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Offlinesally
Just Me.
Registered: 11/14/08
Posts: 39
Last seen: 12 years, 5 days
using plastics instead of glass
    #9481048 - 12/22/08 11:21 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

so ive seen a few posts recently about using those re-usable plastic ziploc/Gladware containers as a substitute for glass jars in the PF tek.  fungus is digestive in nature, and reading through old posts, people have said that the enzymes produced by mycelium can eat holes through aluminum trays.  could the digestive process also be working on these plastic containers, and if so does that mean that things in the plastic could be leeching into the mycelium?

for example, people say youre not supposed to re-use plastic water bottles (or even see-through nalgenes) because chemicals in the plastic can leech into the water, and they are known carcinogens.  could the same thing be happening with mycelium in plastic containers?


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o rly?

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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: sally]
    #9481059 - 12/22/08 11:23 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Its generally non reactive.  Shouldn't cause a problem, people use plastic trays all the time for their grows including black trashbags as liners.


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InvisibleShroominit
Part Time Mycologist


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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: sally]
    #9481075 - 12/22/08 11:25 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Mycelium does not eat plastic and should be fine in those containers.

In order to re-use plastic (unlike water bottles) it must have a certain chemical composition which is classified as 'non-leeching' plastic. You know a plastic thermos that is used to store hot liquid and keep it hot? That is an example of non-leeching plastic material.

Usually the glad boxes are microwave/dishwasher safe and made of polypropylene aka "thermoplastic polymer" which is very heat safe and will not give off toxins or carcinogens.

(Hope that helps)

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InvisibleJ3illy
Trainee

Registered: 10/18/08
Posts: 3,344
Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: sally]
    #9481082 - 12/22/08 11:26 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

sally said:
for example, people say youre not supposed to re-use plastic water bottles (or even see-through nalgenes) because chemicals in the plastic can leech into the water, and they are known carcinogens.




Can you show proof of this?  I don't see how it's possible, or that there's carcinogens in plastic containers.  Why would they EVER allow carcinogens in them if this were the case?

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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481116 - 12/22/08 11:33 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Plastic just generally isn't good for you.  A lot of petroleum byproducts contain chemicals known to be carcinogenic.  Either way even if the plastic did or did not contain carcinogens you would have to expose the myc to it for quite a while to cause damage to it.

Within the human body carcinogens are not effective with a proper PH range.


--------------------
Don't believe everything you think.  TRADE LIST

‹Sell Your Soul› You know this place is owned and operated by the Illuminati, right?
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Offlinesally
Just Me.
Registered: 11/14/08
Posts: 39
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: J3illy]
    #9481130 - 12/22/08 11:37 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

nalgene bottles leech out the chemical Bispheonol-A (BPA) at room temperature.  BPA is a known carcinogen.  you can just google "nalgene BPA" to find a bunch of stuff about it.


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InvisibleShroominit
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: J3illy]
    #9481136 - 12/22/08 11:38 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

J3illy said:
Can you show proof of this?  I don't see how it's possible, or that there's carcinogens in plastic containers.  Why would they EVER allow carcinogens in them if this were the case?




Billy, water bottles with the thin clear plastic are not polypropylene and do not do well under extreme temperatures. It is fairly common knowledge that the plastics 'leech' toxic chemicals into the liquids inside if they are heated or cooled past a certain point.
Try "leeching water bottle" in google to see what I mean.


Edit: Aha sally beat me to it.

Sally, polypropylene is non-leeching, should be OK.

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InvisibleJ3illy
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481141 - 12/22/08 11:39 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

What throws me off, is I've seen stuff about ppl getting a water purifier, and just reusing plastic water bottles.  I kno ppl that do this, and if there were a big hazard about doing it, I'd think I would have heard something about it.

Actually I just searched - it's a myth.


Quote:

Leeching of Plasticizers

There has been a lot of discussion in the news in the past few years about the dangers of chemicals that could leech out of plastic bottles into the water they contain. This hysteria started with a student's senior thesis about an obscure type of plastic typically not used in water bottles. Her study suggested that the plasticizers could leech into water if the bottles were heated or frozen. Although the study was only concerned with a plastic not used in commercial water bottles, and its results were not subject to peer review by scientists, media outlets spun the story into a consumer panic.

The truth is less frightening. All materials that are intended for food storage or production are evaluated by the FDA for safety. This scrutiny applies to all plastic water bottles, just like any other food container. The FDA has determined that the plastics used in commercially available water bottles are safe for use with consumable fluids. All plastics emit small amounts of plasticizer over time, but the FDA has determined that these chemicals are harmless in small doses, and thus do not pose a risk to consumers.

The bottom line: Go ahead and reuse those water bottles. Just keep them clean.



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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481143 - 12/22/08 11:39 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

If you notice Nalgenes website they use #7 we use #5 I have also heard of people using #2


--------------------
Don't believe everything you think.  TRADE LIST

‹Sell Your Soul› You know this place is owned and operated by the Illuminati, right?
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InvisibleJ3illy
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: J3illy]
    #9481153 - 12/22/08 11:41 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

For any type of plastic that is made for food consumption - reusing it is harmless.  It all must pass FDA guidelines.  As the link points out, the hysteria was started when a student did testing on an "obscure type of plastic typically not used in water bottles"

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InvisibleShroominit
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481160 - 12/22/08 11:42 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Well done steak is carcinogenic as well, the FDA approves that too. They are not meant to stop people from dying altogether, they are just there to make sure we don't live on drugs like ephedra which causes heart attacks in most people who take it continuously.

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InvisibleJ3illy
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: Shroominit]
    #9481178 - 12/22/08 11:46 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

I'd never heard of reusing water bottles as being carcinogenic, and didn't buy it - so I'm just pointing out the info behind it.

And if you think the FDA just passes anything, well that's not true.  It takes years for new things to get FDA approved.

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InvisibleShroominit
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: J3illy]
    #9481221 - 12/22/08 11:54 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Billy, it does take years, and they are pretty good. The thing is carcinogens don't kill people, they just cause cancer, which a lot of people have and don't ever find and it doesn't ever kill them.

I will say that waterbottles are safe to use and reuse for cool-room temp-slightly warm water. Not for hot water and not for freezing, that is where the concern is. I'm gonna have to doubt that the FDA PC'd a waterbottle and checked for carcinogens.

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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481232 - 12/22/08 11:55 PM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah FDA doesn't mean much in my book, they are subjected to a flow of money from companies I am sure.  This goes beyond the food and drug administration though.  If PP#5 is used in innumerable scientific applications as a non-reactive plastic container.  Think of how many PP#5 containers are in a single hospital.


--------------------
Don't believe everything you think.  TRADE LIST

‹Sell Your Soul› You know this place is owned and operated by the Illuminati, right?
‹lsdwithme› i possibly just smoked a rat turd :facepalm:

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InvisibleJ3illy
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: Shroominit]
    #9481261 - 12/23/08 12:02 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

I agree about heightened risk for usage out of "recommended" guidelines - but for something like the PP5 Gladware jars - those are made for leftovers, to be put in a microwave, etc..  It seems the concern comes into play when they're old/degrading - but using them just a few times seems totally safe IMO.

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OfflineVermonster420
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: J3illy]
    #9481378 - 12/23/08 12:35 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

The real danger is for the people working in the manufacture of plastics.  My best friend died 2/19/07 at age 38 after a 17 year career in the injection molding business.  Multiple Myeloma is a cancer that resides in your bones and marrow.  There are highly toxic solvents and polymers used in the making of all plastics even if the items don't contain them.


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To thine own self be true.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
Ass...it's the NEW pussy!
"Gungah-DeGungah"

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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: Vermonster420]
    #9481407 - 12/23/08 12:45 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

I am sorry for the loss of your friend.  I hope the company is taking care of his family at the least.

Plastics make me sad in a lot of ways...


--------------------
Don't believe everything you think.  TRADE LIST

‹Sell Your Soul› You know this place is owned and operated by the Illuminati, right?
‹lsdwithme› i possibly just smoked a rat turd :facepalm:

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OfflineVermonster420
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: POWAtrippin]
    #9481416 - 12/23/08 12:48 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Thank you very much, it was a long battle and literally millions in bills.  Insurance had a lifetime cap of 2 mil so his family is bankrupt andf he's dead and the company has FDA backing up their data saying there were no harmful chemicals and the "limited" exposure he had would not cause cancer.  So now what?  too broke to hire a lawyer to sue...I miss aluminum!


--------------------
To thine own self be true.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
Ass...it's the NEW pussy!
"Gungah-DeGungah"

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OfflinePOWAtrippinDiscord
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Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: Vermonster420]
    #9481444 - 12/23/08 12:55 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

That mad me go from sad to plain pissed off.  On the other hand sometimes lawyers agree to work for a % of the potential winnings.  Sadly they will only do this if they are confident in winning, and I don't really know how easy it would be to overturn the FDA bs.

As to anyone saying that the FDA is pretty all right I have one word.
Tobacco.

Again very sorry.


--------------------
Don't believe everything you think.  TRADE LIST

‹Sell Your Soul› You know this place is owned and operated by the Illuminati, right?
‹lsdwithme› i possibly just smoked a rat turd :facepalm:

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InvisibleJ3illy
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Registered: 10/18/08
Posts: 3,344
Re: using plastics instead of glass [Re: Vermonster420]
    #9481459 - 12/23/08 01:00 AM (15 years, 3 months ago)

Wow that's bullshit man.  You'd think the company would man up and take at least some responsibility.

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