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Razoom
In true believer.



Registered: 09/21/08
Posts: 538
Loc: Earth habitable
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
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Re: New Psilocybe species [Re: CureCat]
#9672283 - 01/24/09 05:38 PM (15 years, 6 days ago) |
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It weiliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii..... And they smell also is delicious?
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: New Psilocybe species [Re: CureCat]
#9674495 - 01/25/09 03:07 AM (15 years, 5 days ago) |
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Quite a coincidence, I'm sure Subbedhunter420 can come up with another name! inski..
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Subbedhunter420
Solitary Hunter



Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 1,501
Loc: LA/Ventura County
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
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Re: New Psilocybe species [Re: inski]
#9676477 - 01/25/09 01:28 PM (15 years, 5 days ago) |
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Alteredstates and I did some brainstorming last night. We will continue to find another name that will suit the mushroom. Embody its personalty!
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Post deleted by alteredstatesReason for deletion: jumping the gun
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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BlimeyGrimey
Collector of Spores




Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 3,787
Loc: Puget Sound
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Remember that if this species is described by someone else before you publish something then your name won't stick. If I was you I would write up the description and save the naming for last. That way you can be sure that the name you pick is the one that you want the mushroom to be known as officially. Plus, if you don't make the name official through a respected journal then the name you pick could be invalidated like the first name. Write that description and submit it for peer review.
-------------------- Message me for free microscopy services on Psilocybe, Panaeolus, and Gymnopilus species. Looking for wild Panaeolus cinctulus and Panaeolus olivaceus prints.
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: BlimeyGrimey]
#9679618 - 01/25/09 09:32 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Description of wood-loving Southern California Psilocybe species Probably section Stuntzae
Cap -2-8cm broad -Mostly convex, often becoming broadly umbonate or uplifted with age. Sometimes wavy. Rarely plane. -Smooth surface. May be somewhat viscid and translucent when wet. -Color varies: typically dark when young (brownish), but may also be light (dull yellow/orange/brown). With age the color fades and is typically a light yellowish brown(?) (sometimes almost to a cream), often retaining a darker brownish margin. pallid. -Sometimes staining blue or blue-green.
Gills -Adnate. -Light, pallid, becoming yellow-brownish. -Close to crowded.
Stalk -3-6cm long -4-8mm thick -Most often equal or tapering upward, sometimes tapering down. -White to very light brown. -Often staining blue. -Annulus present, often completely blue.
Spores -Light purple.
On agar -Blues almost down to the hyphal level. -Forms scleriota.
Habitat -Southern California- So far it has been found in Ventura and Los Angeles Counties. -This is a warm weather species. I have found it fruiting from 70 to 95 degrees Fahrenheit. -It likes a wide range of wood (alder, conifer, eucalyptus, and several other types I have given it). -Fruits in wood chip beds, mostly near/under plant or bush. -It is Gregarious, often densely clustered. -Its season is fairly long, from 4 to 6 months (April- late September/early October).
Note color

Note beauty 

note lighter color

note viscidity

note annulus

note abnormally light pins

There has been no proper microscopy on this species yet. The following are some pictures from Alan Rockefeller. Alan, if you have measurements on the spores, Cheilocystidia, and Pleurocystidia, I would definitely like to know.
Spores

Cheilocystidia

Pleurocystidia

Please let me know what else I should put into the description.
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#9680071 - 01/25/09 10:52 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Thats a good description alteredstates, but your paper will need to be a lot more detailed if you want it to be reviewed, like this one that Alan posted! Psilocybe meridionalis info inski.
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: inski]
#9680139 - 01/25/09 11:03 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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I see, in that case, I have a lot more work to do. Thanks a bunch for the advice.
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#9680179 - 01/25/09 11:10 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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You will need to work with a mycologist if you want to name this species, someone who can write the latin prologue! inski..
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: inski]
#9680187 - 01/25/09 11:13 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Gotcha. That is definately something I need to learn. Who on this website is an actual mycologist?
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#9680196 - 01/25/09 11:16 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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You need to work with someone like Dr. Guzman. inski..
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: inski]
#9680221 - 01/25/09 11:22 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Do you know how to contact Dr. Guzman or someone like him?
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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inski
Cortinariologist



Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5,720
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#9680225 - 01/25/09 11:24 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Maybe Alan can help you!
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: inski]
#9680240 - 01/25/09 11:28 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Thanks inksi.
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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cactu
culture and magic



Registered: 03/06/06
Posts: 3,913
Loc: mexicoelcentrodelconocimi...
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#9682209 - 01/26/09 12:37 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Dr. Gaston Guzman Emeritus Research and Head of the Fungus Collection of Instituto de Ecologia P.O. Box 63 Xalapa, Veracruz 91070, Mexico
email: gaston.guzman [at] inecol.edu.mx
good luck . if you need more help let me know her doughter is in very close to where i live like 30 minutes away.
edit: modified email address to avoid spam
--------------------
  cuando una rafaga del pensamiento nos pasa al lado se puede sentir que valio la pena haber vivido, y cuando ese pensamiento se convierte en sueño no paramos de soñar hasta realizarlo
Edited by Alan Rockefeller (01/26/09 01:35 PM)
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alteredstates
Psilosilly


Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 198
Loc: PNW
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: cactu]
#9683018 - 01/26/09 02:46 PM (15 years, 4 days ago) |
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Thank you all, I have already received an email back from Dr. Guzman. Hopefully things can get underway very soon.
-------------------- Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds.
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Strophariaceae
mycologist



Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 109
Loc: Marvelous Marin County, C...
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: alteredstates]
#10201275 - 04/20/09 12:06 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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I missed this thread some months back when it was going on. Has anybody heard back from Guzmán on this?
Has anybody established whether or not this is the same thing that has been going under the name Psilocybe subaeruginascens (sensu Guzmán) in northern Cal (and the Seattle area)?
I've actually done extensive microcopic work on this, and a couple of type studies establishing solidly that the "P. subaeruginascens" from the Bay Area, Seattle, and Japan (and likely these Southern Cal ones) are not P. subaeruginascens or P. aeruginomaculans as originally described by Höhnel from Java. (They are likely not even in the same section of Psilocybe, in fact.) I'm less willing to call the small differences between populations as species level differences, at least without a lot more taxonomic work. Its also too early to tell whether the North American and Japanese populations are different species – neither I nor anyone else I know of has had access to both North American and Japanese material so as to be able to compare (the type collections kept by Hongo are an utter loss, BTW), but based on pictures I've seen of the spores and of mushrooms themselves, they certainly look roughly the same.
BTW, does anybody actually have any myco contacts in Japan? I believe May-June is "P. subaeruginascns" season there and I'd love to get some material.
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nightflyer



Registered: 08/08/08
Posts: 392
Loc: Central Europe
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: Strophariaceae]
#10202064 - 04/20/09 02:44 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Hi Stroph
Last year I started cultures of both species:
Psilocybe subaeruginascens (from San Francisco, auweia collection) [image]http:// [/image]
Psilocybe "meridianus" from Ventura County, southern California (subbedhunter collection) [image]http:// [/image]
In my opinion two different species.
Edited by nightflyer (04/21/09 09:07 AM)
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Mr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector


Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: Strophariaceae]
#10204522 - 04/20/09 10:45 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Strophariaceae said:
BTW, does anybody actually have any myco contacts in Japan?
Shroomery member, kablamo moved there last month and requests have been made.
Good luck.
--------------------
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Strophariaceae
mycologist



Registered: 02/02/04
Posts: 109
Loc: Marvelous Marin County, C...
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: Description for new Psilocybe species [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
#10204837 - 04/20/09 11:44 PM (14 years, 9 months ago) |
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"In my opinion two different species. "
Based on culture characteristics? I guess I'm just not seeing the same thing you are from those plates.
However, I guess what I'm particularly skeptical of is its identification with the P. meridionalis that Guzmán published last year:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/9663079#9663079
First, the ecotypes are very different – you're talking about a woodchip species, while Guzmán described a species from highland forests of Mexico. There are a number of active Psilocybe from that habitat, but to the best of my knowledge, none of them cross over habitat-wise onto woodchip beds in the US.
Also, has anybody even looked at the microscopy of the southern Cal species? That level of alpha taxonomy absolutely needs to be done before you can say anything definitive about what group it falls into. (In fact, I'd go so far as to say that when dealing with closely-related species, microscopy will provide a lot more info more quickly than simple molecular methods will – I think you'd probably need a really large multi-gene sample to resolve Psilocybe in the same section definitively.) Based on my reading of Guzman's monograph and my own knowledge of the northern Cal population, a quick look at the pleurocystidia would tell you whether you're dealing with something closer to the Northern Cal species or closer to P. meridionalis.
Edited by Strophariaceae (04/20/09 11:45 PM)
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