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InvisibleGumby
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M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47
    #9265506 - 11/18/08 11:43 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I'd like to get some kind of assault rifle before they do another ban on them. I'm thinking about an M16/M4/AR-15 or an AK-47. Which gun do you like better and why? Which is more accurate? Which is more durable and least problematic?

I've fired a Norinco MAK90 AK-47 and loved it. It seemed to be pretty accurate up to about... 75 yards or so. Haven't fired an AR-15... Yet.


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Offlinemonkeywrench
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9267241 - 11/18/08 04:59 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

what do you want the rifle for?  ak's are great in some respects, as are ar-15's but for very diff. reasons.


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[quote]skalthren said:
It's nice of you to imply that I've been brainwashed by the government, but the truth is that I'm simply intelligent enough to recognize the subtleties of these issues instead of going "durr hurr, weed should totally be legal!"[/quote]


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9267310 - 11/18/08 05:07 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

ahhh glad to see this forum is somewhere it might actually get some traffic now.  :awesome:

well without a doubt, if you can afford an m-16 or an M4 they are hands down the best guns. theres a reason our military uses them over others.

i like AR-15 as well, bushmaster AR's are durable as hell and theyre quite accurate.

AK's are the best as far as cheap ammo and price vs. power and durability. best value for your money.  definately buy one that is milled and not stamped though. stamped is garbage.


my dad just bought me a saiga AK in .308. havent fired it yet, i have to go down south to pick it up from his house, but im very excited.  ive heard alot of good things about them.  brand new that cost him $550, you can find most AK's in the $400-800 price range, id be wary about buying any for $400 or less, as they are likely to have something wrong with them.  but you can definately buy a nice Ak for around $500.

a nice AR will run you in between $800-1000

and M-16, im not even sure about.  maybe someone else might know this one. 

the saiga my dad got me.



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InvisibleGumby
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #9269895 - 11/18/08 11:23 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Depending on the money I have after I sell my big ass fish tank, I'm going to go for an AR-15. If all else fails... I really like AK-47s, so I'll do that. Although I will be firing an AR-15 in GA when I go home. :smile:

How long do you guys think it's going to take the dems to ban assault rifles? I think it's soon, so I want to get one ASAP.


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InvisibleCalifornia
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9270478 - 11/19/08 01:15 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Gumby said:
Which is more accurate?



M16.

Quote:

Gumby said:
Which is more durable and least problematic?




AK-47.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9270640 - 11/19/08 02:08 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Gumby said:
Depending on the money I have after I sell my big ass fish tank, I'm going to go for an AR-15. If all else fails... I really like AK-47s, so I'll do that. Although I will be firing an AR-15 in GA when I go home. :smile:

How long do you guys think it's going to take the dems to ban assault rifles? I think it's soon, so I want to get one ASAP.




i seriously hope they dont make it high priority. hopefully they try to tackle iraq and our economy first.  but i doubt it.  theyve got a serious hard on for this ban to re-pass with less loopholes and more guns on the list.

:crankey:


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InvisibleGeomancer
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #9273791 - 11/19/08 06:05 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

leftysurprise said:

a nice AR will run you in between $800-1000

and M-16, im not even sure about.  maybe someone else might know this one.




Prices on M16's have taken a pretty drastic jump in the last few years.  They used to be around $4-6000, but now they tend to be more in the $10-14,000 pricepoint.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Geomancer]
    #9274621 - 11/19/08 08:02 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

shit.  for that kind of money ill be buying one of these.



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InvisibleGumby
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: California]
    #9276442 - 11/20/08 01:02 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

As of right now, I'm probably going to go with an AK-47.

But I will be shooting an AR-15 over winter break with another shroomerite :smile:

I'll make my decision after that.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9278948 - 11/20/08 02:09 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

overall I'd recommend the AR-15, while it's easier to maintain
the AK and SKS tend to be more problematic regarding ammo feed
with high capacity mags, you also have to worry about keeping
the recoil buffer tube cleaner than with the AR

My recomendation, a Bushmaster or Olympic Lower with a DPMS upper


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9279013 - 11/20/08 02:21 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
overall I'd recommend the AR-15, while it's easier to maintain
the AK and SKS tend to be more problematic regarding ammo feed
with high capacity mags, you also have to worry about keeping
the recoil buffer tube cleaner than with the AR

My recomendation, a Bushmaster or Olympic Lower with a DPMS upper




occasionally my SKS has problems loading with a 30 round mag.  what causes this problem pris? and what can be done to correct it?

my father has an AR-15 that he bought at a gunshow from http://www.gunsmokeenterprises.net/, i believe theyre based somewhere on the west coast of florida, very nice gun, and a nice deal compared to a bushmaster. i believe he paid $750 cash for a standard, + $50 for the flattop.



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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #9285361 - 11/21/08 12:59 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

leftysurprise said:
occasionally my SKS has problems loading with a 30 round mag.  what causes this problem pris? and what can be done to correct it?




I'm getting ready to build up a feed ramp in mine, in case you
havent noticed they dont have one


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9285498 - 11/21/08 01:19 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

leftysurprise said:
occasionally my SKS has problems loading with a 30 round mag.  what causes this problem pris? and what can be done to correct it?




I'm getting ready to build up a feed ramp in mine, in case you
havent noticed they dont have one




would you mind explaining how you are going to do it?  loading problems are QUITE unacceptable, especially if im shooting to save my life.  :smirk:

now this ramp, is this a problem affecting the gun or the magazine?


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InvisibleTheMimeKing
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #9383509 - 12/07/08 03:49 AM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Check that the feed lips are straight, that solves 90% of magazine related issues. The other 10% is usually poorly designed or cheap followers, but there's usually not much you can do about that other than replacing the follower or the magazine itself

Also, try and chamber a round, then cycle it through without firing it and see if any part of the bullet itself is ground or scuffed more than usual. And obviously, do it somewhere where you can point the gun in a safe direction in case it were to go off accidentally, and make sure to only load one round in the magazine.


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OfflineLouiscypher
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: TheMimeKing]
    #9444033 - 12/16/08 02:10 PM (15 years, 1 month ago)

Both the AR and the AK have their advantages.The AK 7.62x39 is a heavier bullet
and does more damage at close range while the .223 is more accurate at longer distances. Personally I like the AR because it gives you the option of switching out the top to an Alexander Arms 50cal Beowulf which is quite a devastating assault rifle and the Grendel 6.5 also Alexander Arms which has more kick and accurate distance than the .223 or 7.62x39. The Grendel is available with a 24 inch barrel and is one wicked sniper rifle. Both use the lower of the AR. I also have a Russian SKS  7.62 which is great for just shooting. Here's a pic of my Beowulf and the ammo. .50 cal next to 7.62 by cell phone for size comparison.





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1) Cars can hurt you.
2) You cannot fly.
3) It's never a good time to die.
4) Taking your clothes off will draw attention.
5) Keep your mouth shut at all times while in public.
6) Although you may see things that are not there, you won't NOT see things that are there.
7) Don't forget how to breathe.
8) Only carry: a house-key, some loose change, and your address in your shoe.
9) Nobody can tell that you are tripping until you tell them "I'm tripping".
10) No matter how fucked-up you think you are, you'll eventually come down.


Edited by Louiscypher (12/16/08 02:19 PM)


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Offlineproud_republican
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Louiscypher]
    #9602266 - 01/13/09 03:54 PM (15 years, 17 days ago)

AR-15 FTW always


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When I find myself in times of trouble, mother Mary comes to me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
And in my hour of darkness she is standing right in front of me,
speaking words of wisdom, let it be.
Let it be, let it be, let it be, let it be.
Whisper words of wisdom, let it be.
And when the broken hearted people living in the world agree,
there will be an answer, let it be.
For though they may be parted there is still a chance that they will see, there will be an answer. let it be.
Let it be, let it be, .....


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Offlinemushroomhunter10
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: proud_republican]
    #9631085 - 01/18/09 10:23 AM (15 years, 12 days ago)

Ak's the more reliable.

.223 or 5.56 is a great round too.

No matter which you get. Just be sure to purchase AP rounds before they're illegal and always keep a magazine of those on the ready.

My next one will be an AK or a Mini-30.

The mini-14 or mini-30 may be other good Rugers that you might want to consider that come in the same calibers as the aforementioned two choices that you poised.

GL


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OfflineChakravanti
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: mushroomhunter10]
    #9665054 - 01/23/09 12:41 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

AK's may be more reliable but if it does jam you're screwed.  AR-15/M-16 can be dismantled and reassembled on-the-spot in minutes.

The only real difference between the M-16 and AR is the 3-round burst which if you're technically inclined and disposed of the right tools...

If you do go for an AR would you go Long barrel and Weights or Light stock & 14"?

Personally I'd go with light but I'm not really into the sniper type stuff.  I just like to feel raw power course through my hands.:headbanger:

Not that I don't shoot for accuracy but tactically speaking I've no desire to haul that kind of weight around. +Increased Concealability.


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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Chakravanti]
    #9665138 - 01/23/09 12:53 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

I favor the AK due to round used. I plan on a future purchase of an AR platform, but it will be in .308.


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InvisibleGumby
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Chakravanti]
    #9665903 - 01/23/09 03:13 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

I'd go for long barrel. I'm a big fan of distance shooting.


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OfflineCascadian
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9667829 - 01/23/09 08:58 PM (15 years, 7 days ago)

[url=
.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbe4maIL0A0&feature=related[/url]


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9677031 - 01/25/09 03:07 PM (15 years, 5 days ago)

im also a fan of distance.

if you can kill them before they know where you are, or that youre even there.  you have the upper hand.


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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Cascadian]
    #9680096 - 01/25/09 10:56 PM (15 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Cascadian said:
[url=
.youtube.com/watch?v=Sbe4maIL0A0&feature=related[/url]



That about sums it up.


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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9681055 - 01/26/09 07:32 AM (15 years, 5 days ago)

Why use an assault rifle for hunting? Automatic fire is only good for one thing, keeping people's heads down.

Personally, I'd go for something cheap and reliable, because I don't have taxpayers money to fund spare parts and ammo. My three choices (and there's thousands of variants, so I'm not going to do the "my brand is the best" bollocks)

A revolver: Revolvers are more reliable than clip fed pistols, and with 5/6 bullets, you won't be wasting (now very expensive) ammunition. This weapon is something you can always have close by, or on you.

A pump or lever action shotgun: A shotgun is the best home defense weapon there is. It's range is ideal, buckshot makes aiming a whole lot easier, and the stopping power is, well, it's a shotgun. You may want a double action shotgun for it's simplicity, but maintaining a pump action isin't too much work.

A bolt action rifle with a retractable bipod and (optional or not, depends on your eyesight and what you're hunting) telescopic sight: There are many semi automatic rifles around, and good ones too. Personally I'd go for whatever has the cheapest .300/7mm ammunition. Good ones to be had are the Mosin Nagant M44 (there's millions of these to be had, much more accurate than the 7.62mm Klashnikovs, which were designed to keep heads down) or Lee Enfield L8, which takes 7.62mm NATO, or the Springfield M1903.

Don't get me wrong, I like automatics, because they look cool (FN P90, FN/L1A1 (British varient of the excellent FN FAL, it had a strenghened buttstock ideal for clubbing, something very popular with squaddies) but like desert eagles (with the exception of the .44 magnum chambered one, which is a far better round than the .50"Couldn't hit the broad side of a barn even if you were in it" AE), GAU8 miniguns and metal storm CIWS's, they are for show, and not practical.


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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #9681245 - 01/26/09 08:44 AM (15 years, 4 days ago)

deleted


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Edited by Captain Caveman (01/26/09 08:53 AM)


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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Captain Caveman]
    #9681271 - 01/26/09 08:53 AM (15 years, 4 days ago)

Quote:

Captain Caveman said:
Its funny you mention that. The FAL is 1st on my list. The .308 is as small a round I will go in a rifle, and after falling in love with it at a range, Im saving up for a DSA model which will hopefully be in my hands by summer.




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InvisibleGumby
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #9685834 - 01/26/09 10:03 PM (15 years, 4 days ago)

Who the hell said I was hunting and who said hunting with an assault rifle was legal?


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OfflineVisionary Tools
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #9687378 - 01/27/09 07:37 AM (15 years, 4 days ago)

Quote:

Gumby said:
Who the hell said I was hunting and who said hunting with an assault rifle was legal?




Those are the guns I'd use. But if showing off is your thing, then by all means, get an m16. Or an M60 or FN Minimi (or the 249SAW). Loud and impressive.


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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #9687965 - 01/27/09 11:00 AM (15 years, 3 days ago)

Who said anything about hunting or shwoing off?  I agree Assault rifles having nothing to do with hunting.  They might be usedf for showing off but their primary purpose is in their name.  Whether you are on defence or offence is irrelevant....Assault rifles are a staple for every self-respecting individual who values his rights.


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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Chakravanti]
    #9917973 - 03/05/09 04:08 PM (14 years, 10 months ago)

I have never shot the AR-15, however shooting the AK is pretty bad ass.  I have held the AR, but the feeling i get when shooting an AK is pretty amazing.  I don't really like guns, i think people use them irresponsibly.  However that feeling after a semi-automatic burst and the opening of the other clenched eye is just :smile:


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Offlineinnovation
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #10381371 - 05/22/09 10:36 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I'd like to get some kind of assault rifle before they do another ban on them. I'm thinking about an M16/M4/AR-15 or an AK-47. Which gun do you like better and why? Which is more accurate? Which is more durable and least problematic?

I've fired a Norinco MAK90 AK-47 and loved it. It seemed to be pretty accurate up to about... 75 yards or so. Haven't fired an AR-15... Yet.

An AR system over an AK any day.

  • more accurate
  • just as durable
  • the gas operation is it's flaw (more on this)


More after market for AR systems.  Ammo is cheap, some say it's a weak round 5.56.  It shouldn't be a problem if you get shot placement right in the first place, ie vital organ or hs.  Gas operation can be nullified easily by drop in replacement piston kits, you can even change out caliber to a 7.62.  I am biased though having had to use the ar system for a while, it's a bitch to clean but I have never had major malfunction.


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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: innovation]
    #10381504 - 05/22/09 11:17 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

innovation said:
I'd like to get some kind of assault rifle before they do another ban on them. I'm thinking about an M16/M4/AR-15 or an AK-47. Which gun do you like better and why? Which is more accurate? Which is more durable and least problematic?

I've fired a Norinco MAK90 AK-47 and loved it. It seemed to be pretty accurate up to about... 75 yards or so. Haven't fired an AR-15... Yet.

An AR system over an AK any day.

  • more accurate
  • just as durable
  • the gas operation is it's flaw (more on this)


More after market for AR systems.  Ammo is cheap, some say it's a weak round 5.56.  It shouldn't be a problem if you get shot placement right in the first place, ie vital organ or hs.  Gas operation can be nullified easily by drop in replacement piston kits, you can even change out caliber to a 7.62.  I am biased though having had to use the ar system for a while, it's a bitch to clean but I have never had major malfunction.




Seems you already have your mind made up. And I dont blame you. Chip Mcormic drop in trigger system, new gas system, and your set.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Captain Caveman]
    #10382347 - 05/22/09 02:21 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

well obviously 99% of us would opt for the AR/M4 platforms, however if money is an issue as it is for many of us, i would go the AK route.

the gun in my sig is my saiga .308, basically a new manufacture AK ready for american import.  $600 brand new and $200 worth of upgrades later you have an excellent battle rifle minus the select fire.  accurate, powerful and still less than what you would pay for a base model AR.

when it is fiscally feasible i will be getting an M4.


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Offlinemushroomhunter10
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #10383722 - 05/22/09 07:54 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

That argument is almost as bad as the evolution/intelligent design debate. It will NEVER end. :smile:

Really it's all about where you put the bullet that's the final deciding factor.

Whatever you can hit your mark with reliably, go for that one. Whatever you're the most comfortable with will be the most effective weapon you'll own.


--------------------
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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: mushroomhunter10]
    #10383762 - 05/22/09 08:11 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

pretty much.  they all work, some work a little better,  i would prefer to own american made, but until i can afford them, its not an option lol.


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Offlinemushroomhunter10
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #10383773 - 05/22/09 08:16 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Yes. +1 on the American made. Springfield Armory is one of my favorites.


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InvisibleLeftyBurnz
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: mushroomhunter10]
    #10383881 - 05/22/09 08:46 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

springfield or bushmaster.  either or.


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Offlinemushroomhunter10
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #10384577 - 05/23/09 12:31 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Yes. Can't forget Bushmaster. Awesome too.


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Imagine if you needed it and it wasn't there... GIVE BLOOD
Get a free (PAINLESS) bone marrow testing kit and help save lives HERE.
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OfflineCaptain Caveman
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: mushroomhunter10]
    #10385754 - 05/23/09 10:30 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

When it comes to black rifles.....
DS Arms.
Nuff said.


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Offlinexpl0de
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Gumby]
    #10499405 - 06/13/09 11:51 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Id go with the m4. Light and accurate.


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OfflineChakravanti
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: xpl0de]
    #10526415 - 06/17/09 08:23 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

AR/M16 aren't designed to be lethal.  In fact they're design to NOT be lethal.  An injured opponant removes two to three enemies from the battlefield whereas a dead one only removes one.


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OfflineHeisenberg
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Chakravanti]
    #10731958 - 07/24/09 09:23 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

I thought NATO required ammo to not allow undue suffering?
For an AK, Vepr is top of the line.  Stamped receiver, 50% thicker than the others, two stage trigger, can bumpfire 30 rounds in two seconds. Only AK I've ever handled that is on par with AR.


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OfflineConflict187
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Heisenberg]
    #11014828 - 09/07/09 01:38 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

If you want a gun that fires through mud, sand, rain and all that shit go for an AK.
If you want a lesser in power but greater in percision go with an AR-15.

my dad has a phat AR-15 A2 but it seems he keeps having problems with the firing pin and jamming cartridges.


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Offline5150
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: Conflict187]
    #11077294 - 09/17/09 02:46 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

any assault rifle with the ammo in the drums

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout


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OfflineChuangTzu
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: 5150]
    #11078599 - 09/17/09 05:56 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

5150 said:
any assault rifle with the ammo in the drums

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout




huh?


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OfflineCascadian
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Re: M16/AR-15 vs. AK-47 [Re: 5150]
    #11078799 - 09/17/09 06:29 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

They make drum mags for both AR's and AK's.  And both are notorious for being very unreliable.

Better to have a bunch of 20/30 rounders that feed consistently than a couple of drum mags that you have to clear jams out of every 20-30 rounds.


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