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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized?
    #9873068 - 02/26/09 09:48 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I bought a 50lb bag of alfalfa cubes horse feed for use in 15% supplementation of straw for oyster grows as stated in GGMM.  I noticed though that the pellets are larger than I thought (1 inch thick) and they have been through a pelletizer extruder.  I also remember reading in GGMM that pelletizers have the ability to pasteurize the media since compression elevates temps above 160F for a split second but completely through the media.  So, I am going to soak and pasteurize the cubes as normal anyhow, but I wonder if the pelleted form is an added bonus.  They are not too dense and break apart with finger force.


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Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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OfflineJonat
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #9874555 - 02/27/09 05:29 AM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Yes, the heat-extruded pellets get a heat treatment when they are made. Should reduce the bacterial load, although the condition of the hay used to make the pellets is important (and somewhat variable). Keep us posted on how it works out.


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InvisibleJef
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Jonat]
    #9886401 - 02/28/09 07:18 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I've used the rabbit sized pellets with good success, but they are very hot with contaminants.  Having said that, they seem to sterilize very effectively in the PC.


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I am my own lab rat.


Tell me and I will forget. Show me and I will remember.  Involve me and I will learn.


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Jef]
    #9923055 - 03/06/09 01:50 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

OK, I have done a few test runs now with the alfalfa added.  For a 92qt tub for pasteurization I used about 1 1/2gal of alfalfa cubes.  The first 2 king oyster logs I made with 1part paper, 2part straw, and 2 cups plaster mixed with about a qt of water.  After 2 days at 70-73F the logs began to stink of bacteria and the inside of the plastic was very wet, and the logs were very warm due to the bacteria.  I thought that probably they were getting too much water retained from the paper and wetted plaster, causing bacteria to get a hold.  So, I made 2 more logs with no paper, added the same amount alfalfa, and added 2 heaping cups dry plaster to the pasteurized mix.  The resulting logs had a good dry look to them.  After 2 days one of the logs began to ferment and the inside of the plastic became wet again.  The other log still had a dry look to it but both logs had a warmer than normal feel.  So I tossed the wet log and put the other one in a cooler room.  After 4 days it is not stinking, but it is looking iffy.

My thoughts are that I am probably adding too much alfalfa at the start, and I will have to do some more trials with less.  Otherwise it is definitely some nutritious stuff being that bacteria is setting in so fast.


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Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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Offlineb3jamboree
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #9923516 - 03/06/09 03:06 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Please keep us posted on this. I have been seriously considering supplementing with some sort of legume to boost yields. You could save me alot of time, money and heartbreak.


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OfflineMycelio
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #9928275 - 03/07/09 01:08 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I successfully used straw with alfalfa and coffee grounds, but instead of pasteurizing I fermented it anaerobically by having it under water at room temperature for four days up to a week. Oysters love that.

Carsten


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Mycelio]
    #10053399 - 03/27/09 12:47 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

Well I finally got around to trying out another king oyster straw log using half as much alfalfa (about 1/2 - 3/4 gal of cubes).  I have it colonizing at 60F in my basement and it is not heating up, 2 days and everything looks normal so far.


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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InvisibleJef
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10054864 - 03/27/09 04:18 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

IMO any unsterilized alfalfa will contam. My intuition told me to use it with sawdust on a dung lover grow. Worked great fruited from the jar.

Not to HiJack, but I used orange lentils during the same period, also sterilized,and with sawdust for dung lovers. In each case it was 10-15% supplement and the rest deciduous tree sawdust.

IMO lentils are a great supplement, but like alfalfa, probably stink like hell if contammed.

Keep us posted.  Each of us crazies has too many ideas to try them all ourself.  We need to share.


--------------------
I am my own lab rat.


Tell me and I will forget. Show me and I will remember.  Involve me and I will learn.


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Jef]
    #10110884 - 04/05/09 02:46 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Well this log is a success.  It does seem that the mycellium has a harder time eating through the alfalfa where it is a little clumped, but otherwise it is pinning.  I'll give yield report and pic soon.


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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InvisibleJef
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10110970 - 04/05/09 03:00 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Wow, nice.

Do you think there were contams and the oysters ate them or do you think it remained contam free ?

Was there an unexpected smell ?

Looking forward to your pics and yield.

Glad to be wrong about this one.


--------------------
I am my own lab rat.


Tell me and I will forget. Show me and I will remember.  Involve me and I will learn.


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Jef]
    #10110975 - 04/05/09 03:02 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

it is and was contam free


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10132343 - 04/08/09 07:11 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Log pinning:


Notice area around clump of alfalfa pinning but mycellium having a hard time penetrating it (looks like trich but not)  I would say it is important to make sure the alfalfa is evenly spread with no clumps:


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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InvisibleMushMushi
Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 480
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10135131 - 04/09/09 09:40 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

nice :smile:

Where did you get your bag ?


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: MushMushi]
    #10136264 - 04/09/09 01:04 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Cant remember, it is poly tubing i bought 750ft roll.


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10183814 - 04/17/09 10:34 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Well I picked the fruits today.  It totaled 4 1/2lbs, which is about 1lb more than I would get from a plain straw log that size.  So definitely an improvement.

My next experiment is to use the alfalfa on bleach bathed straw/cottonseed hulls without creating too much heat.  My bleached logs require 2 bags spawn a piece to colonize quick enough which generates lots of heat anyhow.  In a 60F basement they still get luke warm to the touch.


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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OfflineParesthesia
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Buckeye Oysters]
    #10184059 - 04/17/09 11:29 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

How does that yield compare to kings on supplemented sawdust?  I've been adding composted manure, coffee grounds or worm castings to my oyster grows for a while now and they really seem to like it.  They also seem to taste better than those I grow on straight paper.


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"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."

- T. S. Eliot


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OfflineBuckeye Oysters
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Re: Alfalfa cubes appear extruded?...auto pasteurized? [Re: Paresthesia]
    #10185317 - 04/17/09 02:59 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

I have not worked with sawdust yet.


--------------------
Evolution is Lamarckism in disguise.  Adaptation never creates a new species or trait, but rather the new species/trait always existed within the parent DNA until circumstances allowed it to be activated.  For instance, every wolf has the DNA for poodles, but that DNA would never be revealed without man selectively breeding for it.


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