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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,778
Loc: Lost In Space
Baghdad and al-Qa'eda
    #1497410 - 04/27/03 07:54 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

The proof that Saddam worked with bin Laden
By Inigo Gilmore
(Filed: 27/04/2003)


Iraqi intelligence documents discovered in Baghdad by The Telegraph have provided the first evidence of a direct link between Osama bin Laden's al-Qa'eda terrorist network and Saddam Hussein's regime.

Papers found yesterday in the bombed headquarters of the Mukhabarat, Iraq's intelligence service, reveal that an al-Qa'eda envoy was invited clandestinely to Baghdad in March 1998.

The documents show that the purpose of the meeting was to establish a relationship between Baghdad and al-Qa'eda based on their mutual hatred of America and Saudi Arabia. The meeting apparently went so well that it was extended by a week and ended with arrangements being discussed for bin Laden to visit Baghdad.

The papers will be seized on by Washington as the first proof of what the United States has long alleged - that, despite denials by both sides, Saddam's regime had a close relationship with al-Qa'eda.

The Telegraph found the file on bin Laden inside a folder lying in the rubble of one of the rooms of the destroyed intelligence HQ. There are three pages, stapled together; two are on paper headed with the insignia and lettering of the Mukhabarat.

They show correspondence between Mukhabarat agencies over preparations for the visit of al-Qa'eda's envoy, who travelled to Iraq from Sudan, where bin Laden had been based until 1996. They disclose what Baghdad hopes to achieve from the meeting, which took place less than five months before bin Laden was placed at the top of America's most wanted list following the bombing of two US embassies in east Africa.

Perhaps aware of the sensitivities of the subject matter, Iraqi agents at some point clumsily attempted to mask out all references to bin Laden, using white correcting fluid. The dried fluid was removed to reveal the clearly legible name three times in the documents.

One paper is marked "Top Secret and Urgent". It is signed "MDA", a codename believed to be the director of one of the intelligence sections within the Mukhabarat, and dated February 19, 1998. It refers to the planned trip from Sudan by bin Laden's unnamed envoy and refers to the arrangements for his visit.

A letter with this document says the envoy is a trusted confidant of bin Laden. It adds: "According to the above, we suggest permission to call the Khartoum station [Iraq's intelligence office in Sudan] to facilitate the travel arrangements for the above-mentioned person to Iraq. And that our body carry all the travel and hotel costs inside Iraq to gain the knowledge of the message from bin Laden and to convey to his envoy an oral message from us to bin Laden."

The letter refers to al-Qa'eda's leader as an opponent of the Saudi Arabian regime and says that the message to convey to him through the envoy "would relate to the future of our relationship with him, bin Laden, and to achieve a direct meeting with him."

According to handwritten notes at the bottom of the page, the letter was passed on through another director in the Mukhabarat and on to the deputy director general of the intelligence service.

It recommends that "the deputy director general bring the envoy to Iraq because we may find in this envoy a way to maintain contacts with bin Laden". The deputy director general has signed the document. All of the signatories use codenames.

The other documents then confirm that the envoy travelled from Khartoum to Baghdad in March 1998, staying at al-Mansour Melia, a first-class hotel. It mentions that his visit was extended by a week. In the notes in a margin, a name "Mohammed F. Mohammed Ahmed" is mentioned, but it is not clear whether this is the the envoy or an agent.

Intriguingly, the Iraqis talk about sending back an oral message to bin Laden, perhaps aware of the risk of a written message being intercepted. However, the documents do not mention if any meeting took place between bin Laden and Iraqi officials.

The file contradicts the claims of Baghdad, bin Laden and many critics of the coalition that there was no link between the Iraqi regime and al-Qa'eda. One Western intelligence official contacted last night described the file as "sensational", adding: "Baghdad clearly sought out the meeting. The regime would have wanted it to happen in the capital as it's only there they would feel safe from surveillance by Western intelligence."

Over the past three weeks, The Telegraph has discovered various other intelligence files in the wrecked Mukhabarat building, including documents revealing how Russia passed on to Iraq details of private conversations between Tony Blair and Silvio Berlusconi, the Italian prime minister, and how Germany held clandestine meetings with the regime.

A Downing Street spokesman said last night: "Since Saddam's fall a series of documents have come to light which will have to be fully assessed by the proper authorities over a period of time. We will certainly want to study these documents as part of that process to see if they shed new light on the relationship between Saddam's regime and al-Qa'eda.

The Link


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1497496 - 04/27/03 10:39 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Seems that lots of English journalists are finding interesting things in that building. Here's what CNN has to say (I haven't bothered to read the entire article in the Sunday Times yet) --

Separately, The Sunday Times reported that its own journalists had found documents in the Iraqi foreign ministry that indicate that France gave Saddam Hussein's regime regular reports on its dealings with American officials.

The newspaper said the documents reveal that Paris shared with Baghdad the contents of private transatlantic meetings and diplomatic traffic from Washington.

One document, dated September 25, 2001, from Iraqi foreign minister Naji Sabri to Saddam's palace, was based on a briefing from the French ambassador in Baghdad and covered talks between presidents Jacques Chirac and George W. Bush.


pinky


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InvisibleBuddha5254
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Registered: 04/23/00
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1497573 - 04/27/03 11:40 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

So France and Saddam Hussein were behind Sept 11? I knew it wasnt really just Bin Laden!


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,778
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1497631 - 04/27/03 12:12 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

So France and Saddam Hussein were behind Sept 11? I knew it wasnt really just Bin Laden!



I mentioned neither France nor 9-11 in my post. Are you unable to respond to the right person or merely obtuse?

I started this thread because several here have stated that since Saddam and Osama supposedly hated each other that there was no chance they would have ever helped one another. My stand was that they could have put aside their differences long enough to fight the Great Satan.

The link suggests that is indeed at least a strong possibility.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,778
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Phred]
    #1497638 - 04/27/03 12:13 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Seems that lots of English journalists are finding interesting things in that building. Here's what CNN has to say (I haven't bothered to read the entire article in the Sunday Times yet) --

Separately, The Sunday Times reported that its own journalists had found documents in the Iraqi foreign ministry that indicate that France gave Saddam Hussein's regime regular reports on its dealings with American officials.

The newspaper said the documents reveal that Paris shared with Baghdad the contents of private transatlantic meetings and diplomatic traffic from Washington.

One document, dated September 25, 2001, from Iraqi foreign minister Naji Sabri to Saddam's palace, was based on a briefing from the French ambassador in Baghdad and covered talks between presidents Jacques Chirac and George W. Bush.


pinky




Why is this no surprise?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinearabmobster
#1

Registered: 04/01/03
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1497648 - 04/27/03 12:18 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

its all bullshit


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1497649 - 04/27/03 12:18 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

So France and Saddam Hussein were behind Sept 11? I knew it wasnt really just Bin Laden!

LOL!

Yep, never mind that all the Sep 11 hijackers were Saudi's....IT WAS ALL SADDAMS FAULT!!  :grin: :grin:


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 33,778
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Xlea321]
    #1497695 - 04/27/03 12:48 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

So France and Saddam Hussein were behind Sept 11? I knew it wasnt really just Bin Laden!

LOL!

Yep, never mind that all the Sep 11 hijackers were Saudi's....IT WAS ALL SADDAMS FAULT!!  :grin: :grin: 



Other than Budda, no-one in this thread said anything like that.

Must suck being as obtuse as you. Must suck worse knowing you're a liar. My condolences to you Alpo.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1498164 - 04/27/03 05:09 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

If you had a brain you would be dangerous. Go and learn the first thing about Saddam and Bin Laden. You will find the idea of them working together and "Bin Laden visiting Baghdad" is laughable at best.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1498312 - 04/27/03 06:23 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Bin Laden and nearly all Muslims alike (extremist or moderate) dislike Saddam Hussein because his government was secular - Saddam's rebuttal was a public conversion to Islam (which occured a few years ago). The only terrorist ties Saddam ever had was with old school Palestinian groups such as that of Abu Nidal - Abu Nidal, who was an alcoholic and eventually killed himself; very Islamic. The only "ties" al Qaeda and Baghdad ever had was a shared hatred for the United States.


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Edited by Zahid (04/27/03 06:24 PM)


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Zahid]
    #1498326 - 04/27/03 06:32 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

"If you had a brain you would be dangerous. Go and learn the first thing about Saddam and Bin Laden. You will find the idea of them working together and "Bin Laden visiting Baghdad" is laughable at best. "

april 27th cbc news:

BAGHDAD - Secret documents uncovered in the bombed headquarters of Iraq's former spy agency show the first clear link between Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden's terrorist network, according to a Canadian journalist

The document, which refers to an al-Qaeda envoy's visit to Iraq in 1998, had bin Laden's name amateurishly covered with liquid whiteout, Potter told CBC Newsworld Saturday night.

"Very gingerly we lifted up all the liquid paper and revealed three times bin Laden's name," he said in a telephone interview from Baghdad.

"We just happened to have a very, very diligent interpreter with us today who went that extra mile and found something that was not meant for our eyes."

Several other Arabic translators have since been shown the document and confirmed that bin Laden's name is on it, according to the newspaper


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1498330 - 04/27/03 06:34 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

so....even the CBC is in on the conspiracy! a-ha!


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1498346 - 04/27/03 06:39 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

And this report is authentic because...?


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Zahid]
    #1498390 - 04/27/03 07:04 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

oh...its not authentic? so you are questioning the cbc's authenticity? is that it? hahahaha


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Anonymous

Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1498634 - 04/27/03 08:54 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

lol! That's a good one. Thanks for the laugh. Look at this story:

Documents link Iraq, bin Laden

Apparently the Toronto Star unearthed these same documents also. So which was it? The Star or the Telegraph? Did Hussein's secretary make several copies to be left around the office? These people have got to get their stories straight before they release this propaganda.

In other news, Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy were arrested today for millions of counts of breaking and entering...


Edited by Anonymous (04/27/03 08:55 PM)


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1498682 - 04/27/03 09:11 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

C'mon... white out? Saddam didn't run an elementary regime void of paper shredders and fire.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Zahid]
    #1498897 - 04/27/03 10:30 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

so, you guys are proposing that these two journalists are a part of a conspiracy, or that the us government planted the documents in the rubble?


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1499019 - 04/27/03 11:24 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Of course people are going to claim that. It doesn't support what they believe so it must be false.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: ]
    #1499059 - 04/27/03 11:39 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Max Headroom writes:

So which was it? The Star or the Telegraph?

I suggest you re-read the article in the link you provided, and compare the names of the reporters and the bylines on the articles posted here. This is what the Toronto Star has to say:

"Bin Laden's name appears three times in the handwritten Iraqi file, but each of the references was clumsily concealed with White-Out and then blackened with ink, "presumably by agents of the Mukhabarat," writes Potter, who was travelling with Amir and Inigo Gilmore of London's Sunday Telegraph."

Mystery solved through reading comprehension.

pinky


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Baghdad and al-Qa'eda [Re: Phred]
    #1499415 - 04/28/03 01:32 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Lets see if they "come across" the documents detailing Rumsfields role in selling Saddam chemical weapons...call me a cynic but strangely I doubt they will....


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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