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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes!
    #6505988 -

Alright so we all know that black holes exist. Well where the fuck does that matter that gets sucked in go? Does it just simply get condensed into it's incredibly unimaginably dense center, NO! It actually gets put in another Universe where the black hole that it just got sucked in doesn't exist, which means there's billions of other universes. Which makes me think, that show sliders got it right! Any opinions or objections. By the way that theory, I'm pretty sure hasen't been misproven.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Rylmonkey]
    #6506046 -

I think Stephen jumped the ball on this one...

He was under pressure because he had said he would figure out where the missing matter goes. He comes up with this, a cop-out if I've ever seen one!

By resting his theory upon an untestable "theory" - that there are infinite number of universes - he leaves the brunt of the work to future scientists.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: trendal]
    #6506185 -

yeh good point trendal. He's fucked.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Rylmonkey]
    #6507503 -

That would be so exciting if it were true tho.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Disco Cat]
    #6508902 -

either way thats how i wanna die, be sucked into a black hole. why not? i think thatd be some crazy shit

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6510676 -

just give my ex wife a call  :goatse:

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Rylmonkey]
    #6511928 -

i thought it was a singularity because gravity and time stop at that point?

To say it gets sucked into another universe is jumping ahead of yourself. it could just as easily be spewed back out somewhere within this universe?

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Rylmonkey]
    #6511978 -

I don't know how hard his theory is (probably not too hard or yall wouldn't be complaining) but if you do THIS:

Quote:
Well where the fuck does that matter that gets sucked in go? Does it just simply get condensed into it's incredibly unimaginably dense center, NO! It actually gets put in another Universe where the black hole that it just got sucked in doesn't exist


on a massive scale then what he is describing, on the other end, is a Big Bang.

An interesting and elegant thought, that remnants of an old universe (black holes) may actually be pulling in the rubble to birth a new universe.

Now that we're speculating, a most elegant procedure would be that once a black hole passes a certain magnitude, it flings itself into a new universe, as a big bang.


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Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Rylmonkey]
    #6511988 -

I am by no means an expert in this field, but I read a few months ago that once the Large Hadron collider is built at CERN they may know more about this subject. As I understand it if the collisions produce tiny black holes (which some scientists think is very possible) then that would confirm the alternate universe theory.

The collider is scheduled to come online this year.

Maybe someone can confirm or clarify this?


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“The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought.”  -- Rudiger Dornbusch

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: zorbman]
    #6512670 -

Isn't having a "tiny black hole" kind of like being "a little pregnant"?


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: zorbman]
    #6512724 -

Yeah CERN is expected to produce a lot of miniature black holes. They are so tiny they "evaporate" almost as soon as they are formed.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #6515472 -

Despite its tremendous density, there is such a thing as the absolute mass of a black hole.

A black hole can have an absolute mass of a femtogram, or of a billion solar masses.

I don't like the idea of creating black holes here on earth, no matter how tiny. People say tiny black holes pose no danger, but that is nothing more than an extremely probable guess. They are betting the entirety of the Life of Earth that it is harmless.
What if it's not?

What if evaporation of such a tiny black hole involves release of say a Planck unit of energy? What if it causes some kind of rip in its immediate surroundings that gives rise to some of the Gamma Ray Bursts we're picking up? What if they don't evaporate AT ALL and suck up the earth, then the solar system, then Proxima and Alpha Centauri and so on? What if two of these tiny black holes fall into eachother, reaching by acceleration speeds/energy levels that can only be measured in biblical units, and one of the two holes evaporates before the two fuse into one, can the LHC's containment withstand a black hole flung at it at a zillion electronvolts? Perhaps the Large Hadron Collider is the precursor phase to a matter implosion weapon some alien races use, the ones who actually listened to Greenpeace and didn't test it on their only homeworld.

What if black holes in fact are a kind of "stargates" like Hawkings speculates and one of our tiny holes farts out a gas giant before expiring?

What if such a tiny black hole sucks up a kilo of matter from the Hedron Collider, before returning it back to us as pure energy. It could help solve the energy crisis, but tell that to the plasma scientists who get reduced to scientist plasma in the process. Three megatons is a lot of zap.

For all we know the good folks of the Sirius solar system will launch a pre-emptive strike and drop an antimatter bomb on the Collider before it becomes operational, just like Israel is considering with the Iranian nuclear program, because they don't fancy the idea of an active black hole a couple of parsecs from their homeworld.

Or the most romantic way to go: what if the Large Hedron Collider triggers a Big Bang event - initiating a new universe, or perhaps our own, making us the God of our own Universe in a magnificent paradox. Perhaps, by some temporal twist, the Big Bang that created our universe occurs on December 5, 2007, which makes us both live in the end times, as well as the center of the universe :heart:

If it births a new universe, or makes our universe possible, by all means blow up the world, but let's not risk that for a scientific oopsie, which absolutely IS a possibility because we build the damn thing, among other things, to find out what black holes do by actually making them.

It's safe thay say! The black holes will evaporate immediately.
Umm excuse me, with my limited knowledge I know that black holes exist in a temporal/dimensional zone of their own. I also know there are a hundred theories on time and space within a black hole system, and that many are conflicting. Perhaps tiny black holes evaporate immediately were it not for the distortion of time and space surrounding them. That little extra symbol on the blackboard changes the entire equasion and such an oopsie may kill us.

We shouldn't mess with real black holes until we understand the Universe a million times better than we do now. Or, in other words, we shouldn't do this within the next 50 years from now.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

Edited by Asante (01/31/07 08:35 AM)

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: trendal]
    #6515532 -

trendal said:
Yeah CERN is expected to produce a lot of miniature black holes. They are so tiny they "evaporate" almost as soon as they are formed.


Is it String theory that predicts this?

@W_S:
If CERN can produce these tiny black holes, wouldn't that mean that tiny black holes are created everywhere in high energy environments, like the sun? I think the same high energy collisions would occur in the sun (or even in our atmosphere), but I really don't know.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Annom]
    #6515550 -

Quote:
If CERN can produce these tiny black holes, wouldn't that mean that tiny black holes are created everywhere in high energy environments, like the sun? I think the same high energy collisions would occur in the sun (or even in our atmosphere), but I really don't know.




They say that the same black holes are formed during supernova explosions (that's not too comforting :wink:) but perhaps supernova explosions have reaction conditions that immediately dissolve these black holes, fling them into another dimension or otherwise dispose of them.

The circumstances in which we make these black holes under are unique. There are electromagnetic fields involved, and we'll be doing this surrounded by molecular matter of peculiar composition, in the presence of metal cables under the extreme electron flux of high voltage. 
The experimental conditions will be unique.

It is important to realize that we have NO certainties in nothing. All we have is blind guesswork, educated hunches and extremely educated guesswork. Science holds no rocksolid truths, it is a system of interpretation and prediction created by a monkey barely smart enough to knock a banana off a tree with a stick.

Science is based on observation, observation by our five senses. We don't know what is feeding our senses and how it relates to an "ultimate reality" which might not exist.

What we do assume however is that black holes are the single most destructive force in the universe, completely in a class and magnitude of its own, which even Hawkings loudly admits we know jack shit about, if you soften him up with half a bottle of Jim Beam at a nightclub.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

Edited by Asante (01/31/07 08:54 AM)

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Asante]
    #6515565 -

Quote:
They say that the same black holes are formed during supernova explosions (that's not too comforting :wink:) but perhaps supernova explosions have reaction conditions that immediately dissolve these black holes, fling them into another dimension or otherwise dispose of them.


I just read this: "CERN spokesman and former research physicist James Gillies also pointed out that Earth is bathed with cosmic rays powerful enough to create black holes all the time, and the planet hasn't been destroyed yet." here: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14923900/

Quote:
It is important to realize that we have NO certainties in nothing. All we have is blind guesswork, educated hunches and extremely educated guesswork. Science holds no rocksolid truths, it is a system of interpretation and prediction created by a monkey barely smart enough to knock a banana off a tree with a stick.

Science is based on observation, observation by our five senses. We don't know what is feeding our senses and how it relates to an "ultimate reality" which might not exist.


True, but does that mean that we shouldn't experiment with energy and matter altogether?

From that point of view it was already dangerous when we build the first particle accelerators because we were never sure what would happen.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Annom]
    #6515597 -

Quote:
"CERN spokesman and former research physicist James Gillies also pointed out that Earth is bathed with cosmic rays powerful enough to create black holes all the time, and the planet hasn't been destroyed yet."






Quote:
True, but does that mean that we shouldn't experiment with energy and matter altogether?
.
From that point of view it was already dangerous when we build the first particle accelerators because we were never sure what would happen.



We should experiment to our heart's desire, but I think it is too early to experiment with things that may generate black holes under unique circumstances.

6 billion dollars and the world has fresh drinking water.
Fusion energy is just out of reach while we poison the earth.
We need to take to the skies and conquer the planets of our solar system, and live amongst the stars as a species of trillions.

We've got other priorities I think. It's a tad too early for black holes, there are technological challenges aplenty.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Asante]
    #6515601 -

:lol: Mohammed....

I have to agree that the money is better spend on "other" world problems.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: Asante]
    #6515603 -

What if the creation of black holes leads to a new energy source even greater than fusion?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: trendal]
    #6515616 -

trendal said:
What if the creation of black holes leads to a new energy source even greater than fusion?


Yeah, I was also thinking about positive unknown effects of the experiments. If we don't know anything for sure, we also don't know if the unknown will be positive or negative for us.

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Re: ? about steven hawkings new theory about B holes! [Re: trendal]
    #6515724 -

Quote:
What if the creation of black holes leads to a new energy source even greater than fusion?


Then it will wait for use to get there like it did since the Big Bang.






The dazzling light in the background isn't a photographic failure but caused by the friction generated by the earth being compressed into the size of a pea. :crazy:


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
personal empowerment for the world

:nyan: LGBT - Love God Before Tradition :nyan:

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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