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Invisiblephrozendata
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A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess
    #654202 - 05/30/02 07:30 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

One of my favorite books.

I espically liked the language used in this book. It was written in English but had a "made up" language called Nadsat. This was, most easily explained, as a mix between german and english. A release had a Nadsat dictionary contained in the back but was removed by Anthony Burgess's request. He wanted readers to find out these words the hard way, that is, use a german dictionary. However, I must admit that I didn't have the time for all of that and just printed out a nice copy on the internet. When released, A Clockwork Orange was recoognized as a great Science Fiction literature. However, Anthony Burgess ovbiously centered this novel around free will and psychological behaviourism. "The imagery is superb, and the details with which the violence is described are never gratuitous. The reader is left breathless, outraged, excited, concerned."

Anthony later wrote that It is not, in my view, a very good novel," he wrote later, "but it sincerely presented my abhorrence of the view that some people were criminal and others not. A denial of the universal inheritance of sin is characteristic of Pelagian societies like that of Britain, and it was in Britain, about 1960, that respectable people began to murmur about the growth of juvenile delinquency and suggest [that the young criminals] were a somehow inhuman breed and required inhuman treatment... There were irresponsible people who spoke of aversion therapy... Society, as ever, was put first."

A good summary I found, not written by me:

A Clockwork Orange is set in a future London. 15-year-old Alex, the main character, and his three friends are devoted to ultra-violence and horrorshow. They beat up old men, rape girls, torture and murder, with no qualms. Despite this diabolical orgy of criminality, they are merry and spirited like elfs in an Elizabethan comedy. Alex is the only one in his gang who has fully conscience of what he's doing; on the contrary, his 'droogs' arrange horrorshow in a rather childish way, without knowing why. While committing ruthless acts of violence, Alex mantains an 'elevated' attitude. He doesn't listen to pop, but only to classic music. After the government decides to brainwash him by the 'Ludovico therapy', he'll be no more able to appreciate his favorite composers. (The name 'Ludovico' concerns with Ludwig van Beethoven.)
Burgess's novel is an interesting, disturbing and controversial work of fiction. Since its first apparition, it has provoked thought and reaction. John Gardner considered A Clockwork Orange "Burgess's most brilliant and blackest achievement".

This also made a GREAT movie!


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"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #654779 - 05/31/02 04:10 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

much russki in there...
horrorshow pa russki "xorosho" = excellent
druggie pa russki droog moi = my brother
~
ne zhanaio kakoi gavaru pa russki = i don't know how to speak russian...
dos vadonya = goodbye


--------------------
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Offlinepsyko78626
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #662793 - 06/04/02 03:17 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

The book is horrorshow to say the least. I first read it after seeing to movie in 5th grade. Alex is 15? i always imagined that crazy fuck to be like 18-20 something. you don't see too many youngsters these days with such a love of classical music.


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"If there weren't no humps, there wouldn't be no gettin over" George Clinton


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Invisiblephrozendata
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Anonymous]
    #662860 - 06/04/02 04:03 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, he is 15. I like clasicaly music...a little older than alex though..I first heard of the book when I was 15 acutally...read it when I was 16..the movie was just as good. Yes, it was very horror show..right young droogie?

Wana go get some moloko plus vesches? Crast some pretty polly while were at it?

*laff* suprised I remember some of that shit


--------------------
"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleFrozenHappiness
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #665343 - 06/06/02 06:33 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I remembered hearing a lot about it here at the shroomery and when I found out one of my droogs that works in the shop with me owns the DVD I borrowed it from him. That was the deciding factor in buying the book, I picked it up in Okinawa 2 days later and had it finished in under a week. A definate clasic.


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InvisibleBuzzDoctor
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #682582 - 06/16/02 07:09 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I loved the movie! I should read the book as well. My brother said that it had a 'glossary' to help translating the words. I will definately have to check it outl

Buzz


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Is the glass half-full or half-empty? I say it is both.


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: BuzzDoctor]
    #691416 - 06/20/02 08:58 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I just started the book (don't have it on hand, so I don't know what page/chapter), and I feel that I'm getting a handle on the terminology... It's kind of annoying at times, but it's also kind of fun. You generally know what's going on just by the context, so it's not terribly hard to get through.

Very horrorshow, somewhat disturbing. If not for the other language, it would be a lot more offensive to the eye; I'd have a difficult time writing such smut without another language to fall back on. (If you know what I'm saying.)


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #691427 - 06/20/02 09:02 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Oh ya; I haven't seen the movie, and my libraries copy of the book doesn't have the glossary, though it does have the twenty-first chapter and Burgess's introduction/rant pertaining to the american version of the book and Kubricks film.


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Edited by Ulysees (06/20/02 09:12 PM)


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Invisiblesir tripsalot
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #696479 - 06/23/02 04:34 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I read the Book and then watched the movie. Its great
Ulysees- I felt the exact same way but you get used to it after a bit and it isn't so overwhelming.


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #696540 - 06/23/02 05:15 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Ya, I'm near finished now, O my brothers, and what a horrorshow bit of rabbit it is. At first, I couldn't believe what I viddied, this bezoomny stuff droning on like so much vonny cal as you couldn't belive. But then my droogs, when I could viddy what was going on, I read on and on like a starry old veck sitting in the Biblio, on and on and on until my glazzies were afire. Not even the little ptistas passing by on the street with their groodies all out on display could tear my glazzies from my reading.

What's it been, not but a couple of nochies, and I'm near clean through the other side my brothers. Me em and sis can hardly understand me anymore, what with me going on like bezoomny in Nadsat about moloko and slooshying Ludwig Van and ittying down to the melenky shops for a peet of something with the knives in it...

Truth be told, my brothers, I'm finding this book to be quite similar to 1984, what with the details I won't be govereeting about in here with you little malchickiwicks who hasn't read it yet.

Dost thou agree, then, with this observation? Any of you droogs care to discuss a melenky bit about it? I'll be finished this nochy no doubt if you care to govereet with me.


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Offlinepsyko78626
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #696792 - 06/23/02 07:22 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Everyone just nod and smile.


--------------------
"If there weren't no humps, there wouldn't be no gettin over" George Clinton


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Invisiblephrozendata
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Anonymous]
    #696876 - 06/23/02 07:53 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I totally understand you Ulysees...I've read 1984 as well...both GREAT books! I'de go all into that Nadsat cal but i'm afraid I dont have the time to come up with such a snappy response. Well my young droogie may the ultra-violence be with you!


--------------------
"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #697114 - 06/23/02 09:27 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Ah yes, I viddy some great responses this nochy. This pleases me, so that I feel all warm like in my gulliver. I had a horrowshow smeck at that first reply, and the second too, though for different reasons. Well my droogies, I sat there all on my oddy knocky today flip flip flipping page after page of this like real horrorshow novella. So, dost thou ever haveth a chance to go into the nadsat, phrozen? I'm afraid I don't viddy much opportunity to go on govoreeting like this, what with all slooshying it thinking I've gone bezoomny.

I was really surprised at how similar, and then all at once how dissimilar, this book was to 1984. But that, O My Brothers, does not really mean anything, does it. Upon finishing this book, only, what has it been, a day or two after starting, I cannot verily tell, I feel like my jeezny has been altered in some bezoomny way. I feel as though I was a part of something, and now I am not, and am to grow up alongside, but very seperate from, my little droog Alex. Quite odd really, there not being many things that have such an effect on a young malchick.

I must confess, I've been into the moloko plus, my brothers, and my grasp on the world is quickly slipping while there is still much to do, so I must be off, but it is good will that I leave you with, if indeed that makes any sense at all.


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Invisiblephrozendata
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #697243 - 06/23/02 11:11 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Droog, I've been on my oddy knocky for so long today its not even funny. I've been smottovat at these sodding message boards for so long it's not even funny. No wonder i've been ittying so sodding bezoomny these days. I need to itty and get a real dobby book to read, soon! Maybe i'll itty crast some cutter from some chelloveck while i'm at it!


--------------------
"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #699293 - 06/24/02 11:12 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Hmm, I just watched the film, and I must say it was a great dissapointment. It was of course quite a horrorshow peice on its oddy knocky, but compared to the book... Well, the book tolchocks the cal out of the film any old way you viddy it.


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Invisiblephrozendata
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #700996 - 06/25/02 05:05 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

What's it going to be then, eh?


--------------------
"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #701379 - 06/25/02 07:19 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Well, I don't know.

I think Stanley Kubrick fucked it up quite bad, and I wouldn't blame Anthony Burgess for ranting quite a lot more than he did in that introduction in A Clockwork Orange.

Some of the scenes were quite hilarious, and indeed brilliant, but on the whole... he did a naughty naughty thing he did.


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Invisiblephrozendata
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #702926 - 06/26/02 04:22 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

"No time for the ole in-out in-out...i've just come to check the meter!"


--------------------
"There's only one corner of the universe you can be certain of improving and that's your own self. So you have to begin there, not
outside, not on other people" - Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleUlysees
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: phrozendata]
    #705066 - 06/27/02 10:46 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

lol


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Offlinegnrm23
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Re: A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess [Re: Ulysees]
    #705791 - 06/27/02 04:09 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

anyone for some snythemesc at the milk bar?
then maybe out for a bit o' the old ultraviolence, eh me droogies?


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


Edited by gnrm23 (06/27/02 04:11 PM)


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