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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins] * 2
    #22931170 -

Nah dude, you're just arguing two different definitions of a word as if it's the same.

https://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/faith
Quote:
Definition of faith in English:
noun

1Complete trust or confidence in someone or something:
this restores one’s faith in politicians

2Strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.

2.1A system of religious belief:
the Christian faith

2.2A strongly held belief or theory:
the faith that life will expand until it fills the universe


you interchange the usage to suit your single post but as a whole what you're saying makes no sense


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

Edited by airclay (02/21/16 08:50 PM)

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Tipote]
    #22931205 -

Tipote said:
qman said:
The vast majority of EU citizens do NOT want more African's and Muslims in their countries, I don't buy the surveys which suggest otherwise. Either way, even the few that wanted to take in "refugees" have already changed their minds after seeing what is now happening to their towns and cities.

The governments forced this crazy policy down the EU citizens throats without their concern, after seeing the non-protests the leaders have already had a change of heart.

I will put it this way, there are very few Tip's walking around the EU today.


:lol: Almost everyone I know is ok with it. I've only seen 1 survey on this and it would be interesting to see some more. Have you seen some? What do you know of what EU citizens want? Have you even been to Europe?

My impression is that generally people are against completely uncontrolled immigration but are fine with citizens who integrate and that generally they would support refugees. When things like Cologne and the Paris attacks happen, the opinion probably changes quite quickly. And regardless of those events, refugee numbers are certainly seen as far too many in such a short space of time but I would say people generally are not against taking refugees.

People in the US I think have said in the majority that they shouldnt accept refugees. or that a third of people want refugees.

Its important to remember the history too. The US hated catholic immigration, they hated irish immigration, they hated Jewish immigration.

There were hundreds if not thousands of Jewish refugees from Nazi Germany denied entry and opinion polls said then that I think it was 2/3 who said NO. Many of those refugees were turned back and some of those ended up in the gas chambres. I'm not saying that Syrians are going to gas chambers exactly but that they are fleeing death from war and that even if its temporary, they should be given protection.



"Almost everyone I know is ok with it"

That hardly surprises me.

"Have you ever been to Europe?"

We have been over time many times.

"they hated Jewish immigration"

Maybe for very good reason.

At the end of the day, if the native population doesn't want the illegals or "refugees", it shouldn't be forced upon them, it makes no sense.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins] * 1
    #22931248 -

Shins said:
Quote:
Simple Definition of faith. : strong belief or trust in someone or something. 


You guys are just anti-religous to the point of ignorance


trust: Firm belief in the reliability, truth, or ability of someone or something.

belief: (belief in) Trust, faith, or confidence in (someone or something)

confidence:

1: The feeling or belief that one can have faith in or rely on someone or something:

1.1: The state of feeling certain about the truth of something:

1.2: A feeling of self-assurance arising from an appreciation of one’s own abilities or qualities

rely: 1: Depend on with full trust or confidence

feeling: 2: An idea or belief, especially a vague or irrational one:

idea: 1.2: An opinion or belief

opinion: 1: A view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge

fact: 1: A thing that is known or proved to be true:

knowledge: 1.3: True, justified belief; certain understanding, as opposed to opinion. (or the sum of knowledge, or factual knowledge, you get the idea)

understanding: 1: Perceive the intended meaning of (words, a language, or a speaker): 1.1: Perceive the significance, explanation, or cause of: 2: Interpret or view (something) in a particular way: 2.3: Assume to be the case; take for granted

assume: 1: Suppose to be the case, without proof

be the case: 1: Be so.

suppose: 1: Think or assume that something is true or probable but lack proof or certain knowledge:

certain: 1: Able to be firmly relied on to happen or be the case: 1.1: Having or showing complete conviction about something

conviction: 2: A firmly held belief or opinion

view: 3: A particular way of considering or regarding something; an attitude or opinion

attitude: 1: A settled way of thinking or feeling about something

thinking: 1.1: A person’s ideas or opinions -- think 1: Have a particular belief or idea: 2.6: Imagine or expect (an actual or possible situation)

expect: 1: Regard (something) as likely to happen: Require (something) as rightfully due or appropriate in the circumstances

imagine: 1: Form a mental image or concept of: 1.1: Believe (something unreal or untrue) to exist or be so: 2: Suppose or assume

consider: 1.2: Believe to be; think -- regard: 1: Consider or think of in a specified way

judgement: 1.1: An opinion or conclusion

conclusion: 1.1: The summing-up of an argument or text

Edited by akira_akuma (02/21/16 09:49 PM)

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: akira_akuma]
    #22931274 -

Yes and?

You can still have faith in something rational.

Sorry to break your worldview.


--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman] * 2
    #22931297 -

qman said:
Tipote said:
qman said:
The vast majority of EU citizens do NOT want more African's and Muslims in their countries, I don't buy the surveys which suggest otherwise. Either way, even the few that wanted to take in "refugees" have already changed their minds after seeing what is now happening to their towns and cities.

The governments forced this crazy policy down the EU citizens throats without their concern, after seeing the non-protests the leaders have already had a change of heart.

I will put it this way, there are very few Tip's walking around the EU today.


:lol: Almost everyone I know is ok with it. I've only seen 1 survey on this and it would be interesting to see some more. Have you seen some? What do you know of what EU citizens want? Have you even been to Europe?

My impression is that generally people are against completely uncontrolled immigration but are fine with citizens who integrate and that generally they would support refugees. When things like Cologne and the Paris attacks happen, the opinion probably changes quite quickly. And regardless of those events, refugee numbers are certainly seen as far too many in such a short space of time but I would say people generally are not against taking refugees.

People in the US I think have said in the majority that they shouldnt accept refugees. or that a third of people want refugees.

Its important to remember the history too. The US hated catholic immigration, they hated irish immigration, they hated Jewish immigration.

There were hundreds if not thousands of Jewish refugees from Nazi Germany denied entry and opinion polls said then that I think it was 2/3 who said NO. Many of those refugees were turned back and some of those ended up in the gas chambres. I'm not saying that Syrians are going to gas chambers exactly but that they are fleeing death from war and that even if its temporary, they should be given protection.



"Almost everyone I know is ok with it"

That hardly surprises me.

"Have you ever been to Europe?"

We have been over time many times.

"they hated Jewish immigration"

Maybe for very good reason.

At the end of the day, if the native population doesn't want the illegals or "refugees", it shouldn't be forced upon them, it makes no sense.



where is this sentiment when it's time to spread "democracy" in the form of occupation?


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins] * 4
    #22931306 -

Shins said:
Yes and?

You can still have faith in something rational.

Sorry to break your worldview.



your faith in your own rationality is fairly irrational faith.


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: airclay]
    #22931354 -

airclay said:
qman said:
Tipote said:
qman said:
The vast majority of EU citizens do NOT want more African's and Muslims in their countries, I don't buy the surveys which suggest otherwise. Either way, even the few that wanted to take in "refugees" have already changed their minds after seeing what is now happening to their towns and cities.

The governments forced this crazy policy down the EU citizens throats without their concern, after seeing the non-protests the leaders have already had a change of heart.

I will put it this way, there are very few Tip's walking around the EU today.


:lol: Almost everyone I know is ok with it. I've only seen 1 survey on this and it would be interesting to see some more. Have you seen some? What do you know of what EU citizens want? Have you even been to Europe?

My impression is that generally people are against completely uncontrolled immigration but are fine with citizens who integrate and that generally they would support refugees. When things like Cologne and the Paris attacks happen, the opinion probably changes quite quickly. And regardless of those events, refugee numbers are certainly seen as far too many in such a short space of time but I would say people generally are not against taking refugees.

People in the US I think have said in the majority that they shouldnt accept refugees. or that a third of people want refugees.

Its important to remember the history too. The US hated catholic immigration, they hated irish immigration, they hated Jewish immigration.

There were hundreds if not thousands of Jewish refugees from Nazi Germany denied entry and opinion polls said then that I think it was 2/3 who said NO. Many of those refugees were turned back and some of those ended up in the gas chambres. I'm not saying that Syrians are going to gas chambers exactly but that they are fleeing death from war and that even if its temporary, they should be given protection.



"Almost everyone I know is ok with it"

That hardly surprises me.

"Have you ever been to Europe?"

We have been over time many times.

"they hated Jewish immigration"

Maybe for very good reason.

At the end of the day, if the native population doesn't want the illegals or "refugees", it shouldn't be forced upon them, it makes no sense.



where is this sentiment when it's time to spread "democracy" in the form of occupation?


Sometimes out of sight is out of mind, if people oppose US military operations 5000 miles away from the homeland, there is little they can do to stop it.

That's different than millions of illegals flooding into the US or millions of Muslims flooding into the EU, these invaders become part of citizens everyday life, sometimes in a very bad way.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman]
    #22931401 -

why is it different? (using your terms here) we're talking about an outside population coming in and destabilizing your way of life. Is it different because in one scenario your privilege as a 1st world citizen is safe; being that it's "out of sight, out of mind" for you?


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22931407 -

you can have faith in your legs, but you can't have rational faith, because you simply can't rely on the faith that you have in your legs, because you simply can't have justified true belief any further about the fact that you have legs and that they may continue to work, which is a presupposition of knowledge, based on your judgement & the conclusion that you indeed have still working legs; thus no further requirement of anything faith-based.

this is not faith based.

faith, in principal, is irrational. ^

like so many things in life.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: airclay]
    #22931442 -

airclay said:
why is it different? (using your terms here) we're talking about an outside population coming in and destabilizing your way of life. Is it different because in one scenario your privilege as a 1st world citizen is safe; being that it's "out of sight, out of mind" for you?


I'm speaking in generalities when I say "out of sight, out of mind". I have followed politics for over 30 years, most of the general public is pretty ignorant of US foreign policy, that's why I say they are much more interested in domestic policy, it's only natural.

Why would you expect Joe Six-Pack to have the same interest and passion with US involvement in the ME relative to the daily life in the homeland?

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman]
    #22931454 -

because I work from a base that considers all people equals, you know the golden rule and the like :shrug:


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: airclay]
    #22931472 -

airclay said:
because I work from a base that considers all people equals, you know the golden rule and the like :shrug:


The average American is more concerned about their favorite TV show, video game, or restaurant.

If their child's school system has been flooded with a bunch of illegals, that has a DIRECT impact on their family's well-being, the US military and its actions overseas doesn't.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman] * 2
    #22931499 -

well it kinda does when you displace millions of people or well it should unless you live in a 1st world privilege bubble where your govt is free to fuck the rest of the world and it's none of your concern as long as it doesn't affect your immediate life.


--------------------
Give no fucks, take no orders, smash the prisons and the borders. Circle that A motherfucker!

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman] * 2
    #22931732 -

qman said:
airclay said:
because I work from a base that considers all people equals, you know the golden rule and the like :shrug:


The average American is more concerned about their favorite TV show, video game, or restaurant.

If their child's school system has been flooded with a bunch of illegals, that has a DIRECT impact on their family's well-being, the US military and its actions overseas doesn't.


I wish I could be one of those people...


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22931770 -

Bigbadwooof said:
qman said:
airclay said:
because I work from a base that considers all people equals, you know the golden rule and the like :shrug:


The average American is more concerned about their favorite TV show, video game, or restaurant.

If their child's school system has been flooded with a bunch of illegals, that has a DIRECT impact on their family's well-being, the US military and its actions overseas doesn't.


I wish I could be one of those people...


Without a doubt, people that take little interest in the world around them seem to be very happy, ignorance is bliss.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: qman] * 2
    #22931787 -

And a nice steak dinner?



--------------------
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22931912 -

Shins said:
And a nice steak dinner?




:laugh2:

Ok, this post gets a :thatsaten:

I could dig that steak. Ooooh yeah!

Maybe it is some measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society afterall...


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


Edited by Bigbadwooof (02/22/16 12:17 AM)

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22931923 -

i say we all fight about it, literally, no taksie backsies. rich vs the sane and rational enterprise for a freer society.








*taps the maple tree &grabs binoculars* :trollhide:

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins] * 1
    #22932166 -

Shins said:
Yes and?

You can still have faith in something rational.

Sorry to break your worldview.


arguing with you and HU is like being water boarded with molasses.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: akira_akuma] * 3
    #22932170 -

The only thing worthwhile for me about most of these political discussions is the humor. :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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