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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: sprinkles] * 1
    #20909876 -

I try to avoid giving my pets gluten because apparently they don't process it well at all, or so I've read.

I cook them special dinners sometimes though, my furbabies are spooooiiiled!


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"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Euphie]
    #20909934 -

Quote:
Actually I already answered it, I suppose you didn't read. It would fall under neglect or as OP said, general child abuse. The law already exists but giving zero interest towards your child's health and weight should fall in with it.


I have read everything posted in this thread thus far. You just haven't laid out a specific explanation up until what is quoted above. If you'd like me to take you literally, the criteria for being indicted for child abuse would be, "giving zero interest towards your child's health and weight." By that definition, I'm sure none of the the parents in the US would be indicted. If you would like another chance to lay out a more specific law just so I can point out how it would be problematic, go ahead, you can have another chance.

Quote:
It is actually damaging the child's body, physically hurting them and pushing them towards disease.


So is eating vegetables with residual pesticides. So is driving a car(co2 emissions linked to respiratory problems). Do not try to look like a saint. If you think children should live in a perfect little bubble where none of the real world can affect them, you are very idealistic. Children know what makes them fat and what is healthy. If a child truly wanted to eat a better diet, he or she would declare themselves a "vegetarian"(:facepalm: but that's  whole different debate) and have their parents provide them with healthier alternatives. I was learning factually, not just personally, by the age of 5 that eating healthy was an essential part of fitness. It is a pretty common theme for parents to teach their children to, "eat your vegetables." It's not like they are completely hopeless and it is coming off as condescending that you think the youth are that dumb.

Quote:
Giving a child sweets and junk food alone, nothing wrong with that. Feeding it to them until it hurts their bodies? That's pretty sick. The same would be considered of giving a child alcohol or specific drugs, but wouldn't some drugs be fun and bring them happiness?


Don't try to turn this into a drug debate.

Yeah it is pretty sick, I'm not disagreeing with that. Should there be laws incriminating all parents that allow their children to get to that weight? Fuck no. If they want to eat themselves to death by the age of 25 that is their right as an American citizen. To suggest prohibition of unhealthy diets across the board is extremely unrealistic and a direct violation of basic human rights. I'd rather have people be able to live how they want to rather than the government playing helicopter.

Quote:
Should we consider their happiness before their physical well being while their body has it's only chance to grow? Nothing wrong with a little tough love.


I think we should consider the child's want of what he or she wants to do with his or her life. If the kid wants to get fat as fuck, that's what he or she is going to end up doing. You can serve the kid a balanced diet but in the end it will be the kids decision. There is nothing wrong with giving the kid a balanced diet, that is your prerogative as a parent. There is nothing wrong with letting a child embracing who they are either. That is that parent's prerogative. Why do you feel as if you are entitled to impose your moral compass on someone else via laws? They have a different opinion as you, simple as that. One or the other shouldn't be incriminated for a difference in opinion.

Quote:
Teaching a child to care for themselves in the only space of time where it's VITAL for the body to grow is not pressing lifestyles or morals, they have the rest of their lives to pick their own food. It'll be considerably shortened otherwise. Making sure a child's body is clean inside and out is giving a shit. Not pressing lifestyles.


You're correct that teaching a child to care for themselves is not pressing lifestyles and morals. However, creating a law that would incriminate anyone who has a different opinion about parent hood is imposing morals. Why do you want to take away the right of how to parent from another human being? That isn't very nice. It is nice that you have your opinions but they are just that. They should not be translated to being a law.

Quote:
It'll be considerably shortened otherwise. Making sure a child's body is clean inside and out is giving a shit. Not pressing lifestyles.


Giving a shit about what, the child's health or happiness? See how there is a different side to every coin? Thinking your own moral compass should be translated to law is downright deplorable.


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:leaf: :usa:

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Webster10] * 1
    #20909985 -

Sure, an adult has every right to do that to themselves but a child has no choice but to eat what is given to him/her and can't afford to change their options for quite sometime, not to mention like their brain won't be developed fully for sometime either. They can't make clear and proper judgement. This way of eating becomes a habit and in turn a forced lifestyle as well. I think it's harmful, the parents can see the damage on the bodies and do nothing. I do believe they should be held accountable for the physical damage. I also truly believe happiness can be better attained from a healthy lifestyle rather than a junk filled one.

However, it looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree.  We've shared our sides it'll probably just be a loop or a fight from here.


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"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Euphie]
    #20910000 -

All I know is I fucking love TastyKakes

It's like heroin for your mouth


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Diminish the sub-principle and leave its toxic trace..
Once and for all!

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: sprinkles]
    #20910022 -

sprinkles said:
should be charged with child abuse


and people with grossly overweight pets should be charged with animal abuse. :ifyoucanawe:



People should mind their own business and not worry about other people.  let people be responsible for themselves.


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:smug: [/url][/url] 
:smirk: IF THE NEIGHBORS COMPLAIN BECAUSE THE MUSIC'S TOO LOUD, TURN IT UP SO YOU CAN'T HEAR THEM BITCH    :smirk:

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: OhMrJohnson]
    #20910029 -

The fact of the matter is there's already too many fatties around and those fatties are too proud to be hypocrites. Fat people are likely to have fat kids, and that's because they share overall the same diet.
It's unrealistic to expect a fat parent to force celery tomato and lettuce onto a kid while they waft down two microwaved pizzas.
That's a hypothetical argument. A worse problem is the cause. The kids are fat because they're eating unhealthy not because the parents choose to allow them to; but instead because the parents don't know how to make a healthy meal. It's a problem that is only going to become more acknowledged as each new generation's ignorance gets a little worse.
It's like grain food. So many people at this current time can't make a decent meal without including some sort of grain. I could take this topic even further and enter into conspiracy theories but i won't.


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Magenta]
    #20910245 -

One thing that people need to realize is that most of the morbidly obese in America are either the working class, or extremely poor people.

You have to remember that poor people do not have access to luxuries such as gym memberships, personal trainers, or organic food. You can buy bags of bread, pasta, rice, and carbohydrates for extremely cheap. Vegetables and fruits cost a lot more and don't go nearly as long of a way as food that is made to fatten you up.

The other thing is, most of you are under 30 years old, and therefore most of you don't realize yet just how much metabolism changes with age. Probably by the time you are 40-50 years old, you will be working in an office for 40-60 hours, and have a pot-belly.

It's easy to stay in shape when you are young, have no children, have lots of free time, have the energy to exercise, and don't work as many hours.

Therefore, obesity is somewhat excusable if you are of a certain age. I would say maybe 60's is around the age obesity is somewhat excusable. Maybe obesity is not the right word, but you can definitely be a little bit chubby by age 60.

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Crystal G]
    #20910274 -

Y'know, I was thinking about this thread earlier and had an "aha!" moment.

Fat people give me the jeebies. I think it might be because I was an overweight kid and was always super self concious about it. Regardless of the reason, I've never liked fat people. I won't get into specifics, but my thoughts on them weren't very . . . kind.

On the other hand, I've never understood why people hated drug users. I grew up around drugs, and cannot recall a time that I didn't think drug use was okay. Sure, they were bad for you, but who the fuck was anybody to tell me what to do with my body?

This is where the epiphone comes in:

Fat people are like drug addicts! The only difference is that their drug of choice is food!

I just thought that kinda fit in with the discussion.

Carry on.


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Check Out My Beats
SoundCloud

[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: sprinkles]
    #20910275 -

I mean, my dog is fat, but he's super active. Runs a ton and is probably really healthy on the inside. He's just really short so his body weight kinda crumbles...I'm short too. Oh god I may be fat...hahaha kidding. I don't care. But I don't think parents and owners should be punished necessarily. Sometimes twenty cent ramen is all a mom can afford for her kid(s).


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i s t h e r e a n y b o d y o u t t h e r e ?

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Crystal G]
    #20910280 -

An obese friend of mine post on Facebook once, boasting about how she didn't give in to buying 'greasy kfc tonight' and instead had a healthy home cooked meal, then followed by a picture of some slimy noodle dish that had likely come out of a packet and been microwaved for 5 minutes.
There is so much info about what we should be eating, some of it wrong, some of it conflicting and some of it out dated. I can understand why some people make bad decisions.
You make a good point Crystal G, in fact, that was the main reason stopped the Paleo diet.


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: PinkFloydLover]
    #20910288 -

I feel as if I should chime in on the "poor people have less access to good food" argument.

I weighed a lot more when I lived with my mother, who has money, than with my father, who doesn't. The reason behind this is that my mother had the money to afford take-out and sweets, while my father was limited to stews, bread, and meats. Also, the food was stretched between four people, so portions were smaller.

So, I don't really see that argument. But, then again, maybe that's the difference in the poor and the really poor :lol:


--------------------
Check Out My Beats
SoundCloud

[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #20910306 -

In Australia, everyone that's poor gets a government allowance (the dole) and thus they're always either fat from bad food, or rake skinny from meth.


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: ThatKidWithTheFace]
    #20910316 -

addiction comes in many forms. it doesn't matter what the focus of the addiction is, they all have the same thing in common. A spiritual seperation from the divine and loss of connection to one another.

its still no excuse to abuse your children crapping crap down their throat. if carbs is all they can afford, less screen time and more play/activity time.


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When telling the truth becomes an act of treason, and society chooses delusion and deception over fundamental reality, you've been invaded and infiltrated by other beings that have now integrated into your country and community.  Bless our reptile overlords who control, harvest, and eat us.

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Magenta]
    #20910350 -

sprinkles said:
addiction comes in many forms. it doesn't matter what the focus of the addiction is, they all have the same thing in common. A spiritual seperation from the divine and loss of connection to one another.

its still no excuse to abuse your children crapping crap down their throat. if carbs is all they can afford, less screen time and more play/activity time.


Definitely. Using the addict argument, I wouldn't give my kids Opiates :shrug:


--------------------
Check Out My Beats
SoundCloud

[quote]Sheekle said:
[quote]ThatKidWithTheFace said:
Is this the same aunt that fucks dogs?[/quote]
u bet ur ass it is.[/quote]

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: sprinkles]
    #20910446 -

sprinkles said:
should be charged with child abuse



You would be the first to complain if I suggested government paid for gyms that everyone can use for free. It's hard to work out outside where I live, like running here is dangerous on the ice, and cross country skiing is ghey. I think poor fat little ghetto kids should be able to have more places to go in cold weather and play basketball. Poor little white trash kids should have access to free rink time for hockey and figure skating.
Also access to grocery stores is getting more and more limited every year. They operate on slim margin and outer suburbs offer them cheaper rent, therefore large areas of cities have no grocery stores. You can actually map diabetes rates in inner cities based on distance from grocery store. I have 10 fast food joints and 7/11 right close by, the grocery store if you have no car is 3 buses and it takes pretty much half your day. Access to healthy food should be an enshrined right in my opinion.
And my cat is fat as fuck, but she still catches more birds than you.

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Crystal G]
    #20910764 -

Crystal G said:
One thing that people need to realize is that most of the morbidly obese in America are either the working class, or extremely poor people.

You have to remember that poor people do not have access to luxuries such as gym memberships, personal trainers, or organic food. You can buy bags of bread, pasta, rice, and carbohydrates for extremely cheap. Vegetables and fruits cost a lot more and don't go nearly as long of a way as food that is made to fatten you up.

The other thing is, most of you are under 30 years old, and therefore most of you don't realize yet just how much metabolism changes with age. Probably by the time you are 40-50 years old, you will be working in an office for 40-60 hours, and have a pot-belly.

It's easy to stay in shape when you are young, have no children, have lots of free time, have the energy to exercise, and don't work as many hours.

Therefore, obesity is somewhat excusable if you are of a certain age. I would say maybe 60's is around the age obesity is somewhat excusable. Maybe obesity is not the right word, but you can definitely be a little bit chubby by age 60.


I don't believe eating well costs more at all. Especially when you have badass farmers markets available 3/4ths the year in most places. Quinoa is like one of the healthiest wholest foods on the planet, pretty damn cheap... twice the price of rice sure but that's still cheap. Grab some kale and throw it in with that, pretty cheap... 8$ of those ingredients is enough food for like 3 days.  I've spent many past years with hardly a penny - at first I was a fucktard and bought cheap processed/meal food because it seems somewhat logical - the cheap shitty stuff must be... well cheaper.. better deal? I spent more however because it didn't fill me up at all.. my intuition told me I was constantly being malnourished in some way so I'd keep eating shit. Now buying all raw ingredients and cooking for myself as well as foraging I probably spend half as much and get 10x as much nutrition 5x as much energy and 1/10th as many stomach cramps and horrible shits.
For those with real motivation to live healthily and energetically on this planet all the information they need to do so by their own accord is available on the internet or at a library. Yoga will keep you in killer shape, and high on energy for FREE for your entire life. It honestly is not very excusable to be obese at any age if you have any zest for life & striving to be healthy. Its interesting to note, that the town I live in has both the highest Ph.D rates per capita and one of the lowest obesity rates. I know hundreds of people here (and the population is actually older on average than most places) and literally not one I can think of is even near obese. Makes it very easy to spot tourists :lol:


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¿Check out some art m8?


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: twighead]
    #20910861 -

twighead said:
For those with real motivation to live healthily and energetically on this planet all the information they need to do so by their own accord is available on the internet or at a library. Yoga will keep you in killer shape, and high on energy for FREE for your entire life. It honestly is not very excusable to be obese at any age if you have any zest for life & striving to be healthy. Its interesting to note, that the town I live in has both the highest Ph.D rates per capita and one of the lowest obesity rates. I know hundreds of people here (and the population is actually older on average than most places) and literally not one I can think of is even near obese. Makes it very easy to spot tourists :lol:


No shit, people who are rich or highly educated typically aren't obese. That was what my entire point was about. People like you simply cannot understand the fact that poor people do not have access to luxuries such as gym memberships, they can't afford to go on "pale diets" or hire personal trainers, or do "juice cleanses."

A lot of people who are poor tend to have at least 3 children or more, and are working 2 full-time jobs. How exactly do you fit exercise, or even cooking, into the equation in that situation?

Also, being obese is not the same thing as being a little bit chubby. I bet there are plenty of people in your community who are in their 40's and 50's who have a little bit of a pot-belly because they are attorneys or CPA's who work 80 hours a week. Or because they recently got pregnant and had babies and gained a lot of weight, and don't have time to exercise after birth.

It's easy to stay in shape when you are young, have no children, have lots of free time, have a fast metabolism, have the energy to exercise, and don't work too many hours. Fat children and fat young adults are not acceptable, but people in their 40's or 50's who are slightly chubby, well that can sometimes happen.

Also, for people who don't work out, they should be eating LESS carbs, not more. Your quinoa advice wouldn't help them to lose weight, because they wouldn't be able to burn those carbs off unless they worked out.

Edited by Crystal G (12/01/14 04:26 AM)

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Crystal G]
    #20910870 -

I can't understand it? I've been poor most of my life and you hardly need a gym to stay in shape, you don't need a personal trainer, or juice cleanses. Like I said - you buy raw food and cook it yourself, keep it pretty simple and get lots of quinoa/rice/beans/kale/fruit etc. - you'll be spending hardly anything and making incredibly nourishing & healthy meals that stimulate your metabolism & no -freaking- way will make you fat almost no matter what you do.

A lot of people let the immensity of their situation get the best of them, sure - but everyone deep down knows - if you have the will you will find a way. You don't even need to work out -that- much to stay in decent condition if you're eating well. Just 30 minutes of efficient yoga a day can have you kicking total ass. Basically forever. Even working 12 hour + days I can easily find time for it, along with cooking, shopping, house maintenance etc.

What would you recommend eating as a poor person - if not the foods I mentioned? I've never known, ever, a quinoa muncher to get obese whatsoever :lol:


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¿Check out some art m8?


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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: twighead]
    #20910874 -

twighead said:
I can't understand it? I've been poor most of my life and you hardly need a gym to stay in shape, you don't need a personal trainer, or juice cleanses. Like I said - you buy raw food and cook it yourself, keep it pretty simple and get lots of quinoa/rice/beans/kale/fruit etc. - you'll be spending hardly anything and making incredibly nourishing & healthy meals that stimulate your metabolism & no -freaking- way will make you fat almost no matter what you do.


You have to understand that people's metabolisms don't slow down until they are in their mid-20's to 30's. Of course it's easy to stay rail-thin when you are a teenager or young adult. Almost EVERYBODY is thin when they are under 25.

You also don't have any children, I'm assuming, and therefore you are still missing the point entirely. I'm also assuming you don't work 40-80 hour work weeks.

The idea that certain foods "stimulate your metabolism" is ludicrous. Calories consumed are calories consumed. If you don't burn off those calories, it turns to fat. Hence why people who don't exercise need to do the low-carb, paleo diet in order to lose weight. The paleo diet however, is extremely expensive.

Quinoa, rice, and beans are all carbs. Kale and fruit is expensive, and doesn't go a long way like carbs do, especially when you're feeding a family of 4 or 5. You see my point now??

My post was not about people who are obviously under 30 who are single and have lots of free time, like you are talking about. It was about people who have families who work 2 jobs, and rarely have time to exercise or even cook.

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Re: Parents of morbidly obese children [Re: Crystal G]
    #20910890 -

Crystal G said:
twighead said:
I can't understand it? I've been poor most of my life and you hardly need a gym to stay in shape, you don't need a personal trainer, or juice cleanses. Like I said - you buy raw food and cook it yourself, keep it pretty simple and get lots of quinoa/rice/beans/kale/fruit etc. - you'll be spending hardly anything and making incredibly nourishing & healthy meals that stimulate your metabolism & no -freaking- way will make you fat almost no matter what you do.


You have to understand that people's metabolisms don't slow down until they are in their mid-20's to 30's. Of course it's easy to stay rail-thin when you are a teenager or young adult. Almost EVERYBODY is thin when they are under 25.

You also don't have any children, I'm assuming, and therefore you are still missing the point entirely. I'm also assuming you don't work 40-80 hour work weeks.

The idea that certain foods "stimulate your metabolism" is ludicrous. Calories consumed are calories consumed. If you don't burn off those calories, it turns to fat. Hence why people who don't exercise need to do the low-carb, paleo diet in order to lose weight. The paleo diet however, is extremely expensive.

Quinoa, rice, and beans are all carbs. Kale and fruit is expensive, and doesn't go a long way like carbs do, especially when you're feeding a family of 4 or 5. You see my point now??

My post was not about people who are obviously under 30 who are single and have lots of free time, like you are talking about. It was about people who have families who work 2 jobs, and rarely have time to exercise or even cook.


Well, its not just me I'm basing this off of - its every single person I know basically. Everyone from 20-90. No one is obese. Many have children... more than one. Many are poor. All eat diets frequently similar to what I described. I work 60+ hours a week but that's besides the point. Anyone has time. Yoga etc. will SAVE you time, because you will do everything else so much more efficiently when you are mentally and physically healthy and balanced as it promotes, in the morning it will make you kick MAJOR ass because you will be so awake and pumping after your morning 15-30 minutes.
Also; do some research on the relationship between metabolism and diet, there is a fucking MASSIVE correlation between types of foods consumed and your metabolism - do you think 300 calories of MC D's is the same as 300 calories of avacado...? Which is btw, another incredible cheap food. Kale and fruit aren't expensive. Bananas and apples are cheap as fuuuuuuck.

What food would you eat though? I'm curious.

Oh yogurt is on da cheaps too :awesome: such a good food


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¿Check out some art m8?


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