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has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA?
    #10250439 -

think of the ramifications if this were truth? 

I think maybe that all creative thoughts are figments of memory, I mean how can you create something that exists completely outside of your experience?


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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250457 -

'new'?
I thought this had been researched back in the 50's, found to be false.


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You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250483 -

I watched the most amazing documentary once about heart transplants.

People recieving transplant hearts take on the memories of the deceased, even with NO information, clear vivid dreams and thoughts about that persons past.

This old lady got a heart from a young (20yo) motorcycle rider, started instantly having fucked up motorcycle thoughts/dreams that were found to be VERY accurate of the deceased persons life.

These people (by law) never knew ANYTHING about their donors.

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Doc_T]
    #10250503 -

The DNA in one cell stretches out about 3 meters. If you put all the DNA in all of the cells in one body together, it would be long enough to go to the sun and back 70 times.

I highly doubt memories embed themselves in DNA: your DNA would be constantly changing in your brain, and even if they did it wouldn't be passed on to your offspring.


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"I have sworn upon the altar of god eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man" - Thomas Jefferson

Legalize Meth | Drug War Victims

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250510 -

Uhhh, as far as I know there has been no evidence for that.

Do you have memories of your parents' childhood?

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Green_T]
    #10250541 -

Green_T said:
The DNA in one cell stretches out about 3 meters. If you put all the DNA in all of the cells in one body together, it would be long enough to go to the sun and back 70 times.

I highly doubt memories embed themselves in DNA: your DNA would be constantly changing in your brain, and even if they did it wouldn't be passed on to your offspring.


you make a great point.  over time your dna would change.  I wonder though, is that why when you get a dna test to establish parental lineage they always say 99 percent certain, and not a hundred. perhaps there is a small change from one to the next?


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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Gumby]
    #10250554 -

no, but there are certain things I do that make me an obvious son of my father even though he was not around to exact an influence over my development.  People say we move and carry ourselves exactly alike.  is that cause his style obviously led him to coital success?


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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250604 -

Your DNA does change slightly through out your lifetime. Mutations are the basis of evolution.

Here is link
DNA and Evolution

I don't know about memories being stored or pass on in humans, but I have heard that meal worms can learn things by eating other worms.


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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: mushrume man]
    #10250635 -

mushrume man said:
Your DNA does change slightly through out your lifetime. Mutations are the basis of evolution.

Here is link
DNA and Evolution

I don't know about memories being stored or pass on in humans, but I have heard that meal worms can learn things by eating other worms.



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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250685 -

memory isnt stored in DNA. Memory is made up of a series of neural connections.  i dont see how DNA could have anything to do with that.


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Kick is seeing things from a special angle. Kick is momentary freedom from the claims of the aging, cautious, nagging, frightened flesh. Maybe I will find in yage what I was looking for in junk and weed and coke. Yage may be the final fix.
                         
                                              ~William S. Burroughs

Edited by StaleShrooms (04/28/09 04:49 PM)

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: StaleShrooms]
    #10250695 -

really I thought they were still unsure where in the brain it was stored.  They know what area is activated when your are actively engaged in remembering, but I thought the file cabinet so to speak was still a mystery.


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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250701 -

Statisticons_win said:
really I thought they were still unsure where in the brain it was stored.  They know what area is activated when your are actively engaged in remembering, but I thought the file cabinet so to speak was still a mystery.


memory is stored literally all over. there are areas with more concentrations of memory pathways, but generally no one function of the brain is localized to one specific point


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Kick is seeing things from a special angle. Kick is momentary freedom from the claims of the aging, cautious, nagging, frightened flesh. Maybe I will find in yage what I was looking for in junk and weed and coke. Yage may be the final fix.
                         
                                              ~William S. Burroughs

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250754 -

the hippocampus is largely responsible for memory retrieval, i don't think it holds all of our memories though. as shown by phinneus guage and other famous cases it seems more probable that different types of memories and personality traits are stored in different parts of the brain.

there is some talk about dna storing memories (ie, the collective unconscious as termed by freud) in my neuropsych classes, but it's not the type of memory you're thinking of. these theories tend to make a distinction between natural instincts and higher intelligence. there is a lot of evidence to show that basic instincts are present in babies only a few months old, so those "memories" and instincts must be contained somewhere within our genetic makeup. there is no quantifiable evidence showing that higher intelligence can be passed on by DNA though. academic potential, maybe, but actual memories, no.

and if you look at feral/isolated children, it is clear that they don't receive any kinds of higher memories from DNA. otherwise, they'd be able to learn basic concepts like language and all of that despite the fact that they were isolated completely, right?

Edited by justin_thyme (04/28/09 05:01 PM)

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: JT]
    #10250784 -

justin_thyme said:
the hippocampus is largely responsible for memory retrieval, i don't think it holds all of our memories though. as shown by phinneus guage and other famous cases it seems more probable that different types of memories and personality traits are stored in different parts of the brain.

there is some talk about dna storing memories (ie, the collective unconscious as termed by freud) in my neuropsych classes, but it's not the type of memory you're thinking of. these theories tend to make a distinction between natural instincts and higher intelligence. there is a lot of evidence to show that basic instincts are present in babies only a few months old, so those "memories" and instincts must be contained somewhere within our genetic makeup. there is no quantifiable evidence showing that higher intelligence can be passed on by DNA though. academic potential, maybe, but actual memories, no.

and if you look at feral/isolated children, it is clear that they don't receive any kinds of higher memories from DNA. otherwise, they'd be able to learn basic concepts like language and all of that despite the fact that they were isolated completely, right?


ohhh collective unconcious kinda memory yeah. that would be stored in DNA (if you believe in that sort of thing)

But phinneus guage took a rod through his frontal lobe, not his hippocampus right? i thought all that changed was his personality? he didnt get any amnesia did he?


--------------------
Kick is seeing things from a special angle. Kick is momentary freedom from the claims of the aging, cautious, nagging, frightened flesh. Maybe I will find in yage what I was looking for in junk and weed and coke. Yage may be the final fix.
                         
                                              ~William S. Burroughs

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Statisticons_win]
    #10250792 -

Im surprised nobody mentioned Lemarckism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamarckism

Its basically a synonym for a failed hypothesis in modern biology culture; but a hundred years ago it was still considered.

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: DieCommie]
    #10250811 -

Qubit said:
Im surprised nobody mentioned Lemarckism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamarckism

Its basically a synonym for a failed hypothesis in modern biology culture; but a hundred years ago it was still considered.


wow. i woulda thought that'd get disproved like...a long time ago.  isnt it fairly obvious (if only through observation) that if you lose a finger, you're kids will still have ten fingers?


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Kick is seeing things from a special angle. Kick is momentary freedom from the claims of the aging, cautious, nagging, frightened flesh. Maybe I will find in yage what I was looking for in junk and weed and coke. Yage may be the final fix.
                         
                                              ~William S. Burroughs

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: DieCommie]
    #10250837 -

This is a theory made by Carl Jung, we just learned about this in Psych a few months ago, the word is called
"Archetypes" - Memories that are buried in our blood all the way back to prehistoric eras
it is a the 3rd stage of Jungs "Psyche" 

They used this theory in the game "Assasins Creed" by using a machine called an "Animus" to dive into the subjects ancestors memory.
In real terms though, a girl's "Animus" is the "guy" side of them, kind of hard to explain if you don't take the class, real interesting stuff though we saw a video (recreation) of him sipping some crazy fucking mushroom stew by some tribal people and then he tripped balls and woke up with blood all over himself and saw his ancestors eating a dead animal corpse, it's really hard to put in to context, this thread is vary vary interesting though :smile:


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the bigger your pupils are, the more you see... right?

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: StaleShrooms]
    #10250855 -

StaleShrooms said:
ohhh collective unconcious kinda memory yeah. that would be stored in DNA (if you believe in that sort of thing)

But phinneus guage took a rod through his frontal lobe, not his hippocampus right? i thought all that changed was his personality? he didnt get any amnesia did he?



depends on how you define a "memory"

i'd say that your personality is your most important memory. it defines you as a person. phinneus guage didn't forget where he was born, who his parents were, or his best friend's names... but forgot who he was.

he suffered from a lot of trauma, mood swings, cluster head aches, and other symptoms too.

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Zefiron]
    #10250879 -

justin_thyme said:
StaleShrooms said:
ohhh collective unconcious kinda memory yeah. that would be stored in DNA (if you believe in that sort of thing)

But phinneus guage took a rod through his frontal lobe, not his hippocampus right? i thought all that changed was his personality? he didnt get any amnesia did he?



depends on how you define a "memory"

i'd say that your personality is your most important memory. it defines you as a person. phinneus guage didn't forget where he was born, who his parents were, or his best friend's names... but forgot who he was.

he suffered from a lot of trauma, mood swings, cluster head aches, and other symptoms too.


thats why i used the term amnesia instead of memory. from a technical standpoint, your personality isnt memory. although i hear what you're saying.
Zefiron said:
This is a theory made by Carl Jung, we just learned about this in Psych a few months ago, the word is called
"Archetypes" - Memories that are buried in our blood all the way back to prehistoric eras
it is a the 3rd stage of Jungs "Psyche" 

They used this theory in the game "Assasins Creed" by using a machine called an "Animus" to dive into the subjects ancestors memory.
In real terms though, a girl's "Animus" is the "guy" side of them, kind of hard to explain if you don't take the class, real interesting stuff though we saw a video (recreation) of him sipping some crazy fucking mushroom stew by some tribal people and then he tripped balls and woke up with blood all over himself and saw his ancestors eating a dead animal corpse, it's really hard to put in to context, this thread is vary vary interesting though :smile:


yeah, its a pretty interesting theory, but its been pretty much disproven.


--------------------
Kick is seeing things from a special angle. Kick is momentary freedom from the claims of the aging, cautious, nagging, frightened flesh. Maybe I will find in yage what I was looking for in junk and weed and coke. Yage may be the final fix.
                         
                                              ~William S. Burroughs

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Re: has anyone heard the school of thought that believes that memories embed themselves in DNA? [Re: Zefiron]
    #10251013 -

what if it was stored in your blood but rather in the dna, rna the is specific to your brain.  after all memories are stored as a sort of light, atleast that is what theyt hink when we remember somehting.  So, what if the lite imperceptibly altered dna/rna in the brain?


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