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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22798427 -

i don't hate Jews, hostile.

Zionism does not equal Judaism


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War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Tipote]
    #22798499 -

Tipote said:
qman said:
But what is tearing the EU apart today by allowing it to be flooded with a bunch of third world forgniers?  LEFT WING poltics!!


which left wing governments are responsible for the influx of migrants and refugees?
Europe is more right wing rather than left.

Even Merkel is from a centre right party. The UK has a centre right party
France is socialist in name only.

There is a clear shift towards the empowerment of right wing parties. Popularity for them is growing.
Though I would say as well there are left wing groups gaining popularity though this is less significant than on the right.
The Labour party in the UK which has been pretty centre more or less, is undergoing a massive return to its leftist roots.

Perhaps the trend is towards increasing polarisation with people moving away from the centre.

anyway, no one - except maybe Merkel (centre right)- "allowed" Europe to be "flooded", as you put it.

Refugees were always going to come, this has been obvious for years. EU governments ignored it until they couldnt any more.


The only reason why there's a shift to the "right" in the EU is because of the illegal invasion, otherwise the population would stay left.

"Refugees were always going to come"

Pure speculation on your part, but do you know why they came to Europe?  Because they knew the governments were going to have favorable policies for their presence.

Take away the open arms approach and they would all think otherwise about their journey to the EU, why aren't they going to Poland?  They know they're not welcome.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Tipote]
    #22798627 -

Tipote said:
Quote:
The majority of scholars identify Nazism in practice as a form of far-right politics.[8] Far-right themes in Nazism include the argument that superior people have a right to dominate over other people and purge society of supposed inferior elements.[9] Adolf Hitler and other proponents officially portrayed Nazism as being neither left- nor right-wing, but syncretic.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism#Position_in_the_political_spectrum

The Nazis were not left wing.



In that same Wikipedia link it also says, under the title of "Position in the political spectrum" -

Hitler in Mein Kampf directly attacked both left-wing and right-wing politics in Germany, saying:

Today our left-wing politicians in particular are constantly insisting that their craven-hearted and obsequious foreign policy necessarily results from the disarmament of Germany, whereas the truth is that this is the policy of traitors [...] But the politicians of the Right deserve exactly the same reproach. It was through their miserable cowardice that those ruffians of Jews who came into power in 1918 were able to rob the nation of its arms.[12]

Hitler, when asked whether he supported the "bourgeois right-wing", claimed that Nazism was not exclusively for any class, and indicated that it favoured neither the left nor the right, but preserved "pure" elements from both "camps", stating: "From the camp of bourgeois tradition, it takes national resolve, and from the materialism of the Marxist dogma, living, creative Socialism"


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Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story NEVER Told - Official Trailer

The National Socialist Revolution - THINK DIFFERENT

EUROPA – The Last Battle - The Truth Fears No Investigation

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Tipote]
    #22798649 -

Tipote said:
qman said:
But what is tearing the EU apart today by allowing it to be flooded with a bunch of third world forgniers?  LEFT WING poltics!!


which left wing governments are responsible for the influx of migrants and refugees?
Europe is more right wing rather than left.



The Labour party, who are definitely on the Left, allowed the biggest mass migration into the United Kingdom in history, between 97-2010.
They allowed some 4 million third world immigrants to poor into the country completely uncontrolled.


--------------------
Adolf Hitler - The Greatest Story NEVER Told - Official Trailer

The National Socialist Revolution - THINK DIFFERENT

EUROPA – The Last Battle - The Truth Fears No Investigation

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bubbles85]
    #22798666 -

not sure why you needed to add that..

i thought i summed that up when i quoted the wikipedia article which said..

Quote:
Adolf Hitler and other proponents officially portrayed Nazism as being neither left- nor right-wing, but syncretic



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War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bubbles85]
    #22798736 -

Bubbles85 said:
The Labour party, who are definitely on the Left, allowed the biggest mass migration into the United Kingdom in history, between 97-2010.
They allowed some 4 million third world immigrants to poor into the country completely uncontrolled.


Labour under Blair were more centre . Thats what the Third Way was about. David Cameron is trying to be Blair of those days. Labour under Corbyn is only now returning back to the left as it traditionally was.

Do you have any links on what youre saying?
Absolutely, Labour allowed alot of migrants and asylum seekers to come to the UK. Can you tell me how many were "third world immigrants" as opposed to EU citizens? Can you show how this was "completely uncontrolled"?

Labour hasnt been in power for quite a while now. Still their fault?

How does this relate to the backlash against the migrant/refugee crisis Europe is currently facing?

I'm interested to know, Bubbles, do you read the Sun? What do you think of it?


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War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Tipote]
    #22799017 -

This article explains migration under the last Labour government (1997-2010)

The figures proposed have been taken from the think tank, Migration Watch.

They estimate that around 5.5 million migrants, entered the UK under the last Labour government, with roughly 80% of those coming from out side of the EU, from places like India, Africa and the Middle East.

The Migration Watch study, said the scale of the movement is the largest seen in the UK since the Anglo Saxon invasions over 1000 years ago.

More than three million migrants under Labour

Yes it is still there fault, they are directly responsible for the biggest mass movement of people, under any government in British history. How many of those 5.5 million immigrants have had children? Probably millions of them.

No i don't read the sun, why do you ask?

Edited by Bubbles85 (01/19/16 02:40 PM)

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bubbles85]
    #22799215 -

Left and right are defined different in Europe than here in America. Libertarianism actually has a lot of features of left wing ideology, which is why so many left wingers like at least half of what Rand Paul stands for as opposed to a guy like Jeb Bush.

It's not specifically about the size of government. There is more to it than that. There are strains of communist ideology which involve no centralized government whatsoever. Would you say Communism is right wing?

Nazionale Fascism is a right wing ideology. They branded themselves as a left wing 'Socialist' party to build support. This is well documented. They were not Socialist.


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"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bubbles85]
    #22799309 -

So if we take out all EU citizens from that, we get about 3.4 million (including British leaving the UK) over 13 years

I agree that is alot of people and a big deal. Many times more than the 20,000 Syrian refugees the UK government said it would take over 5 years.
Where does it say it was "completely uncontrolled"? Some of these people now fill the ranks of our NHS so i imagine some selective process was going on. It wasn't just an open door. The NHS would probably implode if we didn't have foreign staff. It at least saved the UK a bomb in training costs.

Labour did this not only for political reasons but also to cater to big business by bringing in cheap labour, hardly a typical left wing policy. As i said, Labour was more centrist under Blair.

Anyway, the point is: what has this got to do with the current migrant and refugee crisis?
The refugee crisis is more recent than Labour. The Syrian war began in 2011. The tories got in to office in 2010. What left wing policies did they implement?

They bombed the middle east, just as the labour government did. That certainly fuelled the refugee crisis.


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War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22799319 -

God you guys are in such denial.  All you do is recite other people you do not think for yourself.

The Nazis clearly had LEFT WING economic policies and RIGHT WING social policies.


Use your brain and think about it yourself,  instead of frantically searching Google for an article which supports your false beliefs.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22799331 -

and their economic policies ended up being driven by hatred of the Jews...yes yes yes, tired tired tired old story. so what? they were propping up values, while besmirching them in the process because the goal was extermination of the Jews -- then the world....the values themselves are independent from the disguised rhetoric of the Nazis and their actions; they come from sources independent of the Nazis -- the Nazis did not invent that kind of policy -- they USED that kind of policy DUPLICITOUSLY to prop up their command, in order to accomplish their goal.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22799861 -

Shins said:
God you guys are in such denial.  All you do is recite other people you do not think for yourself.

The Nazis clearly had LEFT WING economic policies and RIGHT WING social policies.


Use your brain and think about it yourself,  instead of frantically searching Google for an article which supports your false beliefs.


Nailed it! That's what's so infuriating about ideologues, so determined to prove the other side wrong and their side as "pure as the driven snow" they overlook obvious facts...


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http://www.countdowntotrump.com




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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22800545 -

You guys are just "happy" nazis.  At least the nazis were honest about their naziism.  You guys don't even realize your economic ideas are the same as the nazis.   

Economic policies are vastly more important and powerful than social policies.  If you control the money, the rest falls behind.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22800603 -

i can't imagine a worldview that is informed by imagination. :shrug: can you?

kinda fascinating.

economic policies do not determine the thought process...social policies do not either.

social policies can however undermine economic policies and visa versa.

point is to have a center -- for the fucks sakes -- and work out from there.

hostileuniverse said:
Nailed it! That's what's so infuriating about ideologues, so determined to prove the other side wrong and their side as "pure as the driven snow" they overlook obvious facts...


a fucking paradox coming from you.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins]
    #22800606 -

Shins said:
God you guys are in such denial.  All you do is recite other people you do not think for yourself.

The Nazis clearly had LEFT WING economic policies and RIGHT WING social policies.


Use your brain and think about it yourself,  instead of frantically searching Google for an article which supports your false beliefs.


What article are you referring to?


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: hostileuniverse] * 3
    #22800608 -

hostileuniverse said:
Nailed it! That's what's so infuriating about ideologues, so determined to prove the other side wrong and their side as "pure as the driven snow" they overlook obvious facts...


Lol, you described yourself perfectly.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Enlil]
    #22800611 -

precisely.

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #22800621 -

Bigbadwooof said:
Shins said:
God you guys are in such denial.  All you do is recite other people you do not think for yourself.

The Nazis clearly had LEFT WING economic policies and RIGHT WING social policies.


Use your brain and think about it yourself,  instead of frantically searching Google for an article which supports your false beliefs.


What article are you referring to?



The one you copy/pasted?

Is that all you have to respond to? 

Don't be a sophist.


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http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #22800624 -

:hahthatsrich:


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War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength

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Re: Rise of the far-right in France and Europe [Re: Shins] * 1
    #22800634 -

Shins said:
You guys are just "happy" nazis.  At least the nazis were honest about their naziism.  You guys don't even realize your economic ideas are the same as the nazis.


:carlinorgasm:

Quote:
Economic policies are vastly more important and powerful than social policies.  If you control the money, the rest falls behind.


In the case of the Nazis, it was the social policies that were more important and dangerous. I don't see how you could possibly argue otherwise. The atrocities that we hold them accountable for were directly related to their social policies.

Their economic policy was not left wing. Universal healthcare isn't all that is required for an economy to be left wing. In fact, it isn't a requirement AT ALL. The Nazi party didn't seize the means of production and put it in the hands of the people. That would be leftist economic policy.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"No my dog won't bite you, tho it had the right to. You ought to give him credit, cuz he knows I woulda let him" - Modest Mouse (And Wooof!)
Every one of you should see this video.


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