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Anonymous

Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92410 - 02/10/00 12:23 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

10%HO can be used to sterilize media, plates, loops, blades, and flasks.

i don't think it would work well on grain as grain has an extremely high spore load.

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Anonymous

Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92411 - 02/10/00 08:45 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

H2O2 is one of the least stable molecules in existance... it don't last long at the site of heat, air, or the sun. Every wonder why the bottles brown?

So in essence it's not very usefull. Just breaks down into water and oxygen, and you don't want to have a bunch of water in the bottom of your jars cuz then things will just rot.



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Anonymous

Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92413 - 02/10/00 12:38 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

if sterilizing with HO watch out for H2 build up;it's flamable and will produce an anerobic envioment that mycelia can't live in.

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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92414 - 02/10/00 12:55 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Just another reminder on a property of H2O2 that is often overlooked. Nearly all things that are or were once alive (most substrates) contain peroxide decomposing enzymes. That's why it bubbles when you put it on a cut or something, it's breaking down. Peroxide decomposing enzymes are destroyed in a pressure cooker (not boiling) and therefore most substrates need to be pcooked before H2O2 will be of any help in them, otherwise your substrate will breakdown the h2o2 immediatly. Some highly processed substrates have already been treated enough to destroy the enzymes such as wood pellet fuel or dry milk.
Also, with liquid innoc, the mycelium is quickly distributed through the sub, quickly breaking down peroxide and therefore shortening it's effective time period. For peroxide to be of most benefit, it is added to subs either post pcooking or subs with no enzymes, then innoculated with single or double wedges of agar. Therefore the peroxide is only broken down where the mycelium is actively growing, protecting the rest of the substrate.
If you want more details, buy the book, I've probably already said too much. The book by the way is wayne's peroxide manual, growing mushrooms the easy way.
It won't hurt liquid mycelium, but it's effectiveness will be limited.
cheerio

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-From a registered Mad Scientist

"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obiwan Kenobi (also a Mad Scientist tm)



--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Anonymous

Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92415 - 02/10/00 10:12 PM (16 years, 9 months ago)

>"Also, with liquid innoc, the mycelium is quickly distributed through the sub, quickly breaking down peroxide and therefore shortening it's effective time period"

What I meant was that jars would be filled with substrate as usual. Instead of pressure cooking, H2O2 is added to kill any contamination spores/bacteria. After that, the substrate should be sterilized. Then the mycelium is added. Once the contaminations are killed, there is no more use for the H2O2, so it doesn't matter if the mycelium breaks down the H2O2 or not since it has already served it's purpose.

The only problem I could think of is that the H2O2 *might* harm the mycelium.

Now outofthisworld has brought up the point of decomposition, which I never thought of. However, I believe only a small amount would be needed to kill spores, and it's only 3% for most H2O2. So not very much H2O2 would be used and not very much H2O would be produced. If this is still a problem, just use a little less water. In other words, instead of let's say 100mL of water, use 90mL of water and 10mL of H2O2. I wouldn't know the exact amounts, but that's just an example.
Now for the oxygen: I wonder if extra oxygen would help the mycelium since it uses oxygen? I don't think it would harm it. If not, the tape on the holes of the jar could be removed to allow gas exchange (with the top layer of vermiculite to prevent contamination)

So what do you think?



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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92416 - 02/11/00 03:47 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

Oh, you mean no sterilization substrates! Several people did a good amount of work into this area a while back including myself and JafF. My results were less than stellar. It worked, but not well enough to do it everytime.
Something I learned about since then is that most nutrients have those enzymes that destroy peroxide. I think that was the problem we were having, sometimes the peroxide was broken down by the enzymes before it killed all the contams.
In Dr. Wayne's peroxide tek he gives instructions for peroxidated grainlike spawn that is only steamed for 10 minutes. The formula is calculated so that it contains no peroxide decomposing enzymes, and so that the amount of peroxide that decomposes from heat is compensated. I don't feel right sharing his formula, get the book if you are interested.
So, as a quick reply, it can be done, but not as easily as it may appear.
BTW, the thing about keeping peroxide in the substrate is to protect it. I have successfully colonized peroxidated agar plates with no contams plenty of times with just a tissue over the top to stop dust. Peroxide is unstable, but if you take the neccessary steps, it can protect substrates. That is what I use it for, protection not sterilization.

------------------
-From a registered Mad Scientist

"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obiwan Kenobi (also a Mad Scientist tm)



--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Anonymous

Re: Liquid mycelium with H202
    #92417 - 02/11/00 08:31 AM (16 years, 9 months ago)

One of my recent experiments involed using Dry milk powder as a alternative to brown rice flour, just for this reason.. I wanted to see if it would grow at all in this concentration.. The A strain seem to be handling it just fine... So my old experiments might work just fine with Dry Milk substrate, It would just be expensive as hell.. Soy flour isn't dry soy milk is it?


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Advanced Mycology

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