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Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? * 1
    #24391619 -

Been looking at Carl Hart's videos on Youtube. For those of you who don't know of him, he is a University professor and a council member on the National Institute of Health. He challenges people's views on illicit drugs and is favor of decriminalization of ALL drugs.

He says that even drugs like Heroin, Methamphetamine, other hard drugs, etc... can be used responsibly, and that some people would be better/ more productive/happier with a daily dose of heroin or other drugs.

He said that "Most people (80-90%) who use drugs like Heroin and methamphetamine don't need medical treatment or rehabilitation and are normal well-functioning members of their society."

He seems sort of genuine but also sort of insincere. I know I've seen people around me fucked up by heroin and meth. But then again, those people all lived in shitty areas and had a lot of problems going on in their life to begin with.

He himself has admitted to using heroin (and continuing to use heroin regularly. But I wonder if he's being totally honest about all this stuff. I question his sincerity when he repeatedly calls America's drug policy "Racist". I mean that just seems like such a bone-headed thing to say. Although I think he's mostly talking about the drug policy being biased against Poor Communities which might be true.

Another thing that confuses me is when he talks about Drug Tolerance. He says "Most people view tolerance to drugs as a bad thing. But it's a good thing because it means you can take higher and higher doses without experiencing toxicity."
That seems pretty odd to me. Especially when you're speaking mostly about "hard" drugs like heroin and meth. Yeah maybe you are protected from not dying when you gain tolerance. But tolerance is what makes drugs addictive. Especially hard drugs. Sure you can keep taking higher and higher doses but obviously you become dependent.

What do ya'll think about this guy?


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LogicaL Chaos said:
"humans are like cubes, lots of strains but cubes a cube. Not much difference really."

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh] * 1
    #24391624 -

I think hes a fool if he thinks regular heroin use by US citizens is a sign of good health etc.

This is bass ackwards


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Anyone got a lowpass filter in this biiiiash?

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: ModestMouse]
    #24391693 -

He sounds like an idiot spewing downright false information that could get people hurt.

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: ModestMouse]
    #24391710 -

Most drugs should not be used with any regularity by the general public.

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: larry.fisherman]
    #24391774 -

Yea, I agree with much of what he has to present. He's been on the Joe Rogan experience a couple times where he goes into many of these subjects.

One thing that he emphasises is that it's not the drug at fault, that many times people fail to look at the individual in question. What led to the abuse of whatever drug.

Also, that many drugs on the streets are cut and far from pure.

A place where someone can have access to pure substances with trained medical staff on hand, without being demonized for their life circumstances and choices, is needed, IMO.

We want to talk about stopping overdoses and this 'opioid epidemic', saving peoples lives, then why not give people what they want in controlled settings. People are going to use drugs regardless of if they are legal or not, prohibition proves that.

Dr. Hart has been all over the world studying 'drugs' and their effect on society. Perhaps more people should listen to maybe gain a better understanding of drugs and addiction.

I have to get back to work.
:popcorn:


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The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24391837 -

Well he brings up a lot of valid points. I think that what you are forgetting is that what he was/is saying is in a very specific context
mctaveesh said:
He seems sort of genuine but also sort of insincere. I know I've seen people around me fucked up by heroin and meth. But then again, those people all lived in shitty areas and had a lot of problems going on in their life to begin with.



I mean your experiences really don't mean much in the larger scientific context. He is really backing most of his arguments with a few points

1) most people who do drugs, even the harder drugs, end up fine and don't end up addicted. Which objectively true. Yes, crack and heroin etc. has ruined lives. no doubt. but most people who do them do them casually a few times

2) people with serious addictions usually have much more serious problems in life, mentally and emotionally. Family life too. Usually there are much more serious issues underlying these addictions

3) most hard drugs can be used some what responsibly

4) the drug was causes more crime than the drugs themselves

I agree with his viewpoints. I am pretty sure everyone on this forum supports the legalization of drugs in the long run and agrees the war on drugs is stupid as flying fuck

Carl hart merely says this openly and thats why he gets criticized. So I think he is a cool guy and his heart is in the right place. But what I have begun to realize is that full blown legalization is a stupid/silly idea right now. Most drug users have 0 clue what they are doing. Even my friends who have taken E 20-50+ times have little to know knowledge of what going on. They don't know what MDMA is at all
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24302199

That first post in the thread is a reflection of how bad people's views on drugs are. And if we are to legalize these compounds, the atmosphere that we should do that in is much different

Anyone in this thread who disagrees with him should check out his book and actually read the thing. Its a pretty good read. That being said, I think the problem with people who support the legalization of drugs is that they often forget that theres still a lot of work to be done. Specifically in regards to educating the population

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: topdog82]
    #24391950 -

I think you're tweaking the message a little bit.

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24391965 -

)


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ga ga ga eets eets how you gone be mad on vacation?
MONICA COULDN'T TELL TIME UNTIL SHE WAS 13

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: shadyy]
    #24392402 -

Yeah I guess if people had access to pure drugs and testing facilities and medical treatment instead of imprisonment, we'd have a much different situation.

One interesting thing that he brings up also, is that "When drug addicts are given other options in life (jobs, school, some sort of incentive to be productive and stop abusing drugs) they will take the alternative instead of the drug".

That's probably a big reason why people in shitty communities continue to abuse drugs. Not much hope for a great life and many of them i'd imagine live in a nightmare world where they're surrounded by crime and violence and people who have no sense of community. No wonder they'd turn to using escapist drugs.

I'm about to oder his book, High Price, off of Amazon. His next book supposedly is going to be about "Why more people should use drugs". Lol :lol: Should be coming out soon. Guy at least is a really good example of a responsible "hard" drug user. His story is pretty inspiring.


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LogicaL Chaos said:
"humans are like cubes, lots of strains but cubes a cube. Not much difference really."

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24392418 -

His papers are peer-reviewed and legit. Some of the additional opinions are a bit of a stretch, which is why he sells them in books, they wouldn't pass peer review.


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...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: badchad] * 1
    #24392462 -

Right I was looking at his papers on Google scholar last night.

Really glad we got scientists like him. Sad that even science is so biased. Marijuana research is a good example.

Rick Doblin said that the monopoly on marijuana for research owned by the NIDA (which is biased against positive research on marijuana) just ended recently. So I guess we should be seeing a lot of real research on the benefits of cannabis soon.


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LogicaL Chaos said:
"humans are like cubes, lots of strains but cubes a cube. Not much difference really."

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh] * 1
    #24392689 -

I'm genuinely surprised Joe Rogan has been using his podcast to give this guy's ideas mainstream legitimacy. Implying opiates aren't addictive :burke:


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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: schwarg]
    #24394177 -

schwarg said:
addictive



It depends a lot on your definition of addiction. Many people use heroin daily and may never meet the criteria of an addict. On the other hand, there are people who use drugs once a week and it causes all sorts of havoc and social disruptions.

Proper education is what many people need most these days.


--------------------
The Italian researchers’ findings, published by the INT’s scientific magazine Tumori Journal, show 11.6% of 959 healthy volunteers enrolled in a lung cancer screening trial between September 2019 and March 2020 had developed coronavirus antibodies well before February.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-italy-timing-idUSKBN27V0KF

This online first version has been peer-reviewed, accepted and edited,  but not formatted and finalized with corrections from authors and proofreaders

https://www.icandecide.org/

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24394199 -

only carl i know is this one


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:niffla:

ACADEMY AWARD WINNING ACTOR
WG32 KILLED HOFFA
PROFESSIONAL BALL BUFFERER
WORST NEIGHBORHOOD YARD OF 2026 WINNER
OTD’S FORMER PRODIGAL SON
TODAY IS BEER DAY

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: Nifflerz]
    #24394307 -

The very premise of modern medicine is that legit drugs are safe.

They pretty much feel that if man made and Uncle Sam stamped their approval, all side effects are safe managable.

I think modern medicine to be pretty damn delusional.  They always downplay side effects or errors and totally bullshit successes.

Law and medicine are both scams.  Sure, it can help but also fuck people over.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: HamHead]
    #24394818 -

HamHead said:
schwarg said:
addictive


Many people use heroin daily and may never meet the criteria of an addict.


:woah:
I am not really experienced with the harder drugs like crack, opiates, or meth but based on what I have heard this sounds like a false statement

Define "many"? The majority? The minority? what percentage would you approximate?

And I everything that I have heard sort of implies the opposite

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: topdog82]
    #24394827 -

According to Dr Carl Hart it's %80-90 of the people who currently use hard drugs are not addicted.

Which I, humbly, would say is probably bullshit. But what do I know.


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LogicaL Chaos said:
"humans are like cubes, lots of strains but cubes a cube. Not much difference really."

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24394836 -

mctaveesh said:
Right I was looking at his papers on Google scholar last night.

Really glad we got scientists like him. Sad that even science is so biased. Marijuana research is a good example.

Rick Doblin said that the monopoly on marijuana for research owned by the NIDA (which is biased against positive research on marijuana) just ended recently. So I guess we should be seeing a lot of real research on the benefits of cannabis soon.


fuck yea it did!

believe it or not i actually congratulated him personally and shook his hand for fighting for freedom all these years, rick is a walking ball of human compassion and flat unrelenting honesty.

saw him and some other people speak recently and i thought some of what rick said was fucking fantastic.

he straight up said that all religions and spiritual philosophies are pointing towards the same thing and this is the place psychedelics can help us understand (among other things).


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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25598736

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Re: Do ya'll think Carl Hart's opinions are legit? [Re: mctaveesh]
    #24394840 -

mctaveesh said:
According to Dr Carl Hart it's %80-90 of the people who currently use hard drugs are not addicted.

Which I, humbly, would say is probably bullshit. But what do I know.


well depending on what that includes its beyond true because only a VERY slim amount of people who use pills or cocaine ever become truly hooked

heroin crack and meth is a different story


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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25598736

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