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OfflineDenty
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Registered: 11/08/08
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Can't get Rye to work as a substrate
    #9207640 - 11/08/08 02:53 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Hi

Everytime I try to use rye as a substrate the jars end up looking like this.  THey seem fine at first and after 3-4 days I can see the mycellium growing but after the first shake it looks like below and nothing else grows, it smells really bad as well





Help!!

Am I just adding too mujch water to the rye in the first place

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OfflinePsuper
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Denty]
    #9207654 - 11/08/08 02:57 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Well maybe you overhydrated your rye but that looks like a contam (wetspot)....How long are you pressure cooking your grain jars for? Are you following a specific tek? :sun: ~Pixie~


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OfflineSparkey_STi
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Denty]
    #9207656 - 11/08/08 02:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

How are you going about this?  Cause i've never added water to my rye... its absorbed by soak/boiling...

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Offlinenenl
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Denty]
    #9207657 - 11/08/08 02:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

it's too wet. Let the grain dry alot longer - until it's pretty much dry to the touch. All the moisture needed is inside the grain.


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Offlinedead
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Denty]
    #9207706 - 11/08/08 03:08 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Denty said:
Am I just adding too mujch water to the rye in the first place




Yes


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Invisibletripchip
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: dead]
    #9207710 - 11/08/08 03:10 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

well how are you hydrating the rye? second how are you sterilizing your rye? both play a role on the end resut.

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Invisibletripchip
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: tripchip]
    #9207735 - 11/08/08 03:16 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

let your rye soak for 24 hrs in a pot of water. cold or warm it doesnt matter. then after 24hrs turn on the heat and get the water to a slow simmer/boil to heat it all up. then pour the rye into a strainer. the reason for heating is so that the outside of the rye drys by evaporation. since the rye is hot it will dryquicker. the moisture you want is inside the grains not on the outside. once its all dry on the outside of the kernals put in PC and cook for 90 minutes. allow it to cool 100% before emptying the PC.

never add water to rye in the jar and PC like old teks will tell you to do. always soak the rye. this also allows the baterial spores to germinate and then they easily get killed off in the PC. this will help with your bacterial problem you are also having.

SOAK! SIMMER! DRY! LOAD IN JARS! PC 90 MIN 15PSI!!

easy as 1 2 3 4 5 :-)

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OfflineStimpy913
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: tripchip]
    #9208094 - 11/08/08 04:46 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Rinse rye out really well before draining. I rinse a few times right before soaking, then strain the soake water out, rinse 3 or 4 more times, boil 10 minutes, and rinse it off one more time with boiling water through the strainer.

When you're done drying the rye before sterilization, it should not stick at all. You should be able to dump every kernal out of your hand with ease, as if it's dry grain.

\/\/\/  Look at the video


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Edited by Stimpy913 (11/08/08 04:48 PM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Stimpy913]
    #9208475 - 11/08/08 05:58 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

That's bacteria.  Of course, rinsing is important, but what you have is caused by bacteria coming into contact with your sterilized grains.  If you're properly sterilizing, the problem is most likely bad filtering, contaminated inoculant, or less than sterile inoculation procedures.
RR


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Invisiblebillyboy36
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Registered: 05/04/08
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #9209295 - 11/08/08 09:31 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I'd say it's your lids or syringes.  People add water to rye in jars with no problems.  What is your lid set up?  I'm guessing you use tape?  Shaking the grains against your tape is probably contaminating them, hence not getting it until after the shake.

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OfflineStimpy913
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: billyboy36]
    #9209448 - 11/08/08 10:15 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

i dunno i use micropore tape over 2 gas exchange/inoculation holes in my quart jars. Very rare contaminants, and that's all the filtration used.  It probably was already in the jar, but spreads after he shakes it?


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Offlinealkylbenzene23
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Stimpy913]
    #9209674 - 11/08/08 11:15 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Stimpy913 said:
but spreads after he shakes it?




Not really, if its there it'll spread like mad.


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Offlineanakin3197
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: alkylbenzene23]
    #9209715 - 11/08/08 11:24 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

are you rinsing after simmering? i didnt and thats exactly what mine looked like?

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Offlinekramedit
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Denty]
    #9209730 - 11/08/08 11:27 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

way way way to wet


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Offlineanakin3197
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: kramedit]
    #9209744 - 11/08/08 11:33 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

way to wet and not rinsing, the white, looks more like the slimey gel that you get after simmering. i jus done 2 more jars of rye, and they look so much better than the las one i did, that i didnt rinse

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InvisibleFooMan
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: anakin3197]
    #9210066 - 11/09/08 01:06 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Guys, that "way too wet" look is from the bacillus (wet spot mold) itself, not excess water in the jar. His rye could have looked completely dry after prepping it and the jar still would have slimed up like that. This is caused by endospores not being killed during the sterilization process.

Most rye seems to be loaded with a ton of endospores IME. It needs to be thoroughly rinsed to clean it up and soaked to get the endospores to germinate. You also need to make sure you PC it long enough. This is why I stick to WBS.


--------------------

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Edited by FooMan (11/09/08 01:13 AM)

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Invisibletripchip
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: FooMan]
    #9210073 - 11/09/08 01:09 AM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

FooMan said:
Guys, that "way too wet" look is from the bacillus (wet spot mold) itself, not excess water in the jar. His rye could have looked completely dry after prepping it and the jar still would have slimed up like that.




you hit that one dead on..

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OfflineRatatat
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Registered: 02/27/07
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: tripchip]
    #9218676 - 11/10/08 03:21 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

Sorry to thread jack, but would Rye Berries work as a substrate or only Rye Seed?


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Invisiblearp180
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Ratatat]
    #9218753 - 11/10/08 03:37 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

of course rye berries work, it and wbs are by far two of the most popular choices.  Use the search function and you can find loads of info on rye berries.


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Offlinebootedboy
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Re: Can't get Rye to work as a substrate [Re: Ratatat]
    #9218771 - 11/10/08 03:39 PM (16 years, 2 months ago)

I always have this same problem. I decided to step it up to grains recently and all I can seem to do well is fail. It always looks just like your jars too. I am glad to see this thread, it gives me hope to try grains again. I started with popcorn and it worked pretty well but then I saw RR slam the shit out of it so I decided to try rye. I transfered all my popcorn to rye jars and the ones that were not contaminated all turned to mush after shaking. I then tried not shaking them and they just stalled. Lots of the above information is not mentioned in any of the teks; people write the shortest teks they can rather than get into details and it causes lots of failure. I need to know why I am following these steps so I can make sure I am doing it right. I think I will give grain another shot.


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