher education and support your family at a minimum wage job. At that point, you're stuck. I know it's hard to comprehend that if you haven't been in the situation but this is the situation that a lot of people find themselves in.

Quote:

It is not the wages that is the problem it is the mentality that I need to buy whatever I want cause I deserve it.

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I think it's bizarre that you think you can know the mentality of a large group of others. I've never met one poor person with that mentality, but I've heard a lot of pundits claim that this is what all poor people think.

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Bodhi of Ankou said:

zappaisgod said:

Umm I don't much give a shit about society, Captain Borg.  I care about individuals.

Now you got a problem with an $18 an hour wage?  There are no English speaking workers because young American workers have been Montessoried into oblivion

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For fourth year trades when the median wage is somewhere around 25-35 an hour? yes I do have a problem with it. Sir fuck everyone else I want money, I too care about individuals.

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What are you babbling about with this 4th year trades crap?  By the way, I don't set the market for labor rates in residential construction.  The customer does.  If my labor cost is too high I DON'T GET ANY JOBS! 

Gilgamesh18 said:

Ive seen it first hand the biggest difference between the classes is how money is spent.

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Another huge factor is the moronic obsession with having kids im sorry but if your stupid enough to keep having kids then your fucked and I have no sympathy.

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An accident =/= a moronic obsession with having kids. Most people don't have kids because they're stupid. It's clear you have no empathy and understanding for anyone who is not well off.

fapjack said:

I don't care if walmart pays their workers well or not, I hate the people that work at walmart.  Minimum wage is a shitty way to live, but its not hard to live off of minimum wage in a lot of areas as long as you don't have kids.  Its a shitty company for paying shitty wages, but that's how they make their profit.  I get that.  I probably wouldn't hire any of those fucking morons either, but because shitty jobs like walmart exist they do find work.

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You sound a little like a fucking moron yourself if you really hate people because they are stuck working a shitty job.

Note: I'm not actually calling you a moron personally, just saying your opinion is a little moronic.

Gilgamesh18 said:

I am not well off Joie...

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fapjack said:

I should restate that. I hate the people that I've encountered at walmart.  Some of the most inconsiderate people I've ever dealt with in retail.  Might just be because they hate their job, but I'm always really nice to people in retail so it pisses me off when they treat me shitty.

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Gilgamesh18 said:

I am not well off Joie...

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Gilgamesh18 said:

It is due to the fact that I go to school and work without any outside financial support apart from student loans which I am in the process of repaying. Many americans however live beyond there means and go into debt the greed of main street causes there finances to decay.

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Many poor americans are in the same situation as you. Taking on student loans is living beyond your means, it's no better than taking on any other form of loan. A lot of people would like you to believe that most poor americans are greedy and take out loans to live frivolously but usually that is not the case. Usually they're taking out loans to afford necessities and living expenses since most unskilled jobs today aren't enough to support a family unlike a few decades ago.

JoieDeVivre said:

Gilgamesh18 said:

Ive seen it first hand the biggest difference between the classes is how money is spent.

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The biggest difference I've seen is access to education and well paying jobs. You're just spouting another generalization that conservative pundits hinge their arguments on. I don't think you personally know any average poor people.

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Quote:

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Another huge factor is the moronic obsession with having kids im sorry but if your stupid enough to keep having kids then your fucked and I have no sympathy.

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An accident =/= a moronic obsession with having kids. Most people don't have kids because they're stupid. It's clear you have no empathy and understanding for anyone who is not well off.

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