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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Hunting and Identification
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Pan Subs?
    #11064614 -























Habitat: Found on a lawn.

Gills: Dark brown gills.

Stem: Light brown, moving to a whitish color at the top where it meets the cap. White lines moving around the stem and vertical.

Cap: Light brown with dark brown spots.

Spore print color: Printing them now.

Bruising: No color change was observed.

Location: Northern Mass.

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: freestyles]
    #11064651 -

Look like Subbs to me. If the print is JET BLACK, then they should be good. Wait for a pro to chime in.

Any bruising at the base?


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"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"- Hunter S. Thompson

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11064666 -

BTW You'll need a good 5 dry grams to trip. 50 wet. That is, If you like to trip like I do. I like PAn subb trips more than cubes. More visual.


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"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"- Hunter S. Thompson

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11064990 -

gill color is wrong for subbs...I can't tell from your images what they are:shrug:


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Mr. Mushrooms said:
I will confess something that should be quite obvious, CC.  I love mushrooms, i.e. fungi.  I really do.  I am talking about a strong feeling, i.e. emotion, for them.  I think they are beautiful.  I even dream of them.

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: Bobzimmer]
    #11065010 -

They look nothing like Panaeolus to me either.


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"Vegetarian" [ /ˌvedʒəˈteəriən/] - Ancient slang meaning "village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride".

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: freestyles]
    #11065194 -

I'd say Lacrymaria velutina.


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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: landsnorkler]
    #11065212 -

I ALMOST said that...:lol::thumbup:


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Mr. Mushrooms said:
I will confess something that should be quite obvious, CC.  I love mushrooms, i.e. fungi.  I really do.  I am talking about a strong feeling, i.e. emotion, for them.  I think they are beautiful.  I even dream of them.

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: landsnorkler]
    #11065353 -

Bobzimmer said:
I ALMOST said that...:lol::thumbup:


landsnorkler said:
I'd say Lacrymaria velutina.


That is funny you said that, I posted an ID a few weeks ago and that is what I found.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10866783

I actually saw some Lacrymaria Velutina growing about 10-15 feet from this batch and ignored them.

The Lac. Vel. had veil remnants present on the stem, that is actually how I identified them and I ignored them.

However this other batch of shrooms I found had no veil remnants and looked slightly different so I decided to pick them and try for an ID.

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: freestyles]
    #11065458 -

i don't think those are Panaeolus either,,, did you get a spore print yet.?


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øª¶•†ƒ¨√©µƒ∂´

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: panaeolus]
    #11065586 -

Giving them a lil bit more time so they are dark enough to tell.

I am using iphone for pictures so the pic may not be clear enough for ya'll to tell.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Pan Subs? [Re: freestyles]
    #11065828 -

Prints did not come out the best but as far as I can tell they are black.

I have an iphone and the quality is real low, not sure if it's even worth posting pics because you most likely won't be able to tell..

Should I toss these bad boys or keep em until I can get a better picture for the prints?

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: Bobzimmer]
    #11069235 -

Bobzimmer said:
gill color is wrong for subbs...I can't tell from your images what they are:shrug:



How so? The gills of Subbs are grayish brown then darkening with age to black with white fringes. Why the fuck does everyone always say "THOSE AREN"T PAN SUBBS"... then the dude does a print and it's jet black. Then everyone is like " Oh yeah, cool, nice finds." Subbs vary a great deal in color and appearance. I picked thousands of them this spring. ALL we're legit. The colors varied a GREAT deal. IF they are growing on well fertilized lawns and have color bands on the cap, and blackish gills, and print black, wtf do they not look like subbs?


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"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"- Hunter S. Thompson

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: German Kahuna]
    #11069257 -

German Kahuna said:
They look nothing like Panaeolus to me either.



Nothing like subbs? Explain. Do the caps not look like Pan Subbs? The stem? The habitat is not right? You just like telling people that they are not active? Jealousy? Can a trusted ID'er chime in please. And what is the spore print.

I can't wait for it to be jet black.

Still don't eat them until a pro says so. But don't throw them out just cause some yahoo says, " Those ain't them. "


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"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"- Hunter S. Thompson

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11069269 -

UberDeepName said:
Why the fuck does everyone always say "THOSE AREN"T PAN SUBBS"...



we're just telling the OP our opinions based off the information and photos he provided...  no need to bitch out someone because they're opinion differs from your own.


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øª¶•†ƒ¨√©µƒ∂´

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: panaeolus]
    #11069324 -

Lacrymaria velutina can have a black print. 

The veil remnants on some of the stems in his pictures point away from cinctulus.  And I can see veil fragments clinging to the margins on some of the caps.  It's kind of a tricky one and can look somewhat similar to Panaeolus cinctulus.  Plus his are waterlogged, so you can't see the fibrous cap texture as well. 

Here's a couple pictures of Lacrymaria velutina
http://mushroomobserver.org/21932?search_seq=768157
http://www.flickr.com/photos/kensinger/910880731/

Hope that helps, it's kind of hard for me to explain why they arn't subbs.


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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: landsnorkler]
    #11070825 -

Any other opinions?

Got them sitting right now shriveling up. I know it's prob not even a big enough dose for a light trip but I want to know if I actually found subs or not =)

Prints are def jet black now that I take a closer look at them under a bright white light, the spore prints are just not very condensed together kinda skimpy.

I also know they do not look like the textbook pan sub, otherwise I would be sure of it now that I have prints.

Also now that they have dried the caps have turned almost all the same color a dark golden brown.

Also the gills have become much darker, dark brown to black.

Edited by freestyles (09/16/09 03:00 PM)

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: landsnorkler]
    #11075391 -

landsnorkler said:
Lacrymaria velutina can have a black print.


I don't think this is correct from what I've found in my research. Can you supply linkage or literature to back this up?

Pretty sure Lacrymaria velutina have dark brown prints, and the caps are much more uniform in shape than pan Subbs....

http://www.mushroomexpert.com/lacrymaria_velutina.html

Dark brown and BLACK are not the same. Just like Pan foes have a dark BROWN print. Pan subbs have jet black. Am I wrong?


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"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"- Hunter S. Thompson

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11075403 -

that is correct. it's also correct though that many people have trouble for a while telling a dark print from a black one.


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Attn PWN hunters: If you should come across a bluing Psilocybe matching P. pellicolusa please smell it.
If you detect a scent reminiscent of Anethole (anise) please preserve a specimen or two for study and please PM me.

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Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11075766 -

Quote:
The gills of Subbs are grayish brown then darkening with age to black with white fringes. Why the fuck does everyone always say "THOSE AREN"T PAN SUBBS"


Because they are Lacrymaria velutina.

Quote:
IF they are growing on well fertilized lawns and have color bands on the cap, and blackish gills, and print black, wtf do they not look like subbs?


That band doesn't even look like a Panaeolus band.  As if the cap is not drying like a Panaeolus due to it having a different type of cuticle.

Quote:
Do the caps not look like Pan Subbs?


The shape does not look even close to Panaeolus.  Panaeolus doesn't expand to plane that consistently.

The gills look thin and stick out, like Psilocybe or Psathyrella.

Quote:
The stem?


Too white and Psathyrella-like.

Quote:
Dark brown and BLACK are not the same. Just like Pan foes have a dark BROWN print. Pan subbs have jet black. Am I wrong?


Many species of Psathyrella have a black print, Lacrymaria velutina is one of them.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Pan Subs? [Re: UberDeepName]
    #11075807 -

There's conflicting online interpretations regarding the sporeprint color.  Some say black others say dark brown (Mushrooms Demystified says blackish brown, Rogers Mushrooms says black).  From personal experience, the  Lacrymarias I printed came out black.  I think it can vary, and depends on how long you print the mushroom.  If the spore deposit really piles up and gets deep, you can probably see a brownish sheen in them.

So, I think it could be hard to separate Lacrymaria velutina and Panaeolus cinctulus based on print color.


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Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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