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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con...
    #4731221 - 09/29/05 01:21 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

this is sort of a devils' advocate thread...it is now a forgone conclusion that the roberts SCOTUS will effectively revoke the right of the accused to a trial-by-jury under the pretext of national security...and my hunch (and this is strictly a hunch) is that most voters dont view this as such a great loss.. let alone the 77% of the senate which plans to vote for roberts...why this is the case brings us back to the title of the thread ..

cons ..

1) the said voters have come to believe that the legal system is too easy on criminals..at the expense of the taxpayers and to the benefit of both defense and prosecuting attorneys...mandatory sentancing laws meant to correct this situation have instead become a vehicle for criminal extortion at the hands of prosecutors...

2) the same majority also believes that life imprisonment at hard labour is the only fair punishment for anyone that would dare put so much as one toe out of line...

3) aquittals are rare in practice..and an aquittal does not mean that the accused was innocent...

pros ..

from a taxpayer perspective..the democratic legal system is a dead loss...however ..

1) removing that cost might make the streets even more dangerous..since the threat to the individuals' safety formerly posed by criminals would only be replaced by the threat posed by the government...i dont have to prove to anyone that the ppl who would be making the decisions as to who to disappear next simply cannot be trusted to make those decisions rationally..irregardless of their technical credentials..because ..

2) the door is left wide open to taking arbitrary action against large #s of ppl (who would inevitably be mostly women and minorities) so that private comercial interests can exploit them as convict slave labour ("convict" is incorrect..since there was no trial)...there are historical precedents for that too..so the idea is nothing new...and it is foolish to assume that it cant happen here...

3) if you happen to be one of the victims..your fate will be the same as it would had you been attacked by a violent criminal...in other words..bush is to that criminal what wal-mart is to the corner drugstore...

con ..

try telling that to a loyal wal-mart customer...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


Edited by Annapurna1 (09/29/05 05:08 PM)


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OfflinePhred
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4731415 - 09/29/05 01:54 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

it is now a forgone conclusion that the roberts SCOTUS will effectively revoke the right of the accused to a trial-by-jury under the pretext of national security...




Which case is this you refer to? When is it scheduled to be heard? Who other than yourself deems it a "foregone conclusion" that the court will rule a certain way?




Phred


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4731444 - 09/29/05 01:58 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

One of the problems I see with it is that a group of normal people can be swayed strongly by a fact-weak but very emotional case brought forward by a prosecutor.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Phred]
    #4731477 - 09/29/05 02:04 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

i think that the key case on this issue will be hanft v padilla (text of decision from 4th circuit court to be appealed to the SCOTUS)...however..the topic of the thread is the merits of trial-by-jury and not whether or not the SCOTUS will actually revoke it...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Redstorm]
    #4731485 - 09/29/05 02:05 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
One of the problems I see with it is that a group of normal people can be swayed strongly by a fact-weak but very emotional case brought forward by a prosecutor.




thats true..but a police state obviously wont solve that problem either...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4731668 - 09/29/05 02:55 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Don't get me wrong. I believe trial by jury is the way to go. I was just stating one problem with it to add to your list.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: trial-by-jury ..cons..pros..& con... [Re: Redstorm]
    #4735344 - 09/30/05 07:52 AM (11 years, 2 months ago)

so then how do you answer to those majority taxpayers that want a refund on the legal system?...i dont agree with military detention either..but its very difficult to argue against that crowd..especially when their much less able to afford it...


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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