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OfflineMXNR
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Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL!
    #3671849 - 01/24/05 12:41 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Hey All,

Let's assume a hypothetical: It is the year 2007 of our lord. In addition to the previous restrictions on civil liberties passed by the 2000-2004 Bush administration/federal government, the PATRIOT ACT 2 (visit http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/SafeandFree.cfm?ID=12161&c=206 for a better understanding) has been passed and the "War on Terror" rages on greater than ever under the 2004-2008 Bush administration/federal government.

At this state in time, the U.S. populace has become aware of an, ever-growing faction of rebels based domestically that are taking regular acts of violence, sabotage, and strategic destruction in hopes of dismantling the system and, in their eyes, restoring true freedom to the old red, white, and blue. The Media/Federal government, of course label these as acts of terrorism against the United States and declare that anyone dealing with these people, will be considered terrorists themselves under the eyes of the law.

This is the setting for my question. Assuming you were alive during this time period, I'm interested to see the degree to which Shroomites would be interested/take part in the rebellion.
How interested would you be in the Rebellion?
You may choose only one
Extremely Interested! I would join the ranks and risk my life. What life could be greater than one fighting for what is good? Viva la revolution! You are a Freedom Fighter.
Very Interested. I would read up on the rebellion as much as I could. I may house/aid rebels, but I'm not risking my life. You are a Rebel Sympathizer.
Interested . I would investigate deeper than the propaganda headlines, maybe talk to some sympathizers but I'm not interested in getting in trouble. You are an Eager Observer.
Not interested. I will only live 70 years, why should I trouble myself with such things? I have cable, an XBOX, and a girlfriend and I am satisfied. You are an Average Joe.
Disgusted! I would never tolerate an affront to my president and my government! My grandfather fought for this flag, no way am I going to let a bunch of thieves steal the glory of this country! Down with the terrorists! You are a Loyalist.


Votes accepted from (01/24/05 12:39 PM) to (No end specified)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll



--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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Invisiblevampirism
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Posts: 8,120
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: MXNR]
    #3671870 - 01/24/05 12:49 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I voted disgusted. Your poll is VERY biased however.

"You say you want a revolution
Well you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well you know
We all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know you can count me out"


To explain more rationally,
"Peace will not come out of the clash of arms, but out of the justice lived and done by unarmed nations in the face of odds."
-Gandhi


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OfflineMXNR
Did the Mushroom choose you?
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 406
Loc: MARS
Last seen: 6 months, 18 days
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: vampirism]
    #3671877 - 01/24/05 12:52 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Hey Morrowind,

I understand my voice may come out through the poll, but how do you feel it is biased? I started at a baseline and proceeded two options up and two options down. Help a guy out.

Thanks


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


Edited by MXNR (01/24/05 12:52 PM)


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OfflinePhishgrrl
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: MXNR]
    #3671899 - 01/24/05 12:56 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

very interested. I do not think fighting fire with fire is the answer. I do however think subversive tactics and intense discussion with EVERYONE is key.


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...



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OfflineFreeLaws1_6
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Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 427
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: MXNR]
    #3671900 - 01/24/05 12:56 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

On with the Rebellion!! Fuck bush and the media/federal gov (excellent description of the government by the way!)! Freedom!

I hope whoever voted as a Loyalist truly checks out that link mxnr gave! If you believe the lies the gov/media tells you are unfortunately blind...similar to a blind black man caught up and cheering in a KKK parade because he hears the words "freedom" in the chants!

http://killsometime.com/humor/humor.asp?humor=Pentagon-911-Conspiracy#Main

Oh, and I voted as a rebel sympathizer. I believe it is important to fight but I myself am not a supporter of me getting hurt, arrested, or in trouble. I know this may seem cowardice, it is a strange predicament. But my theory, if I do not exist than nothing exists. Also, if my freedom is directly restricted (as in if I'm in jail) then it was certainly not worth it. My plan- escape and find a place I can enact my own wills freely!

Please open your mind and eyes! we need all the help we can get to straighten this country/world out!


--------------------
Free Laws: Things to understand before I am Free

1. I am alone
2. There is Nothing
3. I must actualize myself
4. Sex is a tool for pleasure, not status
5. Dependency restricts me
6. Emotions are dangerous if not administered properly



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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: MXNR]
    #3671912 - 01/24/05 12:59 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Simply the reasoning behind it. The first words alone would be ok, but labelling all who are disgusted as loyalists and etc only promotes hate. At one point I would have gone with the first option and even liked the reasoning.. but then I looked around at the world and history.

Hate breeds hate and violence, violence only breeds violence and more hate. The peaceful path is far far more difficult to accomplish anything, but it's the only way. Coming from a family very hard hit by WW2, I find the call for revolution ridiculous, especially coming from cornfed middle-class America.


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OfflineFreeLaws1_6
No Hippy Here

Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 427
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Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: Phishgrrl]
    #3671914 - 01/24/05 01:00 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Phishgrrl said:
very interested. I do not think fighting fire with fire is the answer. I do however think subversive tactics and intense discussion with EVERYONE is key.




If only this was possible. But then if you COULD sit everyone down and chat about it...a tremendous percentage of the population is illogical and wouldn't listen to anything but their own greed and penis'. After all 90% of the US population is Theistic...Illogic reins supreme.


--------------------
Free Laws: Things to understand before I am Free

1. I am alone
2. There is Nothing
3. I must actualize myself
4. Sex is a tool for pleasure, not status
5. Dependency restricts me
6. Emotions are dangerous if not administered properly



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InvisibleHendostan
Male

Registered: 07/18/04
Posts: 4,441
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: FreeLaws1_6]
    #3671915 - 01/24/05 01:00 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

i lean more toward nonviolence in any circumstance, but there are times when revolutions must be fought. i'd definitely think about it and do what i could to help the movement.  :tongue2:
plus, there are places in the world who have it so much worse than we do...i'd rather go there and help them fight from their oppression. we have it easy, even with bush at the reigns.


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OfflineMXNR
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Registered: 07/20/04
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Last seen: 6 months, 18 days
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: vampirism]
    #3671931 - 01/24/05 01:04 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Hey Morrowind,

Quote:

Morrowind said:To explain more rationally,
"Peace will not come out of the clash of arms, but out of the justice lived and done by unarmed nations in the face of odds."
-Gandhi




I won't deal with your song quote, since it doesn't represent a piece of historical evidence, however your Gandhi quote Does represent a strategy of a movement. Granted, Gandhi did get results with his method of nonviolence, but I refer you to the history of the human race. Time and time again, history has taught us that FORCE DOES WORK. There is no cosmic justice or good, there are only 3D objects moving through space.

Just pick up a history text for examples of this point.


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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Invisiblevampirism
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Posts: 8,120
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: FreeLaws1_6]
    #3671932 - 01/24/05 01:04 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

all this call for revolution worries me. Communism was a people's revolution don't you know.. It saddens me that I will likely die at the either at the hands of stupid revolutionists or crazed fundamentalists.


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Invisiblenewusername222
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: Hendostan]
    #3671933 - 01/24/05 01:04 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Hendostan said:
there are places in the world who have it so much worse than we do...i'd rather go there and help them fight from their oppression.




sounds like Iraq.


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InvisibleHendostan
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Posts: 4,441
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: newusername222]
    #3671950 - 01/24/05 01:09 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

supernova said:
Quote:

Hendostan said:
there are places in the world who have it so much worse than we do...i'd rather go there and help them fight from their oppression.




sounds like Iraq.




i'm not talking militarily dude...i'd never ally myself with the u.s. government :lol: however, i think the genocide in darfur should get more attention than this weeks bushisms...media doesn't help much


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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: MXNR]
    #3671952 - 01/24/05 01:10 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

No. There has never been a single just war, and I stand by this remark as I can defend it. All force is corrupted in time. The problem with revolution is that it is led by idealists who are quickly fooled by people who know how to manipulate the masses.

You should look at history, at those people who gave your very same arguments, and see how their beautiful movements invariably turned into evil.


Quote:

there are only 3D objects moving through space.




This materialistic point of view is always the first step, before revolution, that leads to hate and misery. Like it or not, all human interaction is subjective. 3D objects do not exist outside of theory.

Quote:


I won't deal with your song quote, since it doesn't represent a piece of historical evidence



Incorrect. You fail to see the intellectual driving force behind this. Songs are not only beautiful, but also far better than historical evidence at influencing good thought. Historical evidence is easily bent to anyone's will, especially since history is written by the victor, in a very real and frightening way.


I know that nothing I say will dissuade you, but whatever..


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InvisibleHendostan
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: vampirism]
    #3671955 - 01/24/05 01:10 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Morrowind said:
all this call for revolution worries me. Communism was a people's revolution don't you know.. It saddens me that I will likely die at the either at the hands of stupid revolutionists or crazed fundamentalists.





america was also a people's revolution, if you believe in that kind of thing


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Invisiblenewusername222
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: Hendostan]
    #3671961 - 01/24/05 01:12 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

I hear ya. and the Media is the worst problem we have IMO.


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OfflineFreeLaws1_6
No Hippy Here

Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 427
Loc: Tejas
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: Hendostan]
    #3671964 - 01/24/05 01:12 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Hendostan said:
i lean more toward nonviolence in any circumstance, but there are times when revolutions must be fought. I'd definitely think about it and do what i could to help the movement.  :tongue2:
plus, there are places in the world who have it so much worse than we do...i'd rather go there and help them fight from their oppression. we have it easy, even with bush at the reigns.




No doubt fighting and hurting sucks...And I agree with you that sometimes revolutions need to happen. Or else we will be pushed around, similar to the kid getting lunch money taken from him. Talking to the bully all you want will not stop his force, unfortunately you may need to just pop him one. (not without trying the more peaceful and intellectual methods first though).

Of course there is always the forget the bully and get outta that town/school because your punch might not actually do a damn thing (especially if he's got brass knuckles and a crew of kids to jump you with..i hope my bully analogy is effectively illustrating the US/Bush) <- my choice.

**Oh and Hendostan, did you know the kid that got caught with the 23 lbs of mushies in Ohio? The article said he was from the same town as you (in a post this morning)**


--------------------
Free Laws: Things to understand before I am Free

1. I am alone
2. There is Nothing
3. I must actualize myself
4. Sex is a tool for pleasure, not status
5. Dependency restricts me
6. Emotions are dangerous if not administered properly



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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: Hendostan]
    #3671972 - 01/24/05 01:14 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

and look where it led. That revolution is basically why America has become a huge but un-unified entity. The civil war was because of the inconsistencies brought out by the revolutionary war. British imperialism has left a horrible mark everywhere in the world, America being among the most obvious.

Communism.. France's reign of terror.. Fascism.. these were all "people's" movements.


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InvisibleHendostan
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: FreeLaws1_6]
    #3671977 - 01/24/05 01:15 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

yeah, i noticed he was from here :frown: didn't recognize the name though.


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OfflineDigs
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: vampirism]
    #3671979 - 01/24/05 01:15 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

lol @ that poll

man that's some slanted shit heh

I vote none of them, I don't give a fuck and I don't own a xbox/tv :smile:


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OfflineMXNR
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Re: Would anyone fight? A Revolutionary POLL! [Re: vampirism]
    #3671983 - 01/24/05 01:17 PM (11 years, 10 months ago)

Hey guys,

Thanks to everyone thus far for helping me answer my question. I guess I'm not surprised to see that only a very small percentage would risk their life.

Morrowind, I don't know what I've said to suggest that nothing you can sway will dissuade me. On the contrary, i will adopt any belief which has the most evidence (chronicled observations) to support it. I believe at this point in time, that it has been shown more clearly that force is a very effective way to get things done than peaceful resistance. Granted, the people behind the force may be "evil" and corrupt able, but this is not the issue. If you can present more than one example of peaceful resistance being a more effective way than force, maybe you will begin the dissuasion.


--------------------
Master: Everyday change your clothes and eat your food and you will become enlightened.

Pupil: Master, I do not understand...

Master: If you don't understand, eat your food and change your clothes.


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