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InvisibleShroomismM
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Return to Innocence
    #918453 - 10/06/02 06:21 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Many of us have been desensitized and view the world as a cold, hostile environment. If you are like me and have been shocked by the often harsh realities of the world, losing your innocence, let me tell you.. it is not lost. You can find it again.

In this world we can often gain a negative perception of reality. We see cutthroat behaviour from all sides and see it as our only means for survival.. .we see death, hatred, negativity, lack of compassion from many people.. this alters and distorts our perception of reality if we let it. We will lose touch with our innocence and become a cold, hate-filled machine just like all of our mentors.

Yet, there is still hope. Our innocence is not gone.

The fact is, the world is not based on hatred, death and destruction. These things do exist but they do not rule the planet. And they can't rule you either if you don't let them.

Here is my guide for clearing out those negative aspects of yourself that allows you to be filled with spite.. prejudice.. hatred... and that general nihilistic view on society in general.

1. Treat others with kindness, respect.
This one may seem corny and/or obvious, but it works. No matter how evil you think people are it is always in yours and their best interests to be good to them. This doesn't mean you have to suck on their feet, but show a general respect for them.

2. Don't hold grudges.
People may lose your respect for being cruel or mistreating you, but do not use that an excuse to mistreat them. Forgiveness is a powerful thing, and it takes a strong person to forgive and not bring more negativity into a relationship. See number 1.

3. Transform negative relationships, if that does not work eliminate the relationship
In a negative relationship we can learn to mistreat and abuse each other. This is not helpful to your innocence, so it is in everyone's best interest to rid yourselves of negative hostile relationships. Always try to change a negative relationship into a positive one first. If that does not work, then disconnect the relationship. Carrying negativity around is not good, and a long lasting negative relationship can warp your reality and get you stuck in hateful thought patterns. Relinquish yourself from their grips and start over again, fresh. No more binding patterns.
See number 2

4. Commune with nature, find peace
This one is pretty simple. Find a tree, or a lake, or a field, or someplace natural. Be. See number 3

5. See things for the first time
Look at the world as you did as a child. Find awe in every day life. Look at everything as an excited child in a world of mystery. See it for the first time. Gazing at a field of stars is good for invoking this mysterious and wonderful nature. See number 4.

6. Seek out and nourish positive, healthy relationships
Find relationships based on love, trust, understanding, acceptance, respect. Nourish these relationships and cherish them. Blossom them into a wonderful thing. See number 5.

7. Laugh, be happy
This will come naturally through following these steps. See steps 1-6.

There are plenty of more ways to rekindle that innocent, youthful curiosity, but this is a good start.




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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918467 - 09/30/02 02:51 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Couldn't have said it better myself so I won't even try. I agree completely.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918479 - 09/30/02 02:54 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

You're just too young... I'll give you 5-10 years. By then you'll have had your innocence forcefully ripped out like a weed in Alan Watt's rock garden.

Here's a quick way to lose it: Go to Israel and hang out in the West Bank.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #918493 - 09/30/02 02:59 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Don't just assume I am young and ignorant. I have seen the harsh cruelties of reality and lived in the cold darkest pits of hatred, despair and hostility for a long while. I came out of it, brushed myself off and went on my way. I've seen death, destruction, I've seen purest hatred, filth and greed. I have seen suffering and experienced all these things on the tenth degree. Do not assume I do not know what pain and suffering is.


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918521 - 09/30/02 03:12 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

In a word, brilliant.

Cheers,


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OfflineViBrAnT
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: ]
    #918599 - 09/30/02 04:04 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Not only have i seen god but i am seeing him right now.


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" liken this life illusory, for your sand castle will one day be adrift amongst the wind "




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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918627 - 09/30/02 04:22 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I have seen the harsh cruelties of reality and lived in the cold darkest pits of hatred, despair and hostility for a long while.

You worked at the Mall?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Swami]
    #918630 - 09/30/02 04:23 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I did at a point in the past, yes.
Not just any mall, THE mall.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918639 - 09/30/02 04:31 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Don't just assume I am young and ignorant.

I'm not assuming anything.  I said you were young (you ARE).  I never said you were ignorant.  Reading comprehension error..... system meltdown.


Do not assume I do not know what pain and suffering is.

Again... I am assuming nothing.  YOU said you lost your innocence... you can NEVER get it back again.  It's just a fact... no games here.  If you got hit on the head or suffered a brain injury in some other way (Note that I'm not wishing this on you :smile: ), then you might re"gain" that innocence.  Innocence isn't something that can be acquired... it refers to a certain state of mind in which some things are not yet known.  So, if anything... I'm calling you LESS ignorant.

Take this however you want... you always do anyways. 


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #918644 - 09/30/02 04:35 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Main Entry: in?no?cence
Pronunciation: 'i-n&-s&n(t)s
Function: noun
Date: 14th century
1 a : freedom from guilt or sin through being unacquainted with evil : BLAMELESSNESS b : CHASTITY c : freedom from legal guilt of a particular crime or offense d (1) : freedom from guile or cunning : SIMPLICITY (2) : lack of worldly experience or sophistication e : lack of knowledge : IGNORANCE

If we take the first definition innocence can be defined as not being associated with evil. This does not mean that we are blissfully unaware of such an evil, as one can be fully aware of it and not be acquainted with it. Thereby maintaining a state of innocence.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918649 - 09/30/02 04:37 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

The Swami nose all and seize all...


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918653 - 09/30/02 04:43 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I hope that's not supposed to be a counter...
It only strengthens MY point.

If we take the first definition innocence can be defined as not being associated with evil. This does not mean that we are blissfully unaware of such an evil

Your use of the word "blissfully" is unnecessary rhetoric. You're trying to argue with connotations. And it DOES necessarily mean that one is unaware of such an evil... just look at definition 2: IGNORANCE.

It seems you want to have your cake and eat it, too.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #918657 - 09/30/02 04:45 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I generally like to have my cake before I eat it.

My point is that one can be unaware of such evils if one does not commit them. Unless of course other people's evils make you less innocent.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918662 - 09/30/02 04:50 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

My point is that one can be unaware of such evils if one does not commit them.

Point taken, but know that this is NOT innocence.

Unless of course other people's evils make you less innocent.

Don't be ridiculous.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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InvisibleRevelation

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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918718 - 09/30/02 05:40 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

My heart of silk
is filled with lights,
with lost bells,
with lilies and bees.
I will go very far,
farther than those hills,
farther than the seas,
close to the stars,
to beg Christ the Lord
to give back the soul I had
of old, when I was a child,
ripened with legends,
with a feathered cap
and a wooden sword.

Federico Garcia Lorca


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Offlineakyouser_oner
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #918997 - 09/30/02 09:38 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

brother, you have saved a life today. thank you... she works in mysterious ways, eh?


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-akyouser.oner
<(((((((((((((((@~~~


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: akyouser_oner]
    #919088 - 09/30/02 10:59 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Glad I could be of service

Yes.... yes she does


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Edited by Shroomism (09/30/02 11:17 AM)


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OfflineGrav
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #919246 - 09/30/02 12:38 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Well, while some people are arguing over dictionary definitions...
that post made me really happy, shroomism :smile: and alot of others im sure
the power of kindness seems to be very underated..

I totally agree with you.. but maybe we should drop the whole innocense thing and just call it simply
"how to be happy in a world of shit"  :tongue:


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #919301 - 09/30/02 01:41 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Your points are well taken and for the most part I agree with them. However, you have intimated in your own way that Shroomism could become as cynical as you. In that, you are wrong. It seems from your posts that life has dealt you a bad hand. If that is so I am sorry to hear it. There is nothing wrong with being skeptical but cynicism portends an ailing heart.

Cheers Bro,


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #919448 - 09/30/02 02:55 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

In reply to:

Don't just assume I am young and ignorant.

I'm not assuming anything. I said you were young (you ARE). I never said you were ignorant. Reading comprehension error..... system meltdown.




Nah Sclorch, really, you're putting your feet near an argumentum ad antiquitatem, means the "older is better" attitude. If you didn't, then what do you imply by saying "you are too young" ? What's the inference of the phrase ?
Anyway, regarding this "return to innocence" have you ever seen the joy many old people have when playing with children ? What they say about when they were that age ? Their faces of happiness when good old memories surface ?
Maybe it's you the one who's not old enough or perhaps not too young....

MAIA


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Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #919497 - 09/30/02 03:20 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Thank you for that post Shroomism.

You reminded me that we never completely lose our innocence, no matter what we witness in life - there will always be a part of us, deep inside, that is pure and incorruptible.


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OfflinegeokillsA
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #919524 - 09/30/02 03:39 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

i enjoyed this thread and the discussions within, much.


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··∙   long live the shroomery  ∙··
...π╥ ╥π...


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #919531 - 09/30/02 03:44 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Anyways if we are talking total soul age as opposed to current physical incarnation age which is about 70 million or so.


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InvisibleIn(di)go
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #919845 - 09/30/02 06:07 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

i love you guys... all of you!


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OfflineChubbSubb
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: infidelGOD]
    #920057 - 09/30/02 07:45 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Nice post Shroomism.
One love, Trev


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Those who know do not speak.
Those who speak do not know.


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: MAIA]
    #920224 - 09/30/02 08:46 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Well said, well done.

I haven't forgotten your pajamas I've just been very busy.

Nice to see you posting. :smile:

Cheers,


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #921638 - 10/01/02 05:55 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I thought this post was wise enough that I am making it a sticky for a day or two.

Cheers,


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Offlinerasta
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #921856 - 10/01/02 09:03 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

shroomism you should write a book. all your posts are insightful and make deep strong points. im yet to find a post by you that sucks. kudos bra =)


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-=[??†?]=-


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #922003 - 10/01/02 10:28 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Nah don't write a book, theres something weird about that. Keep writing to the people who won't judge the hell out of ya. I've enjoyed your writings for some time now.


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OfflineGlacius
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #922080 - 10/01/02 11:06 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Amazingly true. I also could not put it better. Thankfully I have discovered these enlightenments on my own, but they will always be practiced, to make my life more enjoyable. I will always get better at them, if I keep it the right mind set, and life just gets better and better. See the good in the world, as well as the bad.
Mushrooms really help me find peace, and understanding of nature, and life in general. I also think being clear heading has a great effect on these things as well.


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addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: ]
    #922082 - 10/01/02 11:07 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Man... I'm gettin' slapped around in here.

I figured you kids would have seen through my curtness by now. I guess not.
Let me make one thing clear: I KNOW what Shroomism is saying... he is speaking of the virtues of the "beginner's mind". I know this.

The problem is that he's calling it "innocence". This is not the right word for it. Although there can be a "beginner's mind" connotation to the word "innocence"... it only leads to an unhelpful ambiguity. Innocence is useless to an adult as it is paired with ignorance. The beginner's mindset is useful to ALL.

Now quit calling me cynical and stop trying to back it up with crap like this:
It seems from your posts that life has dealt you a bad hand.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineGlacius
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Glacius]
    #922094 - 10/01/02 11:10 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I would have to agree with shroomism on the subject. Inoccence can be found, as long as you keep learning. We will never cease to be inoccent. We just have to keep our minds full of new things, and see it from a wider perspective.


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addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: rasta]
    #922134 - 10/01/02 11:24 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I was thinking about writing a book but then I was like... nahh fuck that I'll just write everything anyways and give it away for free.


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Offlinejohnnyfive
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #922221 - 10/01/02 12:02 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Shroomism there one thing you forgot to also mention.

Use Visionary tools that earth has gave us, there called Psychedelics!!!!!

Psychedelics are the BIGGEST help in my life that has returned my innocences!!

ps... Hey shroomism you ever heard of the song " the return of innocence " It has a bad ass indian singing in it! I think it was made my enya.


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And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: johnnyfive]
    #922227 - 10/01/02 12:04 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Yah... never underestimate the power of insight potential held by mushrooms and meditation.


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Invisiblechodamunky
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #922794 - 10/01/02 03:28 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

In this world we can often gain a negative perception of reality. We see cutthroat behaviour from all sides and see it as our only means for survival.. .we see death, hatred, negativity, lack of compassion from many people..

and you can get all that and then some in a tight 1 hour News program. Ahhhhh, gotta love television....



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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #923164 - 10/01/02 05:48 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

This kind of goes with "don't hold grudges", but I think learning to be non-judgemental is a big part in letting our inner child bloom.

Young children don't seperate or judge each other by race, class, or gender...


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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Invisiblebuttonion
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #923248 - 10/01/02 06:20 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I KNOW what Shroomism is saying... he is speaking of the virtues of the "beginner's mind".

Yeah, this is exactly how I have been interpreting Shroomism?s ?innocence? thus far. From this perspective, a return to innocence does seem possible and beneficial.


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Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein


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InvisibleSpiffy
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #923430 - 10/01/02 07:19 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

These are beautiful and oh-so-true.  I think everyone should try this.  It seems like a clear and peaceful path to happiness.  Hold love true in your heart.  Never give up on it. :smile: 


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Namaste: "I honour that place in you where the whole Universe resides. And when I am in that place in me and you are in that place in you,
there is only one of us."


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #923688 - 10/01/02 08:44 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Here is model from a book by a Martin Seligman that's pretty relevant to the post. Seligman teaches a form of learned optimism, i guess you could say, using this approach. Its aimed, of course, mainly at people with a pessimistic explanatory style of the world...

A(adversity). Recognize when adversity hits. For die-hard pessimists, successes are a form of adversity; they say, "It wont last," "I was just lucky," or "Too little, too late."

B(beliefs). Be aware of what you believe about the adversity.

C(consequences). Be aware of the emotional and other consequences of your belief about that adversity.

D(disputation). Question whether your beliefs are the only explanation. For example, ask:
  • What is the evidence for my beliefs?
  • What are other possible explanations for what happend?
  • What are the implications of my believing this way, and do they make it worth holding on to my beliefs?
  • How useful are my beliefs? Do I or others get any benefits from holding on to them, or would we be benefit more if we held other beliefs?


Now, these dont work too well if you ruminate constantly(like me..heh). You would need to learn more than just a more optimistic explanatory style. You would need to learn how to jerk away from the hold pessimistic thoughts have on you!


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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Offlinedumlovesyou
retired shroomer
 User Gallery

Registered: 05/02/01
Posts: 687
Loc: One dimension
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #924085 - 10/02/02 04:15 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Cool post! I have been thinking about this also. We must be pure! :smile: Nothing must stop us! Nothing must touch us! SHROOM ON!!!!


--------------------
I see trees of green, psylocibe mushrooms too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself what a wonderful world


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #924895 - 10/02/02 02:19 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

We must be pure!

Sounds like eugenics....


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #926745 - 10/03/02 12:50 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Now quit calling me cynical and stop trying to back it up with crap like this:
It seems from your posts that life has dealt you a bad hand.


I only have my perception to rely on.

In any event, your points are noted and I agree with them.

Cheers,


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: ]
    #926782 - 10/03/02 01:02 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I only have my perception to rely on.

That's all anybody ever has. :wink: 


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Offlinedumlovesyou
retired shroomer
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Registered: 05/02/01
Posts: 687
Loc: One dimension
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Sclorch]
    #933991 - 10/05/02 08:35 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

    Might sound like eugenics, But we have CHLORINE to clear our soul!! :smile:


--------------------
I see trees of green, psylocibe mushrooms too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself what a wonderful world


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
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Re: Return to Innocence [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #934249 - 10/05/02 12:08 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

innocense is a frame of mind....
what can ever be lost? what can ever be attained?
if we attaine something it was there since the beggining of time.
if we lose something it is hiding somewhere near us.

now the real question..isnt Innocence only an illusion?


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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InvisibleCheeba
the shroomyqueen

Registered: 09/23/02
Posts: 158
Loc: atop my secret mountain
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: CleverName]
    #934472 - 10/05/02 02:16 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Of the good in you I can speak, but not of the evil. For what is evil but good tortured by its own hunger and thirst?
Verily when good is hungry it seeks food even in dark caves, and when it thirsts it drinks even of dead waters.
You are good when you are one with yourself.
Yet when you are not one with yourself you are not evil. For a dividd house is not a den of thieves; it is only a divided house.
And a ship without a rudder may wander aimlessly amoung perilous waters yet sink not to the bottom.
You are good when you strive to give of yourself. For when you strive for gain you are but a root that clings to the earth and sucks at her breast. Surely the fruit cannot say to the root, "Be like me, ripe and full and ever giving of your abundence."
For to the fruit giving is a need, as reciving is a need to the root. You are good when you are fully awake in your life, yet you are not evil when you sleep while your tounge staggers without purpose! And even stumbling peech may strenthen a weak tounge.


--------------------
Carpe Diem <*))))><
Theres one sweet whirld out there!!
Now remember, you are unique! Just like everybody else!


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OfflineStankyBitch
member
Registered: 07/23/01
Posts: 186
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Cheeba]
    #934485 - 10/05/02 02:30 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Great Post! It is nice to see people trying to help one another. I come from a horrible town where everyone goes to work minimum wage jobs and it gets depressing. People don't want to be here and are generally pissed off 99% of the time. I have only met a few people who I really connect with. Also, I lost one of my best friends (my ex-girlfriend) a week or so ago. She didn't die, but I think it hurts her too much to see me. We were in love, but had a horrible relationship full of fussing and fighting. I have had a horrible summer and it is nice to see something hopeful. Thank you again!


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Anonymous

Re: Return to Innocence [Re: Shroomism]
    #936039 - 10/06/02 06:21 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Simple, yet very profound. Nice post Shroomism.


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