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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: buttonion]
    #940213 - 10/07/02 02:09 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Studies show that confession of what a person considers moral transgressions does (somehow) lead to positive change- a decrease of guilt or shame, and a corresponding reduction in anxiety.

I guess Nietzche was wrong. :smile:

Prayer a hypnosis? Heh.
 


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OfflineLarrythescaryrex
teardrop on the fire
Male User Gallery

Registered: 07/19/00
Posts: 11,004
Loc: further down the spiral
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: TeKHeAD009]
    #940214 - 10/07/02 02:09 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

:smirk:


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RIP Acidic_Sloth

Sunset_Mission said:
"larry the scary rex
verily scary when thoroughly vexed
invoke the shadows and dust, cast a hex
mercifully massacring memories masterfully
relocate from Ur to 8th density and become a cosmic bully
mulder and scully couldn't decipher his glyphs
invoke the shadows and dust, smoke infernal spliffs"
April 24th 2011

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
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Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Swami]
    #940482 - 10/07/02 03:59 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

I've known 2 people who went into, and came out of comas. One (Clair) was the result of having been a smoker and on birth control pills (blood clot). When she came out of it, she had to learn how to speak again. The other guy was in for about a year. I picked him up hitch hiking in the 70's, and I had known him before the coma (don't remember the cause). He was in an Edgar Allen Poe premature burial kind of Hell. He told me he could hear and feel everything, yet couldn't even twitch his eyes. He was mentally screaming, but his mental state could not communicate in the least with his physical body. He was in Hell. He became born again when he was liberated from that Hell-state. His family's parish prayed for him, unbeknownst to him, and he recognized this. But, of course, you needn't believe him or me. He lived in my home town, his name was Joe Z___.

Prayer, like genuine magic, does not require the knowledge of the person being prayed for or being en-chanted. These realities operate independently of belief on the part of the party being focused on, when they work at all. It is not a matter of hypnosis, or suggestion, or emotional support, but spiritual and psychic [psi f(x)] realities respectively. On prayer, I will not even go there, but on magic, there is J. Finley Hurley's book 'Sorcery,' about 'strike-blind-and-kill' sorcery; and a modern ex-Ayahuascaro whom I've met - Pablo Amaringo - could give convincing words in his book (if you believed he was being truthful and accurate). Odd how you can be so assured that being conscious of others' intentions works, but being unconscious of their intentions doesn't work. Much of these realities seem to operate through the medium of the unconscious.

How does any man presume to say that Deity is not involved in existence? "Indeed, the very hairs of your head are all numbered," is one of those Biblical sayings, all down-to-Earth, yet profoundly metaphysical about the Divine Omniscience and Omnipresence of Ultimate Realty. Infinite Awareness in the infinitesimal. I pray that you wake up and see - it's the One Realization that saves.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: vaporbrains]
    #940526 - 10/07/02 04:11 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

"Atheist and Christian Quarterly"

Heh, heh. I will subscribe when you publish.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
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Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: jonnyshaggs420]
    #940551 - 10/07/02 04:20 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

I've been praying since I was a child; later trained in higher forms of prayer in a reputable University's Christian seminary (Drew University). I am also a Certified Diplomate in Clinical Hypnotherapy (www.natboard.com), and practicing since 1989.

Prayer is prayer. Hypnosis is hypnosis. Prayer is NOT hypnosis. Hypnosis is NOT prayer.

Prayer can be categorized in four basic types: Petitionary, Intercessory, Thanksgiving, Contemplative. Most people think only of Petitionary prayer and make God out to be one's errand boy. If someone dies, God has failed, or one's faith has failed, or both. No one thinks about a person being done with his/her work on this plane earlier than WE want them to be. A child goes back to the Pleroma - the Fullness of Being - God -while we have to remain here sponging up 'highs' through sex and drugs and revelry. How incredibly selfish of us to want to hold back a being who is being drawn into the bliss of Infinite Being. And then we blame God, and try to reject God. We might as well pout and hold our breath til we turn blue. Rejecting the Spirit is like rejecting the air. It is the same as rejecting Life.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Zahid]
    #940570 - 10/07/02 04:26 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Studies show that confession of what a person considers moral transgressions does (somehow) lead to positive change- a decrease of guilt or shame, and a corresponding reduction in anxiety.
I guess Nietzche was wrong.

No... but he's still misunderstood. Like here for instance...


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #940605 - 10/07/02 04:40 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Your words and stories are interesting as always (no sarcasm). However, as my birth name is Thomas, I must put my proverbial fingers in the wound.

Have a shroomery group led by yourself pray for Swami's spine in which healing could easily be validated through X-Ray and I will be the MOST vocal proponent for spiritual healing and prayer you have ever heard.

Heaven hath no fury like a reformed skeptic! :smile:
 


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The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (10/07/02 05:40 PM)

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InvisibleShroomismM
Space Travellin
Male User Gallery
Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Swami]
    #940753 - 10/07/02 05:32 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

What's wrong with your spine? I will send healing energies.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Shroomism]
    #940768 - 10/07/02 05:36 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

What's wrong with your spine? I will send healing energies.

When you're done doing that... why don't you send him a big, fat wad of cash? :wink: 


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Shroomism]
    #940808 - 10/07/02 05:46 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

BTW I didn't post that for any pity. We all have physical ailments and mine is no harder to bear than anyone elses. It is just that a spine's healing is easier to measure and prove photographically than many types of disease. As I have have had this since my 20's it would be definitive proof of a miracle as I have never heard of a remission in this arena.

I have degenerative osteo-arthritis in which the vertebrae dissolve and fuse.


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The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (10/07/02 06:02 PM)

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Sclorch]
    #940816 - 10/07/02 05:48 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah, but sitting on $20k in my wallet will exacerbate my spinal imbalance...


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The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Sclorch]
    #940838 - 10/07/02 05:52 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

No... but he's still misunderstood. Like here for instance...

The idea that religion is guilt-promoting is absurd, yet cute.


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Edited by Zahid (10/07/02 05:58 PM)

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Zahid]
    #940846 - 10/07/02 05:53 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

In reply to:

The idea that religion is guilt-promoting is absurd, yet cute.



Are you really that naive?


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Evolving]
    #940872 - 10/07/02 06:00 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Are you really that naive?

Are you? :smile:

Guilt promoting? Come on... 


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OfflineTeKHeAD009
Stranger
Registered: 04/04/02
Posts: 760
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Swami]
    #940873 - 10/07/02 06:01 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

I shall prey for your spine!  :smile:

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Zahid]
    #940881 - 10/07/02 06:04 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Do you know what a confessional is? Ever heard of penance?


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 19 years, 5 months
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Evolving]
    #940891 - 10/07/02 06:08 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Do you know what forgiveness is?


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Zahid]
    #940906 - 10/07/02 06:12 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

You gotta' feel guilty to want forgiveness, DUH!


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Evolving]
    #940939 - 10/07/02 06:25 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Do I hear Devo playing somewhere off in the distance???


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Can prayer aid in health? [Re: Sclorch]
    #940963 - 10/07/02 06:31 PM (21 years, 5 months ago)

Actually it's Boingo. Same year though, good psychic connection Sclorch!


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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