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OfflineParesthesia
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Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites
    #9473681 - 12/21/08 04:31 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

I'll try and keep this story short, but I have to explain!  Argh.  I started by inoculating two spawn jars with maitake LC.  One was grain, the other a mixture of grain and sawdust.  The sawdust jar raced ahead, and I spawned it to a sawdust block, although there was some difficulty getting the spawn out of the jar.  I more or less ended up burying a solid chunk in the middle of the block, which colonized in a little over a week.

The grain jar lagged behind, and I ended up spawning it to a block ten days later.  Maitake seems to have a much easier time with sawdust than with grain, because this block was fully colonized after about six days.  If the colonization time seems fast, that may be because I'm using pine cat litter sawdust.  This stuff is much less dense than hardwood sawdust.

So both blocks have been sitting on a shelf waiting for a time that I think they're ready to fruit.  I'm not sure of when that will be.  I'll just feel it, in my gut.  Here they are.





I've observed the following differences in each bag:

Bag 1 (sawdust to sawdust) seems to have a smaller plenum in the bag.  The block is fully colonized and it just seems inactive.  There's a little metabolite buildup in the bag, but it's pretty much clear.

Bag 2 (grain to sawdust) is much more active!  There's a 1/2" thick layer of solid mycelium on the top.  Also, it's making a LOT of metabolites.  I drained off maybe 1/4 cup from that bag before I took the pictures.

This is my first maitake cultivation experience.  What could cause the differences here?  Is the second bag ready to fruit?


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"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."

- T. S. Eliot


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Invisiblegreys
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: Paresthesia]
    #9473689 - 12/21/08 04:33 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

i fruit maitake on white oak supplemented with millet.

ive heard that if you fruit maitake on pine they dont taste so good...but have no empirical proof.


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:greys:


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OfflineParesthesia
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: greys]
    #9473721 - 12/21/08 04:41 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

The pine sawdust is from wood pellet fuel.  It's been purified and heat treated to remove the resins and impurities.  This is important for its use as fuel for heating.  I've used it for lots of edibles and everything's tasted fine to me!


--------------------
"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."

- T. S. Eliot


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Invisiblegreys
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: Paresthesia]
    #9473841 - 12/21/08 05:02 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

i tried using pellet fuel as sawdust without good results...everything ran pretty slow. i had one bag take 60 days to finish. it was easy to use though...and nothing contammed- so at least it had that going for it.

it was hardwood pellet fuel though, not pine.


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:greys:


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Offlinedenger
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: Paresthesia]
    #9473976 - 12/21/08 05:30 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

P: Maitake takes a while after they colonize the substrate to be able to fruit. They need time to digest the substrate and build up the reserves in the mycelial net. Basically, judging from the dates on the bags you're looking at end of January before you can start inducing them.
Maitake is very, VERY resilient to contaminations, but when contaminants are present, they produce a lot of metabolic liquid. I bet that's what happening to your second bag. Thick mycelial build-up is also an indication of the same. It still will fruit, but will produce less because it lost so much moisture already.
Good luck.


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OfflineParesthesia
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: denger]
    #9474808 - 12/21/08 08:05 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Now that is unfortunate.  I'm going to have to start up a lot more blocks if I hope to support a pound-a-day maitake habit!  Thanks for the info.


--------------------
"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."

- T. S. Eliot


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Offlinesolumvita
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: denger]
    #9476341 - 12/22/08 02:05 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

denger said:

It still will fruit, but will produce less because it lost so much moisture already.
Good luck.





Hey P, not wanting to change your thread, but I wondered if maybe you can replace the water lost by injecting that quarter cup back into the block?  What do you think Denger?

Ciao


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One of these days all the answers will be revealed until then we learn from each other!

www.mushrush.co.za


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OfflineParesthesia
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: solumvita]
    #9476711 - 12/22/08 05:18 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

I was at a feed store this weekend and I found some 60cc syringes with luer lock connectors!  Even if syringes can't withstand repeated autoclaving, what about the needles?

I'm going to try the syringe thing on some of the blocks I'm fruiting outside now.  That block is definitely lighter now that I drained it, but I'm going to wait until both blocks are ready to fruit before I inject them.  RR mentions giving his blocks a soak before he puts them into fruiting conditions,

I'm still amazed by how quickly this culture seems to grow on sawdust!  I was expecting it to be a lot fussier.  I guess the real challenge with maitake is getting it to fruit!  I'm definitely going to try expanding a jar of spawn onto pasteurized cardboard so I can attempt a bunker bag grow.  If it works in wood chip beds, it will surely work in a bag!


--------------------
"We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time."

- T. S. Eliot


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Offlinedenger
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: solumvita]
    #9476843 - 12/22/08 07:05 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

solumvita: Usually, they are soaked after the first flush, but I suppose you're correct that if it loses a lot of water before the first fruiting, it makes sense to dunk them. That means they have to be taken out of the bags entirely, so they will not produce these desirable clusters, but at least they will produce.


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Offlinesolumvita
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: denger]
    #9477003 - 12/22/08 08:23 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah that was the question, because of the loss of water prior to first flush, through the excess metabolite production, would it be worthwhile to replace the water via injection and not dunking?  that way it can be kept in the bag, especially as P knows the amount of water lost?

P: Not sure re the needles, but most likely not, unless they are all steel or polypropylene.


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One of these days all the answers will be revealed until then we learn from each other!

www.mushrush.co.za


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Offlinedenger
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: solumvita]
    #9477057 - 12/22/08 08:50 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

I tried injections and they do not work as well as dunking. Basically, water pools in cavities inside the block. It does get heavy, but most of the water is not being used.
Both needles and syringes can be reused by cleaning in boiling water. Big needles are usually all-steel (no plastic base) and these can be PC'd.


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Offlinesolumvita
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: denger]
    #9477188 - 12/22/08 09:19 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

what a pity :frown:, oh well then got some blocks to dunk


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One of these days all the answers will be revealed until then we learn from each other!

www.mushrush.co.za


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Invisibleshroomophile
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Re: Maitake, Fruiting, Waste Metabolites [Re: denger]
    #9490877 - 12/24/08 08:23 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

I play with the maitaki,but i usually make a few from wild cultures and see if they will fruit in the lab.They are common where i live so i don't try to grow in bulk indoors.Both of those bags should fruit as they look completely colonized.


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Once the mighty oak,was a nut who held his ground.


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