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Offlinemachineelf368
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Vico and Surfing Finnegan's Wake
    #1280167 - 02/05/03 04:22 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

I'm listening right now to an over two hour talk the good Terence Mckenna gave about the book Finnegan's Wake. He says it's (one of) the most psychedelic book in literary history. It's also quite eschatological, and it deals with the concept of the time wave and historical repitition, similar to the philosophy of Ludwig Vico and the I Ching.

McK talks about historical repetition, and I find this idea fascinating, which is why I'm putting this in SPS instead of the Literature forum. He says something like "In the time it takes you to vacuum your apartment Rome has fallen nine times an hour, and your job is to notice...In the course of a day I live the entirety of human civilazation...The co-presence of history...we're imprisonned inside the linear notion of time..."

So does anyone have any experience with Vico or Joyce? All I know of Ludwig Vico is from the excellent article by Verene, D. P. (2002). Coincidence, historical repetition, and self-knowledge: Jung, Vico, and Joyce. Society of Analytical Psychology, 47, 459-478.

I wrote a little about this idea in relation to the I Ching in another thread, but I don't remember where or when. The I Ching, for example, says there are 64 events that can happen in this world, and 36 variations or permutations of each of those 64 events. All of human history is merely the repetition of these events, it's all "variation on a theme", if you will. Vico, in his book The New Science determines about 100 such events, having no knowledge of the I Ching, and Vico says that all of history is the repetition of these original 100 patterns. If I fight with my father it turns into the archetypal struggle of Every Son fighting with Their Father. If I compete with a colleage for a promotion, it's the Struggle For Social Dominance that has been going on since before time.

I won't even pretend to say that I've actually read Finnegan's Wake, I don't have about 6 months of my time which I can devote to it's 300-400 pages right now. For those of us without access the Verene article, I'm quoting a bit:
"Vico's New Science allows us to situate the psychological principle of synchronicity within a metaphysics of history and the self, such that the self encounters itself in the repetitions of history...Joyce allows his reader to see how acausality is at the very basis of human activity and language...What occurs naturally to the mind in the examples of synchronicity mentioned earlier is deliberately induced by the use of the I Ching."

So, thoughts, comments? Anyone actually read the whole book Finnegan's Wake? That in itself must be quite an accomplishment!
-m


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(the above was deciphered from phi (~1.62) using an advanced alphanumeric conversion algorhythm and should not be perceived as meaningful.)


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Offline3eyedgod
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Re: Vico and Surfing Finnegan's Wake [Re: machineelf368]
    #1282066 - 02/05/03 03:12 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

It would take u 6 months to read 300-400 pages? Better be some small print.


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Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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Offlinemachineelf368
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Re: Vico and Surfing Finnegan's Wake [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1282896 - 02/05/03 07:33 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Joyce makes up words all the time. Most of the sentences in it are double, triple or even quadruple ontondras (phonetic spelling, how do you spell that word?) Here's a brief excerpt:

Our wholemole millwheeling vicociclometer, a tetradomational gazebocroticon (the 'Mamma Lujah' known to every schoolboy scandaller, be he Marry, Marky, Lukey or John-a-Donk), autokinatonetically preprovided with a clappercoupling smeltingworks exprogressive process, (for the farmer, his son and their homely codes, known as eggburst, eggblend, eggburial and hatch-as-hatch-can) receives through a portal vein the dialytically separated elements of precedent decomposition for the verypetpurpose of subsequent recombination so that the...

You see what it's like? I'm told that this passage provides a sample of his typical writing style and the concept fo the interconectedness of all things. Says Verene, "The reader is placed in the position of attempting to make sense of connections and associations that are beyond common sense or literary convention."

Strangely enough, I came today upon a series of events of incredible coincidence, things which it would be easier for me to explain as synchronicity rather than random chance. History repeats itself, sometimes in the same day. Weird stuff.
-m


--------------------
(the above was deciphered from phi (~1.62) using an advanced alphanumeric conversion algorhythm and should not be perceived as meaningful.)


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Amazon Shop: Terrence McKenna

General Interest >> Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology

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