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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: c0sm0nautt]
    #9404955 - 12/10/08 11:48 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

c0sm0nautt said:
How can we expect government to work, when the very system requires you to be a politician?




You nailed it. And there's more. You have to be a politician because all people are politicians. And all, to one extent or another, corrupt.

There is real truth to the quote "We get the government we deserve". Why? Because it reflects who we are.

Over in this forum especially most everyone is so busy pointing the finger at the other side they fail every time to look at their own motives and actions.


I'm no better. I'm just sayin.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #9404995 - 12/10/08 11:56 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

sell out america and get yourself a handhob

bond for Blagojevich was a mere $4500
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article5315453.ece


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9405025 - 12/10/08 12:01 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

That's fucking great. So a man commits an (IMO) act of treason against us all and his bail is set at a few dollars.

Some other schmuck is accused of terrorism on weak evidence and stuck in a jail without any chance of bail for years.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Icelander]
    #9405891 - 12/10/08 02:12 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

That's fucking great. So a man commits an (IMO) act of treason against us all and his bail is set at a few dollars.

Some other schmuck is accused of terrorism on weak evidence and stuck in a jail without any chance of bail for years.




Unclear on the concept of bail, I see.






Phred


--------------------


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Phred]
    #9406154 - 12/10/08 02:56 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Most likely but you get the point.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Icelander]
    #9406294 - 12/10/08 03:17 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I will enlighten you.  The purpose of bail is to ensure that the suspect will appear for trial.  That's all.  Blago is not a flight risk.


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Offlinezouden
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Seuss]
    #9406682 - 12/10/08 04:16 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
> How was associating with Blagojevich in 2006 detrimental to his career?

Are we not talking about it now?  If we weren't, then you would have a valid point.




Somewhat circular logic - the fact that people are speculating about it potentially damaging Obama's career can hardly be taken as evidence that it is damaging. Obama has suffered much worse.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: zappaisgod]
    #9407074 - 12/10/08 05:14 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I will enlighten you.  The purpose of bail is to ensure that the suspect will appear for trial.  That's all.  Blago is not a flight risk.




I think I know why he isn't a flight risk. Nothing much is going to happen to him. He's a fat cat and fat cats don't pay. :wink:

Were he facing water boarding and rotting without charges for years maybe he might just consider hightailing it.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: zouden]
    #9407188 - 12/10/08 05:30 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

> Somewhat circular logic - the fact that people are speculating about it potentially damaging Obama's career can hardly be taken as evidence that it is damaging.

Not at all circular.  Perhaps you place a stronger meaning on the word 'damage' than I do.  Is this something that is going to destroy Obama?  Absolutely not.  Is this something that helps to further erode Obama's credibility?  Certainly.  Even if Obama had never met the guy, it is still a bit damaging to his image.  The media has started talking about the corrupt political machine in Chicago, the place that Obama cut his political teeth.  Guilt by association isn't fair, but it is a fact of life.  Personally, I think Obama is a lier, and his lies are going to start biting him in the ass.  He lied about his preacher.  He lied about his association with Ayres.  He lied about his ties to socialism.  Now he lies about having had no contact with the Illinois Governor regarding his empty Senate seat (in my opinion).


--------------------
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Invisibleawesomebastard
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #9407283 - 12/10/08 05:46 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

He should be executed IMO on national television.

Fuckin asshole.


--------------------
"Absolute certainty is a privilege of uneducated minds and fanatics." ~ C.J. Keyser



Mr. Cypher said: "I just tell the girls how sexy I am and their panties melt."


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Offlinezouden
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Seuss]
    #9407297 - 12/10/08 05:48 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

But without hard evidence, this event will fade from memory without any lasting damage. The people who are crowing the most about the damage to Obama's reputation are those who hope that it will damage him. I doubt the rest of the populace really cares that much.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: zouden]
    #9407599 - 12/10/08 06:33 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Blagojevich's corruption didn't get anyone killed, as far as I know, so currently he is at least better than the previous Governor. He fixed I-88/290 too, so I really can't be that mad at him.

Chicago and Springfield do not get along at all, so I would not be surprised if someone from Obama's office was responsible for ratting him out.


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #9407637 - 12/10/08 06:38 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Chicago and Springfield do not get along at all, so I would not be surprised if someone from Obama's office was responsible for ratting him out.




Precisely.

The Lieutenant Gov is much more friendly with Obama, and him (The LG) and Blago hate each other.


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: zouden]
    #9409295 - 12/10/08 10:55 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

zouden said:
The people who are crowing the most about the damage to Obama's reputation are those who hope that it will damage him. I doubt the rest of the populace really cares that much.



Exactly.

Also, if Obama is shown to associate with a few stellar people, should we automatically conclude that Obama must be a stellar person himself?  This seems to me like a silly argument.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: JT]
    #9409730 - 12/11/08 12:22 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

justin_thyme said:
he knew all of them, no one's denying that. this governor is the first significant threat to obama's credibility though.





No that would be him voting against his stated positions in the senate on large issues, changing his positions when running for president while not being honest about the changes, and being against gay marriage while claiming he's for equality (supernovasky is going to get pissy and call me a liar again I'm sure)

By the way, I don't think this a big deal for obama.  I don't like that his aid was either lieing or making shit up to the news institutions that I relly upon to get inromation about the people I support, but that's small potatoes. 

And i don't really care about who obama associates with in the examples cited.  His relationsihp with ayers seems a nonissue due to the lack of ayers causing trouble while obama is associated with him, weakly, and his relationship with wright seems more a shrewd political move and personal friendship than anything.  So long as obama doesn't adopt either's positions its not a problem.  His wife is probably the biggest liability but I think she's just not savy enough to shut her dumb mouth when it hurst her husband and she seems to do a better job of that as time goes on.


Quote:

Phred said:
Quote:

That's fucking great. So a man commits an (IMO) act of treason against us all and his bail is set at a few dollars.

Some other schmuck is accused of terrorism on weak evidence and stuck in a jail without any chance of bail for years.




Unclear on the concept of bail, I see.






Phred





yeah, but he does have a point.  The bail in this country is bullshit and a half.  You steal five memory cards and get bail of sixty thousand ten percent.  You sell drugs to an adult (personal use quantities) you get hundred thousand dollars cash bail.  You beat someone up and get a few hundred bucks.  You are a rich guy and defraud the united states and state of Illinois and you get a bail that wouldn't stop anyone from running.


I don't think the amount of bail should have no relationship to the seriousness of the charges.  Should a speeder be summarily arrested for a nonjailable (sentencing wise) offense just because he's a flight risk and is currently intending to leave the state when he's stopped?  No.  Neither should a drug possesor or dealer be given more than a governor.

Bail needs to be drastically lowered in almost all areas.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: johnm214]
    #9410268 - 12/11/08 02:03 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

blagovich is a rod...


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #9410944 - 12/11/08 05:28 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

> if Obama is shown to associate with a few stellar people, should we automatically conclude that Obama must be a stellar person himself?

No, we think he is doing his job.  When you expect somebody to associate with stellar people, and they do, then it is nothing special.  When you expect somebody to associate with stellar people, and instead they associate with racists, terrorists, and extortionists, then you begin to think there might be a problem.


--------------------
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Offlinezouden
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: Seuss]
    #9410963 - 12/11/08 05:38 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

It could have been worse.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: zouden]
    #9411010 - 12/11/08 06:02 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

> It could have been worse.

Very much so... and it still may get worse.  Time will tell.


--------------------
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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Illinois Governor Arrested For Selling Vacant US Senate Seat [Re: johnm214]
    #9411490 - 12/11/08 10:38 AM (11 years, 6 months ago)

You still don't get it.  The only purpose of bail is to ensure that the indictee will appear for his trial.  That's it.  Blago is not a flight risk.  He should have no bail.  Then he should go on trial, be convicted and put in jail for 25 years.  He can't run and he can't hide, there is no reason for a high bail.  I can't believe you automatically want to throw him in jail before he gets a trial.

Meanwhile, assorted anonymous punks skip bail and fail to appear all the time.  They disappear into the woodwork and spend years on the lam.  Once again, this is not something Blago can do.  I assume he had to surrender his passport.  There is no place he can hide.


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