Home | Community | Message Board

Sporeworks
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | Next >  [ show all ]
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
OfflineDr. uarewotueat Happy Birthday!
Peyote Farmer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 16,545
Loc: Uk / Philippines
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti.
    #9614254 - 01/15/09 12:09 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

obviously we all know that lophophora williamsii is scheduled in the US due its mescaline content.
personally i am fortunate enough to live in a country where this species is legal.
in the uk it only becomes an offence when you extract the mescaline, dried cactus has also been proved to be legal here in a recent court case.

i believe that the same is true of trichocereus in the US, it is perfectly legal to posses these plants unless one starts to prepare the cactus, extracting the alkaloids or drying, at this point it becomes illegal.

this is my personal interpretation anyway, did i miss something?

surely if mescaline containing trichocereus were illegal in the US (as a certain member of this forum seems to believe) then the plant would be scheduled and illegal to posses and buy, or sell...

as this is not the case and mescaline containing trichocereus can be bought at any number of places, surely one cannot deem the plant to be illegal under US law.

this thread is really for TreeMoss to have a good rant rather than jacking other peoples threads.
so there ya go, have at it.

:crankey:


--------------------
View My Gallery


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleLedd
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 1,200
Loc: Innerspace Flag
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #9614346 - 01/15/09 12:22 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Yes it is legal up to and including cuttings for the means of propagation. Any intent to treat it as a mescalin product including all preparation after cutting makes it a schedule 1 substance fresh, dried, potpourri, or anything else.

I have notified ebay about two sellers selling dried tricho skin and dried powder. It would be nice to have those removed before someone does something stupid and Trichos join salvia on the island of misfit ebay "drugs."


--------------------
We mean nothing we do not mean to do.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinedistgre1
...
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 831
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Ledd]
    #9614557 - 01/15/09 01:00 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)



Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDr. uarewotueat Happy Birthday!
Peyote Farmer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 16,545
Loc: Uk / Philippines
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: distgre1]
    #9614627 - 01/15/09 01:13 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

shes gotta lotta ass, that dress is gonna burst :lol:

LB: that's pretty much how i see it too.


--------------------
View My Gallery


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleKBG1977
Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 11,017
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: distgre1]
    #9614634 - 01/15/09 01:14 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

WOW,that is a fine specimen.I want one:grin:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMankey
Male

Registered: 07/30/05
Posts: 2,203
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: KBG1977]
    #9614676 - 01/15/09 01:23 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Here's what I found regarding legality in the US.

Quote:


69. Where Congress has sought to designate a plant, rather than a chemical substance, as one restricted under the CSA, it has done so explicitly. For example, the CSA lists the peyote cactus as a Schedule I controlled substance. The CSA lists the chemical agent found in peyote, mescaline, separately.




Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDr. uarewotueat Happy Birthday!
Peyote Farmer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 16,545
Loc: Uk / Philippines
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Mankey]
    #9614695 - 01/15/09 01:28 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

so that basically means that a plant containing mescaline that is not listed is legal right?


--------------------
View My Gallery


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMankey
Male

Registered: 07/30/05
Posts: 2,203
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #9614741 - 01/15/09 01:37 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Yup. I believe so.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleKBG1977
Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 11,017
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: KBG1977] * 1
    #9614797 - 01/15/09 01:47 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Who cares about the plant,look at that ass:crazy2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleLedd
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 1,200
Loc: Innerspace Flag
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Mankey]
    #9614803 - 01/15/09 01:49 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Maybe, because mescaline being "listed separately" still means it is listed. This might be a similar case as Florida mushroom laws, where picking wild psilocybin mushrooms is only illegal upon confession of knowledge of its psychoactive chemicals.

If prosecutors pushed intent and you didn't have a good lawyer you might be in a pickle. But with the readily available supply out there it seems there would need to be a death pushed hard by the media to get any action. Under those circumstances, vendors would be getting the heat more than any one individual possessor.


--------------------
We mean nothing we do not mean to do.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDr. uarewotueat Happy Birthday!
Peyote Farmer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 16,545
Loc: Uk / Philippines
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Ledd]
    #9614822 - 01/15/09 01:54 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

similar situation to how psilocybin mushrooms were treated under uk law until 2005.
it was perfectly legal to grow, pick and posess fresh mushrooms, in the written law it said something about them becoming illegal when "altered by human hand" which meant they became illegal when dried or prepared.
thanks to idiots who can't handle their shrooms that loophole has now been closed.


--------------------
View My Gallery


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblejds


Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 3,083
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #9615237 - 01/15/09 03:10 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Is USA the only country where peyote is illegal? I don't hear of many other countries with it illegal. It's even legal here in Canada and I bought one online not long ago...


--------------------
“No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride...and if it occasionally gets a little heavier than what you had in mind, well...maybe chalk it off to forced conscious expansion: Tune in, freak out, get beaten.”

― Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDr. uarewotueat Happy Birthday!
Peyote Farmer
Male User Gallery

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 16,545
Loc: Uk / Philippines
Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: jds]
    #9615271 - 01/15/09 03:15 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

so far as i am aware the US is the only place, but there could well be others which i am not aware of :shrug:


--------------------
View My Gallery


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelqdtrance
Hunter
Male


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 2,373
Loc: NY
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #9616710 - 01/15/09 06:47 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Wheres the ass? (besides me)  :smirk:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineAlan RockefellerM
Mycologist
Male User Gallery

Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 47,919
Last seen: 14 hours, 8 minutes
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #9616924 - 01/15/09 07:22 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

i believe that the same is true of trichocereus in the US, it is perfectly legal to posses these plants unless one starts to prepare the cactus, extracting the alkaloids or drying, at this point it becomes illegal.

this is my personal interpretation anyway, did i miss something?




All plants that contain controlled substances are illegal under the federal controlled substances act.  It makes no difference if you are just growing it for ornamental purposes - the law has no exception for ornamental plants.

Under US law, you can be charged with possession of mescaline if you know that the cactus you are growing contains mescaline.  Preparation has nothing to do with it except that it can be used to show that you knowingly possessed a drug.

Quote:

surely if mescaline containing trichocereus were illegal in the US (as a certain member of this forum seems to believe) then the plant would be scheduled and illegal to posses and buy, or sell...




They do not need to schedule the actual plant because they scheduled one of the substances in the plant.

Its the same with mushrooms - They do not schedule every active species of mushroom. Adding psilocybin to the controlled substances act made them all illegal at once.

Quote:

as this is not the case and mescaline containing trichocereus can be bought at any number of places, surely one cannot deem the plant to be illegal under US law.




Availability does not imply legality. 

For example, poppy seeds can be purchased at every grocery store in the country.  These seeds do contain morphine, in fact its enough to get high.  If you know that they contain any amount and you buy the seeds anyway (even if you buy them for food), you are in possession of a controlled substance which is just as illegal as pure heroin.  A couple pounds in your kitchen could have someone sent away for life.    If they are baked into poppyseed bagels they become even more illegal because then the weight of the bagel gets added to the weight of the seeds when determining how much morphine you have.

Quote:

Ledbonzo86 said: Yes it is legal up to and including cuttings for the means of propagation. Any intent to treat it as a mescalin product including all preparation after cutting makes it a schedule 1 substance fresh, dried, potpourri, or anything else.




Mescaline has the exact same legal status as Psilocybin.  You do not need to prepare your psilocybin mushrooms to get busted for them.  Just having them around is enough.

Gram per gram, live san pedro cactus is just as legal as Psilocybe cubensis or 2c-b.  The guy who owns a several thousand pound san pedro in his front yard is in possession of several thousands of pounds of a controlled substance, but only if he knows what it is.  The law has no provisions to get you off because its just for decoration.  A jury would be instructed to convict you but they might notice how stupid the law was and nullify it, but only if you get an extremely cool jury.

Luckily there have not been any prosecutions except for dried plant material.  Mostly because the cops don't test everything in your house for drugs, they just test the things that look or smell like drugs for drugs.

Quote:

Ledbonzo86 said: I agree with all of that except the knowing part, it doesn't matter according to the law if you know they do or not.....ignorance is never justified.




Actually, not knowing is one of the only defenses allowed when defending case involving the federal controlled substances act.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse, however the controlled substances act only applies if you knowingly or intentionally possess, manufacture or distribute a controlled substance.

See USC 841 section a.

Therefore it is only illegal to grow or possess san pedro (or any other drug) if you know what it is.

In the same way, psilocybin mushrooms are not illegal if you pick a whole bunch of random mushrooms and you don't know what any of them are.  It is not illegal to distribute narcotics if someone tricks you into it, (for example the mailman) unless they can prove you "should have known".


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineSurad
Stranger


Registered: 01/07/09
Posts: 197
Last seen: 8 years, 20 days
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #9617042 - 01/15/09 07:36 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

damn his post has me all shooken up right now, but im still pretty sure if cops raided your house and hypothetically found pounds of weed in your basement they wouldn't bother with dried cactus cuttings in your kitchen they probably look like a vegetable, mostly it seems like the only reason a cop would find it in your house would be if they were searching for something else and if they're searching for something else they probably don't even care about this dried up veggie. The plant itself i doubt any cop would eye out and check for chemicals, if they did that they would have they're labs backed up w/ random house plants.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineethnoguy
"Raper of Mother Nature"
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/03/07
Posts: 3,915
Loc: your momma's house
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Ledd]
    #9617734 - 01/15/09 09:29 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ledbonzo86 said:
Yes it is legal up to and including cuttings for the means of propagation. Any intent to treat it as a mescalin product including all preparation after cutting makes it a schedule 1 substance fresh, dried, potpourri, or anything else.

I have notified ebay about two sellers selling dried tricho skin and dried powder. It would be nice to have those removed before someone does something stupid and Tricho


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineethnoguy
"Raper of Mother Nature"
Male User Gallery


Registered: 10/03/07
Posts: 3,915
Loc: your momma's house
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Ledd]
    #9617735 - 01/15/09 09:29 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ledbonzo86 said:
Yes it is legal up to and including cuttings for the means of propagation. Any intent to treat it as a mescalin product including all preparation after cutting makes it a schedule 1 substance fresh, dried, potpourri, or anything else.

I have notified ebay about two sellers selling dried tricho skin and dried powder. It would be nice to have those removed before someone does something stupid and Trichos join salvia on the island of misfit ebay "drugs."




Well, I'm glad I haven't sold any on there in a long time. That's a pretty shitty thing to do to someone. You know, snitching.

EG


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblejds


Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 3,083
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: ethnoguy]
    #9617753 - 01/15/09 09:33 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I won't let anyone take my cacti away from me :crankey:


--------------------
“No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride...and if it occasionally gets a little heavier than what you had in mind, well...maybe chalk it off to forced conscious expansion: Tune in, freak out, get beaten.”

― Hunter S. Thompson, Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinemelfdis
Strangerer

Registered: 07/22/07
Posts: 302
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
Re: Legality Of Trichocereus And Other Mescaline Containing Cacti. [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #9618141 - 01/15/09 10:46 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:


Availability does not imply legality. 

For example, poppy seeds can be purchased at every grocery store in the country.  These seeds do contain morphine, in fact its enough to get high.  If you know that they contain any amount and you buy the seeds anyway (even if you buy them for food), you are in possession of a controlled substance which is just as illegal as pure heroin.  A couple pounds in your kitchen could have someone sent away for life.    If they are baked into poppyseed bagels they become even more illegal because then the weight of the bagel gets added to the weight of the seeds when determining how much morphine you have.





Poppy seeds are specifically exempted in the controlled substance act. The DEA lost its federal court case (HIA v. DEA -2004) with this same exact type of reasoning dealing with trace amounts of thc in hemp seeds (also specifically exempted by the CSA).


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale   Mushroom-Hut Mono Tub Substrate   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Capsules


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* list of mescaline cacti in order 5meopsyco 18,221 5 10/06/05 10:05 PM
by spudamore
* Species of cacti that have mescaline,list please??? bluelou 2,989 11 07/12/05 12:07 PM
by Chemical_Bliss
* Am I the only one who has a love/hate relationship with Cacti??? NESpores 1,670 6 10/25/05 04:21 PM
by cvele
* Canadian Law and the Magical Cacti...3rd time the charm kadakuda 2,691 17 01/13/05 05:12 PM
by ShroomyTunes
* Recommended legal psychoactive plants to grow.
( 1 2 3 4 all )
JaguarWarrior101 31,844 66 10/28/08 11:22 PM
by kadakuda
* Peruvian Torch/San Pedro legality? myndreach 3,182 4 04/25/05 12:29 PM
by myndreach
* mescaline-bearing cacti Anonymous 2,061 14 09/17/03 06:42 PM
by DailyPot
* How much dried material do wet cacti make? Tantalus 1,652 13 07/30/03 09:08 PM
by Tantalus

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Mostly_Harmless
11,921 topic views. 0 members, 7 guests and 0 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2023 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.03 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 16 queries.