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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321197 -

niteowl said:
My position has always been that there is no real facts just our best guess.


But that has nothing to do with your position on global warming.

Here you go https://www.shroomery.org/forums/postlist.php/Board/11


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321214 -

niteowl said:
My position has always been that there is no real facts just our best guess.


I guess grass ain't green and the sun ain't shining either than brahski it's just a good guess. :rolleyes:

Oh and light is just a guess too. We aren't sure if there is light. It's just a guess.

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321246 -

niteowl said:
My position has always been that there is no real facts just our best guess.


'Facts' in science are usually taken to be an objective observation.  Such observations do of course have error bars associated with them, but that doesn't change that they are considered facts.  Very often simple inferences made by the observations are also considered facts.

Its a 'fact' that people observe a white circle/crescent in the sky (though it could be an error).  Its a 'fact' that this white circle/crescent is a massive body (the moon) even though that idea is merely inferred from the obsevation in the sky and could be in error.  This is not considered a guess, educated or otherwise.  The same holds for observing temperature in the recent or distant past.  (and every other observation made under the scientific paradigm)

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: feifen]
    #11321293 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
niteowl said:
My position has always been that there is no real facts just our best guess.


But that has nothing to do with your position on global warming.


What are you trying to say here?

I never claimed that global warming was false.
Just that we do not know what the temps really were 100,000 years ago.

feifen said:
niteowl said:
My position has always been that there is no real facts just our best guess.


I guess grass ain't green and the sun ain't shining either than brahski it's just a good guess. :rolleyes:

Oh and light is just a guess too. We aren't sure if there is light. It's just a guess.


:facepalm:

Facts based on the temps of the globe throughout earths history.
We can say that the earth went through warmer times and cooler times
but we can't put a factual number to the temps 100,000 or 1,000,000 years ago
We can make an educated guess but we will never know for sure what the temps actually were.

I do not see why you guys cant understand this very simple fact. :confused:


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321318 -

What im trying to say is that you said we know that the earth is getting warmer for a fact, we just don't know its its human or earth that is responsible.  Then you said we don't know facts, just guesses.  Just confused on what point you are trying to make about the OP.:shrug:


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321354 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
What im trying to say is that you said we know that the earth is getting warmer for a fact, we just don't know its its human or earth that is responsible.  Then you said we don't know facts, just guesses.  Just confused on what point you are trying to make about the OP.:shrug:


We don't know what the actual temps were over the history of the planet.
That is all that I have ever claimed in this and other threads on this subject.

When someone says that the earth was 'X' degrees 100,000 years ago it is a guess, not a fact.
We will never know for sure what the actual temps were prior to humans recording it.

Does the earth go through warm and cold cycles.........yes, that is a well known fact
Do we know what the actual temps were when these changes took place.......no not really


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321369 -

Your syntax of certain words and word choice including "fact" is just confusing me.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321380 -

The planet goes through climate changes from warmer to cooler = fact

The planet was 'X' degrees 100,000 years ago is not a fact, it is a guess


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321385 -

OK. Thank you. We got it. We don't live in the past, thank you for sharing this information with us. :thumbup:

Cognitive_Shift said:
Your syntax of certain words and word choice including "fact" is just confusing me.


QFT. He just said there are no facts in this world.. just guesses.

I think this old man needs to get his FACTS straight :lol:

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321408 -

Yes we can agree on something.  The planet and its ecosystems undergo periods of warming and cooling.  However, there is a correlation between rising temperatures of the surface of the earth, and the amount of green house gases going into the atmosphere since the industrial revolution.  Temperatures are rising faster, and predicted via computer modeling to keep rising.  It is a scientific fact that CO2 and other green house gases absorb infared radiation.  We can say with confidence that human beings excess production of green house gases in the atmosphere can be correlated with abnormally rising surface temperatures.  It is possible that we are playing no role in the fast rising surface temps.  But the evidence is suggesting otherwise.  The accuracy of temperature readings from 100,000 years ago is irrelevant to the data sitting right in front of our eyes. 

Quote:
SOURCE: National Center for Atmospheric Research | 30-year period: 1961-1990 | The Washington Post



Edited by Cognitive_Shift (10/25/09 09:52 PM)

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: elementswrath]
    #11321446 -

elementswrath said:
i am confused, if a meteor could do that than how in the hell did we survive the last hit of the dinosaurs is what i want to know.
this video either pointless or disproves the extinction of dinosaurs.


Couldn't find one that showed.... 

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/planetearth/asteroid_impact_020626.html


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:Awesketch:

:cool: Fair is Fair :devil:

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321539 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
Yes we can agree on something.  The planet and its ecosystems undergo periods of warming and cooling.  However, there is a correlation between rising temperatures of the surface of the earth, and the amount of green house gases going into the atmosphere since the industrial revolution.  Temperatures are rising faster, and predicted via computer modeling to keep rising.  It is a scientific fact that CO2 and other green house gases absorb infared radiation.  We can say with confidence that human beings excess production of green house gases in the atmosphere can be correlated with abnormally rising surface temperatures.  It is possible that we are playing no role in the fast rising surface temps.  But the evidence is suggesting otherwise.  The accuracy of temperature readings from 100,000 years ago is irrelevant to the data sitting right in front of our eyes. 

Quote:
SOURCE: National Center for Atmospheric Research | 30-year period: 1961-1990 | The Washington Post





The thing I have with that is, we really do not know what
the CO2 levels were for the whole history of the planet.
All we can do is see what has happened in the last 150 years or so.
Did the planet warm up in the past due to a lot of volcanic activity
or was it nothing more than increased solar activity
or was it due to natural planetary rythms

We do not know for sure

All we can do is collect data and speculate based on that data.
We will never have all the data, so we have to fill in the blanks with our best guess.

Is it a good idea to try and reduce the CO2 levels, of course we should
but to say that the planet is warming/cooling because of human activity is somewhat arrogant IMO


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321585 -

you're sort of correct, but actually past CO2 levels are much easier to measure than past temps, which yes, are a "best guess"... co2 is measurable, and its relative levels in the atmosphere are recorded in ice cores. its not an inferred guess, but a direct observation. you can read those things like a book, its pretty bad ass.

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: niteowl]
    #11321588 -

niteowl said:
but to say that the planet is warming/cooling because of human activity is somewhat arrogant IMO


:lol:  Are you sure you want to make that statment?

Ice core data:

Quote:
SOURCE:  http://www.ipcc.ch/



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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321633 -


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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: IMaGicaL]
    #11321651 -

:lol:You are just padding my evidence that global warming is most likely anthropogenic.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321663 -

Quote:



Correlation does not equal causation.

How do you know that warming temps decreasing the solubility of CO2 in the oceans is not the reason for increased atmospheric CO2 in line with increased temperature?

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: IMaGicaL]
    #11321679 -

IMaGicaL said:



:imslow:
So....it's supposed to be getting colder according to this volcanic eruptions/temperature correlation data?  Yet, the temp is rising contrary to the pattern?

edit:
And then add in the CO2 ice core data and then we have a theory of global warming?


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Let that which doesn't matter truly not matter.

Edited by youbreakyoubuy (10/25/09 10:38 PM)

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Viveka]
    #11321722 -

Viveka said:
Correlation does not equal causation.


I agree, that's why i said its "most likely" anthropogenic.

Quote:
How do you know that warming temps decreasing the solubility of CO2 in the oceans is not the reason for increased atmospheric CO2 in line with increased temperature?


It could be... but i see a more likely causation...

We are fucking pumping the skies with CO2.  Every time you get in your car.  Every time you burn fossil fuels.  You are putting CO2 in the air.  We are putting more CO2 into the atmosphere than ever recorded and there are increasing average global temperature higher than ever before recorded.  This excess CO2 is just creating more of a green house effect, and rising the surface temperature.  And the green house effect is a fact.  When you have infared radiation reflected off the earths surface and you have more CO2 PPM absorbing that energy it WILL CAUSE a rise in surface temp.  Period.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Global Warming Hoax [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #11321755 -

You might want to print this out and tape it to your floor:


Edited by Viveka (10/25/09 10:57 PM)

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