WAN said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

Europe's economic problems and decline isn't an opinion, it's a fact.  You see when there aren't enough jobs for the native populations, it makes no sense keeping and importing third world leeches in their homelands.

---

the problems our countries face will not go away if we just deported "third world leeches". There are structural problems that are in place regardless. While SOME aspects of immigration can be very harmful, it is not responsible for those structures.

---

Nobody is saying that third world immigrants are the cause of these things.  We are just saying that they exacerbate bad current situations and if they are removed, the problems will abate.  They won't go away completely, but at least they will relent.  And that's always a good thing.

---

qman said:

Many people don't even think there's a problem in the first place, when a thousand Africans and Muslims physically and sexually assault over 600 German citizens, many people said "so what?"

When Muslims committed terrorist acts in France and Belgium, many had nothing to say.

---

Quote:

Maybe the main reason you don't have any realistic "opinions" or solutions is because you don't see any problems other than the potential mistreatment of Muslims.

---

Quote:

what did Western policies do to make Muslims act like this?

---

WAN said:

Then we believe in different things.  I believe that every human deserves kind treatments and/or respect, till they prove otherwise.

---

qman said:

There's nothing wrong with people coming to your homelands IF there's work for them and they're willing to assimilate into that culture, none of those conditions exist for Muslims in the EU today for obvious reasons.

---

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Then we believe in different things.  I believe that every human deserves kind treatments and/or respect, till they prove otherwise.

---

except if they look foreign or different in a way you don't like?

---

WAN said:

Tipote said:

WAN said:

There is nothing wrong with ethnically pure states.  As a rule, people don't like "outsiders", aka those who are different from they are.  I bet if we do get ethnically pure states, we will see a huge reduction in hate crimes and terrorist acts.

---

can you not think of a single reason why ethnically pure states might be a problem??

---

They might still encounter some problems just like all states do, however at least there will be much less racial aggression, resentment, lower levels of hate crimes and terrorist acts.  In fact, a lot of arguments and disagreements in this thread would not have been had, if we had pure states.

What "problems" can you think of for ethnically pure states?

---

It is obvious that if you remove anyone who might be hated for ANY reason, you will have fewer hate crimes. Well done stating the bleeding obvious.

So do you think there would be no terrorism or hate crimes in a ethnically pure state? This is idiotic, WAN.

Do you think the government should stop people marrying foreigners and having mixed children? Will they be deported?

WAN said:

It shows that it is natural that people treat those with different looks as outsiders and foreigners.  I feel sorry for the fully integrated Muslims that they are treated as foreigners by their hosts but this is not the natives' fault.  They (the Muslims) should blame the countries' leaders for bringing them into countries where they just KNOW they are going to be looked at with suspicion.

---

so much

"muslims should blame the countries bringing them into countries where they know they will be looked at with suspicion"???


I dont even know how to address half on your fucking idiotic points. They hardly make any sense (i'm being generous).

I'm not sure what asian country you are from but say you are from China and there are Korean terror attacks against the US/EU and you get blamed for those attacks. You arent even Korean and even if you were it is nothing to do with you. It is the country you are from whos fault it is? Did they even send you to another country or did you move BY YOURSELF?

why do i waste my time with you?

Quote:

WAN said:

Quote:

What does "sympathiser of foreign elements" even mean??

---

Someone who sympathizes with foreigners, who defends them and who is an apologist for them.  Like you for one.

---

Youre a foreigner and I'm not defending you but I would if you were being attacked based on the fact that you are foreign. Foreigner just means someone from another place. Why should we not sympathise with people from other places? We are all humans, just because you make the divisions doesnt mean that we can't sympathise with those that are different from us. There are degenerates and geniuses in all countries as you clearly show.

WAN said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

Europe's economic problems and decline isn't an opinion, it's a fact.  You see when there aren't enough jobs for the native populations, it makes no sense keeping and importing third world leeches in their homelands.

---

the problems our countries face will not go away if we just deported "third world leeches". There are structural problems that are in place regardless. While SOME aspects of immigration can be very harmful, it is not responsible for those structures.

---

Nobody is saying that third world immigrants are the cause of these things.  We are just saying that they exacerbate bad current situations and if they are removed, the problems will abate.  They won't go away completely, but at least they will relent.  And that's always a good thing.

---

WAN said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

airclay said:

nope, I believe we should take a real look at how we respond to the acts socially and legally; at home and abroad to ensure that by responding to terrorism we are not creating more terrorism.

---

" ensure that by responding to terrorism we are not creating more terrorism"

How does "we" create terrorism?  We don't.

---

we create terrorism when we invade countries and then leave them in pieces. Failed states are an environment for terrorism to thrive. When we torture people, that fuels terrorism. When we deny people their rights, they fuels terrorism. When we drone strike civilians, that creates terrorism.

---

Who is this "we" that you speak of?  The citizen of EU countries?  I should hope not.  Truth is, all of those things you mentioned are the doings of the politicians and leaders of these European countries.  The citizens have very very little to do with them.  And it's like I said a few weeks before: the people should not have to suffer the bad consequences of their leaders' actions.

---

Yes OBVIOUSLY the fucking leaders, the military etc etc. But do you think they are completely disconnected? Citizens do support some of the rationalisations around abuses by our military!! It is citizens who join the military and commit abuses. Do you think the people abusing prisoners in Abu Ghraib didn't have some capacity for being a souless asshole regardless of the orders they got???????????

qman said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

"It's important to temper our responses and actions abroad"

I agree 100%, when Muslims in the EU blowup a airport in Belgium, the response should not be abroad, the response should be in the EU.

Terrorism in the EU is a European issue, it's NOT about ISIS, the fact that the terrorists have issues with geopolitical events in the ME doesn't give it credibility.

---

So what would your response be?

Terrorism in the EU cannot be separated from global affairs. That is just a fact.

---

My response would be a domestic operation that would start deporting the worse Muslims inside of the EU, if that didn't work a full blown deportation policy would be in place.

---

WAN said:

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Then we believe in different things.  I believe that every human deserves kind treatments and/or respect, till they prove otherwise.

---

except if they look foreign or different in a way you don't like?

---

It might be a surprise to you but in my daily dealings with third-world people (such as immigrants, refugees etc and there are a lot of them in my area), I treat them with kindness and respect.  However, this doesn't change my conviction that these people should not have been here in the first place.  Furthermore, we should not let in any more of them.

---

says an immigrant in the West.

WAN basically said:

yes I respect them but they are stupid and worth less as humans than me and shouldnt be here

---

Honestly, WAN, i think you are probably the stupidest person I have EVER spoken to. Your medal is in the post.

I would try as I have done in the past to question you in the hope you might realise the bullshit in what you say but I know from experience it just does NOT sink in.

Tipote said:

qman said:

Many people don't even think there's a problem in the first place, when a thousand Africans and Muslims physically and sexually assault over 600 German citizens, many people said "so what?"

When Muslims committed terrorist acts in France and Belgium, many had nothing to say.

---

WHO THE FUCK said "so what?"
Who do you think had no problem with those abuses? They have been condemned across the board.

Quote:

Maybe the main reason you don't have any realistic "opinions" or solutions is because you don't see any problems other than the potential mistreatment of Muslims.

---

There is nothing potential about it, first of all. Secondly, many of us on here who support accepting refugees do consistently acknowledge there are numerous problems involved. You are getting strawier and strawier, qman.

Quote:

what did Western policies do to make Muslims act like this?

---

Guess?!

Colonisation, division of the Middle East, backing of dictators, regime change, blind support for Israel colonisation, silence around massacres and other rights abuses, cozy oil and arms industry relationships for despots,  military invasion of Afghanistan, Mali, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, etc etc. Constant threats to invade Iran (pushed by Israel).

There is something called the Yinon Plan - it is a long held idea that for American and Israeli dominance in the region, all arab states must be divided up into small countries based on sectarian lines. Not only does this legitimise an ethnocratic "jewish" state but many weakened satellite states ensures dominance.

---

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Tipote said:

WAN said:

There is nothing wrong with ethnically pure states.  As a rule, people don't like "outsiders", aka those who are different from they are.  I bet if we do get ethnically pure states, we will see a huge reduction in hate crimes and terrorist acts.

---

can you not think of a single reason why ethnically pure states might be a problem??

---

They might still encounter some problems just like all states do, however at least there will be much less racial aggression, resentment, lower levels of hate crimes and terrorist acts.  In fact, a lot of arguments and disagreements in this thread would not have been had, if we had pure states.

What "problems" can you think of for ethnically pure states?

---

It is obvious that if you remove anyone who might be hated for ANY reason, you will have fewer hate crimes. Well done stating the bleeding obvious.

---

Tipote said:

qman said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

"It's important to temper our responses and actions abroad"

I agree 100%, when Muslims in the EU blowup a airport in Belgium, the response should not be abroad, the response should be in the EU.

Terrorism in the EU is a European issue, it's NOT about ISIS, the fact that the terrorists have issues with geopolitical events in the ME doesn't give it credibility.

---

So what would your response be?

Terrorism in the EU cannot be separated from global affairs. That is just a fact.

---

My response would be a domestic operation that would start deporting the worse Muslims inside of the EU, if that didn't work a full blown deportation policy would be in place.

---

So do you not foresee any problems with that operation? What criteria would you base the deportation of muslims on? Sounds like you would like a kind of thought-police system in place. It is your kind of thinking that will make that more and more possible and it won't only be used on muslims FYI.

---

qman said:

So with this line of reasoning, there's a never ending list of historic and present day reasons for terrorist mindset. 

Thank you for making it clear that the mindset NEVER has a chance of going away and that deportation is truly the only rational position to protect the EU homelands.

---

You base that on the idea that abuses have been and are being commited so they should continue???????

Here is a crazy idea.. why not STOP the abuses??

Addressing the present day abuses can stop history continuing the cycle. It will only get worse this way.

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Tipote said:

qman said:

Europe's economic problems and decline isn't an opinion, it's a fact.  You see when there aren't enough jobs for the native populations, it makes no sense keeping and importing third world leeches in their homelands.

---

the problems our countries face will not go away if we just deported "third world leeches". There are structural problems that are in place regardless. While SOME aspects of immigration can be very harmful, it is not responsible for those structures.

---

Nobody is saying that third world immigrants are the cause of these things.  We are just saying that they exacerbate bad current situations and if they are removed, the problems will abate.  They won't go away completely, but at least they will relent.  And that's always a good thing.

---

Then surely it makes more sense to actually address the underlying problems that are exacerbated by immigration and other things, instead of scapegoating immigrants who are not responsible?

---

qman said:

There's problems with every policy, but this one would have support from the native population.

---

Quote:

"more possible and it won't only be used on Muslims"

I disagree, it's a risk most natives would take to have their homelands back in their own hands.

---

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Tipote said:

WAN said:

Then we believe in different things.  I believe that every human deserves kind treatments and/or respect, till they prove otherwise.

---

except if they look foreign or different in a way you don't like?

---

It might be a surprise to you but in my daily dealings with third-world people (such as immigrants, refugees etc and there are a lot of them in my area), I treat them with kindness and respect.  However, this doesn't change my conviction that these people should not have been here in the first place.  Furthermore, we should not let in any more of them.

---

says an immigrant in the West.

---

WAN said:

Nobody is "blaming" the immigrants.  We are just recognizing the reality that they fuel the current bad situations and that if they are removed, things will improve.

Immigrants might not be the root cause but they do contribute to things.  surely you recognize this.

---

WAN said:

Also, I just want to point out that even though I am an immigrant, now I am also a citizen of a Western country.  As such, I care about the future of my new country and this might in part explain why I hold the positions I do regarding future immigrants.

---

Muslims in the EU, many of whom are citizens like you, do also care about their new country. In some cases its been their country for generations.

Youre like an illegal immigrant from Mexico who supports the Republican Party.

WAN said:

I never said third-worlers are "stupid" and "worth less as humans than me".  If you need to resort to twisting people's words and setting up strawman arguments in order to "win" a debate, maybe you should stop coming to message boards.

---

It was a paraphrasing notice that it said "WAN basically said:". You are worse than hostile universe. We have to hold your hand through everything because you struggle to understand the most basic concepts.

Tipote said:

qman said:

So with this line of reasoning, there's a never ending list of historic and present day reasons for terrorist mindset. 

Thank you for making it clear that the mindset NEVER has a chance of going away and that deportation is truly the only rational position to protect the EU homelands.

---

You base that on the idea that abuses have been and are being commited so they should continue???????

Here is a crazy idea.. why not STOP the abuses??

Addressing the present day abuses can stop history continuing the cycle. It will only get worse this way.

---