|
 BlueCoyote
Beyond
 
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
|
|
Without your conscious mind, u would be just a pile of flesh starring into nothingness, duh. If that's what life is for you...
|
 Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area 
|
|
Yes, sentience. 
--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan   fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
Quote:
BlueCoyote said:
Without your conscious mind, u would be just a pile of flesh starring into nothingness, duh. If that's what life is for you...
I'm not saying the conscious mind is unnecessary to experience life, I'm saying that we do not have to be controlled by it. The conscious mind is the valuable tool we use to interpret our senses/feelings/thoughts. We can control what we want the conscious mind to bring to life.
I'm trying to say we are not using the mind for it's true purpose by dwelling on the past and worrying about the future; or relying on myths/traditions about the truth of life and death rather than seeking it for ourselves. We must use the mind for it's ultimate purpose, to find the truth in the present. The truth can be known, and it will change mankind.
However, life is beyond our mental understanding, because it is infinite. We can know what life does, but we cannot know what it is. We can only be life. Life/Nature equates to the concept of God to me. Infinite, eternal, omniscient, omnipresent, perfectly balanced. Life/Nature/God is everything.
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
|
|
Life is not infinite, nor eternal. Sorry  Maybe you use different definitions of words than me 
I think, if there's a metaphysical (or spiritual) realm, and we will exist there somehow after (or while) life, this specific existence will not be called 'life'.
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
I equate life to nature and the concept of God, so it is eternal and infinite because Life/Nature/God is everything. Life is not measurable, and is completely beyond mental understanding because it is infinite. We can only be/reflect life. What is your definition of life? Do you see life as the period between birth and death?
Our perceived world in our minds is not eternal, because the conscious mind dies at physical death, as it is a part of the brain/body; the world (thoughts/memories/reality/logic) ends every time someone dies. I infer that is the definition of "life" you are referring to.
I think the collective unconscious mind, or universal mind, that I was referring to in my last post, is the spiritual realm you speak of. Existence in the "spiritual" realm would be like a transition from one life to another, as life changes forms and cannot be created nor destroyed. I think that our highest point of awareness in each life is locked into the collective unconscious mind, and through the transition period after physical death (where perception does not exist), life takes new form with the awareness previously reached in the collective unconscious. That is how evolution is defined in my mind.
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
|
|
I see 'life' as something 'physical'.
Eternal life only applies to mystical/spiritual or metaphysical contexts, which is yet to be proven true...
Life on our planet could be destroyed entirely if an accordingly big meteor would hit our planet and we still don't know what makes life outside our limited vision/version of what we are able to perceive.
|
deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
|
|
I liked the parts that I briefly skimmed through! Hopefully I'll find some time to read all 400 pages, though. 
--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
  
|
redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
|
|
from now on I will not attempt to confuse you with the facts since you have established that you are clearly interested only in the "other" kind of truth
--------------------
 _  🧠_ 
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
Your facts don't confuse me, I welcome any input. Please, state your facts and opinions.
What do you mean by the "other" kind of truth?
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
|
|
I think the truth can be known by humanity, and that it is ultimately the same for everyone.
How can that be when we disagree. Are you saying you're wrong? Because I know I'm right.
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
Quote:
Icelander said:
How can that be when we disagree. Are you saying you're wrong? Because I know I'm right.
You are right about what? The fact that our minds disagree?
Or are you saying that you know the truth? If so, please share your insights, or submit an entry to the contest. You can only help yourself by enlightening others.
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
|
|
OK here's my truth. Nobody knows the truth and those that say they do are the farthest from it.
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
Quote:
Nobody knows the truth and those that say they do are the farthest from it.
A very good point. Those who claim to know the truth are the farthest away, because one must seek the truth to find it. Someone who really wants to find the truth is always seeking, no matter how close they think they are. Do you believe that it is not possible to find the truth if we seek?
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
Trepiodos
Disgustipated
Registered: 06/30/06
Posts: 469
Loc: Los Angeles County Jail
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
|
|
Quote:
Icelander said:
OK here's my truth. Nobody knows the truth and those that say they do are the farthest from it.
--------------------
And as things fell apart,
Nobody paid much attention...
- David Byrne, '(Nothing But) Flowers' from the Talking Heads' album, 'Naked'
|
learningtofly
Ancient Aliens
Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 15,105
Loc: Out of this world
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
|
|
Quote:
Jethro Tull said:
Quote:
So you say that the truth is self-evident to you but you don't know what the truth is? And you also said that the truth is the present? Quit contradicting yourself.
The truth is self-evident to me, but I'm not going to come out and say "I know what the truth is, indefinitely." There is always more to learn and I will always be seeking better ways to define and spread the truth. As of right now, "The Present," both the book and the perpetual moment, are the best ways I have found.
Quote:
Truth for humanity cannot be known because of the limit of our knowledge, by which I mean time, perspective, and that we don't have all the facts.
I agree that we don't have all the facts, but I'd say that we have enough of them, based on intuition and learning from the past. I think the truth can be known by humanity, and that it is ultimately the same for everyone. Who is to say we can't know it now, just because we haven't been able to know it before?
The truth is what can unite everyone; we are all the same, there is no reason we should look at another and think we are different from them. Separation and difference are deceptions of the mind. We are all reflections of life; we are all the same. I think the ultimate truth can unify everyone.
In order to know the truth you need to know every single fact, which is impossible because we are not gods. We can use probability to determine what is most likely the truth given the status quo. However that is as close as we will get. The truth CAN'T be known by humanity because the truth is objective and no human being is objective. As for "who is to say just because we haven't before, why can't we now?" Because we are limited by time and we cannot know the future, nor exactly what happened in the past because everything written down is bias to some degree.
--------------------
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
Quote:
In order to know the truth you need to know every single fact, which is impossible because we are not gods. We can use probability to determine what is most likely the truth given the status quo. However that is as close as we will get. The truth CAN'T be known by humanity because the truth is objective and no human being is objective. As for "who is to say just because we haven't before, why can't we now?" Because we are limited by time and we cannot know the future, nor exactly what happened in the past because everything written down is bias to some degree.
There is always more to seek out and learn regarding what the truth is, because there are always more facts. Just because we can't know all the facts doesn't mean we shouldn't try to seek the truth. I think that the truth can become self-evident within the individual; I see truth in everything I encounter in the present moment, although I may not know every fact that exists. I don't know everything/all the facts, it is impossible, like you said, we are not gods. The truth is in the present moment, we can only find it now. Knowing all the facts would be knowing the whole truth, all the truths, which is not necessary nor possible for us. Seeing the truth in the present moment is something we can do. Do you think that the truth is the same for everyone? It may not mean the same thing for everyone, but is it the same?
"can use probability to determine what is most likely the truth.." is exactly what "The Present" does. I'd like to read your opinions about the book, you seem interested in this topic.
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
teeter
Mindfucked
Registered: 02/07/09
Posts: 1,092
Loc: Philadelphia PA
Last seen: 3 months, 30 days
|
 Re: The Present  [Re: xFrockx]
#9817974 - 02/18/09 12:35 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
|
|
hey this post is 100% irrelevant...disregard it, i just want to be able to keep this thread in the "My Threads" section so i wont forget to read it
peace
--------------------
"If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things through narrow chinks of his cavern." - William Blake
"Psychedelics helped me to escape.. albeit momentarily.. from the prison of my mind. It over-rode the habit patterns of thought and I was able to taste innocence again. Looking at sensations freshly without the conceptual overlay was very profound." - Ram Das
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
|
|
Quote:
Jethro Tull said:
Quote:
Nobody knows the truth and those that say they do are the farthest from it.
A very good point. Those who claim to know the truth are the farthest away, because one must seek the truth to find it. Someone who really wants to find the truth is always seeking, no matter how close they think they are. Do you believe that it is not possible to find the truth if we seek?
Yes, not possible to find any ultimate truths. Seeking "truth" is a normal and natural way to attempt to relieve anxiety.
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
|
Jethro Tull
Oneness
Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 467
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
|
|
What is your definition of 'ultimate truths'? I'd say that we cannot know everything, every fact, but we can find the truth in the present moment, so it is not necessary and impossible to know everything. The present is the ultimate truth from each individual perspective, because one cannot seek the truth anywhere else. Seeking the truth in whatever you experience in the present moment is the ultimate way to remove not only anxiety, but all negative aspects of the mind. You no longer dwell in the past, and you no longer worry about the future. It is not only a normal/natural way, it is the only way to truly live.
--------------------
..and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
DC at: Oneness
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
|
|
Well let me put it this way. Any "truth" that is not self evident to 99 44/100% of the population is subjective and therefore suspect. In other words just because you believe it's true don't make it so. Many of your statements are subjective and unsubstantiated outside of yourself and so don't mean shit as universal truth. This is a common problem here IMO.
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
|
|
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Red Vein Kratom 
Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order
Edit 
Reply 
1 2 all )
redgreenvines
Deiymiyan
RationalEgo
Gomp
BleaK
Droz