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OfflineSeraph
ShroomiN'SeraphiM
Female


Registered: 06/23/02
Posts: 183
Loc: South Flordia
Last seen: 5 years, 10 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9169167 - 11/01/08 05:24 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I have done wbs cased with coir before. and as someone above said the depth issue is rather controversial.

in my experience i have cased with anywhere from 1" - 4" of spawn to about 1 1/2" of coir to vermiculite with about i have noticed a slight difference in speed as far as time of casing to the finish of the first flush. the smaller casings do seem to fruit a lot faster one difference that is really worth noting is the size of the mushrooms themselves. obviously the less spawn the smaller the mushrooms will be but the quantity of mushrooms is higher. I have also observed that with smaller amounts of spawn in a casing the flushes aren't really even or dense. i have yielded about an ounce to 2 ounces on a casing after all flushes. The yield for a larger spawn to coir ration is just about the same but the mushrooms are fewer and larger and flushes are more even. Of course these results can be due to my own techniques.

one way that i can suggest getting better results in speed would be to make sure that your fruiting chamber is set up to optimal parameters meaning humidity, temperature and air exchange. and definitely be sure to keep and eye out for overlay. that will slow down the fruiting process and coir in my experience has a tendency to overlay. one of my casings is currently suffering from overlay and it has slowed me down quite a bit.
currently i am growing on rye cased with coir. i have harvested about a half ounce on this first flush. However I'm not so happy with the potency of just plain rye w/ coir. i intend on making another casing soon using some composted rabbit poo thats in my back yard. yes i have two bunny's and they poop a lot. lol


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(\(\
( -.-)
o_(")(")

~nicole

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Offlinewidowmaker487
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 350
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: Seraph]
    #9169261 - 11/01/08 05:49 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

im probly gonna use the poor mans pod method grow chamber, ive got tons of pumps laying around and seems good.


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Everything I eat is from the Earth, right.
I am what I eat straight up Earth, right.
Nothing but a walking sack of Earth nice to meet you how do ya do.
Guess what. Ya you're one too.

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Offlinewidowmaker487
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 350
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9169319 - 11/01/08 06:04 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

what do you all think about using the poor mans pod with these small trays, sound ok.  Also how do you know how much moisture is supposed to be in the coir when mixed with the wbs,  I read several teks, but they skip that part.  Thanks all


--------------------
Everything I eat is from the Earth, right.
I am what I eat straight up Earth, right.
Nothing but a walking sack of Earth nice to meet you how do ya do.
Guess what. Ya you're one too.

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OfflineScavengerType
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Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9169423 - 11/01/08 06:29 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I just want to further point out for you though that what you gain in time you will probibly loose in yield quite a bit. Do a PMP, make a monotub, just branch out with your options. Given that you have enough spawn it sounds a little reasonable, barring of course space restrictions for the grow duration.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

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Offlinechucklehead
GeneticThrowback toNeanderthal
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Registered: 02/17/07
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Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: T2K_Rusty]
    #9169831 - 11/01/08 08:12 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Nibin
Quote:

50-50 verm/peat or verm/coir?



Peat Moss and Vermiculite.

T2K_Rusty
Quote:

Doesn't sound bad at all. I'm curious to know the specifications of said grow chamber though!  IME , mixing will have a little faster colonization speed than layering. I'd take advantage of teh wbs spawning characteristics to, and up it to a 1:2 ratio. It'll still take less than a week at 1:2.  Also add some spent coffee grinds to the coir, it seems to help in getting more flushes.




I agree.  Mixing is my preference over layering.  RR says mixing risks breaking open the kernels which could result in contamination.  I wear rubber gloves and mix gently. 

I also agree that the monotub is probably your best bet for easy and expense.  Otherwise if you go with the gladware trays, build a martha.

Also deeper substrate is better.  I usually go 5 inches in my mono tubs.

As for step by steps it's not complicated.  For each mono tub like this I use 3 quarts of WBS and one brick of coir.  I pour the WBS in first.  Then the pasteurized coir.  Then I mix it.  Let it colonize 100%.  Then I case it with 50-50 verm/peat moss.  I frequently add things to the coir such as a few cups of horse manure, several table spoons of chicken manure, a cup or so of diatomacious earth, and frequently spent coffee grounds.  What I add depends on what's laying around and largely my mood.



This is three bricks of coir from pet supplies plus that cost 7 dollars.


For the glad ware trays two bricks can easily make 7 trays.  So if you go with those there is no chance you'll have room for that in a small fruiting chamber.  Given your quantity of spawn, again I suggest a couple mono tubs.

For the martha you'll need one of these.  You can get them at Lowes in the garden department.  You'll also need a humidifier.  I actually use two.  One inside and one outside.  The reason for one outside is to keep fresh air pumping into the martha without drying out the martha.  Plus I put a tub under the green house kit and fill it perlite in the bottom.

Here is the green house.






As for G2G... that's risky for someone new to the hobby.  Try it if you like but I've been at this a couple years and I still don't mess with it.  I don't have a flow hood or a hepa filter.  It's on my list of future projects but I'm comfortable with my current techniques.  Those being LC to WBS spawned to a coir mix.

:goodluck:

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Offlinewidowmaker487
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 350
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: chucklehead]
    #9170623 - 11/02/08 12:08 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

thanks alot chuckle head, but whats wrong with puting trays in a monotub, i would think incubating the trays would speed up the process


--------------------
Everything I eat is from the Earth, right.
I am what I eat straight up Earth, right.
Nothing but a walking sack of Earth nice to meet you how do ya do.
Guess what. Ya you're one too.

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OfflineScavengerType
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Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
Loc: The North
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9170755 - 11/02/08 01:12 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Mushroom subs generate their own heat from their metabolic activity so incubating trays may help contaminants. I know many have said spawn jars are about 5 degrees warmer than external temperatures because of this.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

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OfflineT2K_Rusty
Rusty Shackleford
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 342
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9170815 - 11/02/08 01:37 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

widowmaker487 said:
thanks alot chuckle head, but whats wrong with puting trays in a monotub, i would think incubating the trays would speed up the process




Do not put "trays" into a monotub. Simply dump about 3 quarts of spawn, and 9 quarts of coir into the monotub, mix it all together. You might need more or less spawn/coir mix, depending on if your particularly sized monotub will get a 5-6 inch substrate. Anywhere from 4-6 inches deep substrate (without the casing layer added) is what you want in a large monotub.

If you want to use trays, then a martha is the way to go. It's also good for people who want to use more than enough spawn for a couple monotubs.  It's basicly a small-closet sized greenhouse fruiting chamber, in which you can place several bulk or straight cased grain trays in.    It is mechanicly(sp?) humidified as well, so it requires more maintenance than a simple monotub.



The concept of a monotub is so very simple, and one of my favorite ways to grow is using miniature monotubs. In fact, for the last 3 years of growing, all I've used is "mini" monotubs and sometimes i put a cake in a quart jar, either dunked and rolled or crumbled and cased.


This is one of the "mini" monotubs.  IMO the simplest way to fruit cubensis, with least amount of maintenance.














Much smaller than the average sized monotub, but it is based on the same concept. The substrate and casing layer provide enough humidity, and i really just fan it and mist it for FAE and to keep up humidity as well.    The "mini tub" in those pictures only used a single quart worth of spawn, and another quart and a half of coir, with a handfull of spent coffee grounds. Very small scale, but same concept.  Look up monotubs if you don't know exactly what I mean.  The sub & casing layer will provide enough of a humid climate, coupled with misting/fanning (kindof a cross between a shotgun and monotub).  With larger monotubs even less maintenance is necessary, but with a 3-4 inch substrate, like that one,  some fanning and misting sure aint gonna hurt it. Pretty much a self sustainable tray of cased substrate.


--------------------
Sh sh shaw!


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Offlinewidowmaker487
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 350
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: T2K_Rusty]
    #9170884 - 11/02/08 01:51 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

wow, guess i will be doing it like that...  I have 8 plus quarts of spawn wbs,  what size and how many tubs should i get?  I want it compact and short as it needs to be hidden


--------------------
Everything I eat is from the Earth, right.
I am what I eat straight up Earth, right.
Nothing but a walking sack of Earth nice to meet you how do ya do.
Guess what. Ya you're one too.

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OfflineT2K_Rusty
Rusty Shackleford
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Registered: 10/08/08
Posts: 342
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9170970 - 11/02/08 01:19 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Not sure, but 3 or 4,    18 gallon sized rubbermaides should fit your need.  I'm just guessing off top of my head though.  The pics up thur are just small, and those tubs only put out about an ounce, to an ounce and an eighth  dry.    8 quarts is gonna be a lot more.    Still, just use 7 of the quarts, and keep one for grain to grain transfers. It's ininitely better than using spore syringes.  By the time you've off the monos, it'll be time to spawn the next set of quarts.  To increase the amount of flushes, i suggest about a morning or two's worth of spent coffe grounds, be boiled in with a brick of coir. A brick of coir will expand to quite a bit though, so maybe 3 or 4 handfulls of spent coffee will be in order.  Apparently the grounds add nitrogen, which is what coir alone seems to lack.  I've done this, and it indeed seems to lend better to the coir after the 1st flush, as compared to just coir.


--------------------
Sh sh shaw!


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OfflineScavengerType
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Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 5,784
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Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: T2K_Rusty]
    #9171016 - 11/02/08 01:36 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7803673#7803673

this spawn ratio calculator could be useful.


--------------------
"Have you ever seen what happens when a grenade goes off in a school? Do you really know what you’re doing when you order shock and awe? Are you prepared to kneel beside a dying soldier and tell him why he went to Iraq, or why he went to any war?"
"The things that are done in the name of the shareholder are, to me, as terrifying as the things that are done—dare I say it—in the name of God. Montesquieu said, "There have never been so many civil wars as in the Kingdom of God." And I begin to feel that’s true. The shareholder is the excuse for everything."
- Author and former M6/M5 agent John le Carré on Democracy Now.
Conquer's Club

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Invisiblelarge_dose
Melonhead
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Registered: 05/05/06
Posts: 1,346
Loc: Right in the Middle
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: ScavengerType]
    #9171037 - 11/02/08 01:49 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

if you type "spawning to coir" in the search function it comes up with this thread, under the same title.

Spawning to coir

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Offlinewidowmaker487
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 350
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: large_dose]
    #9171704 - 11/02/08 09:41 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

yea, ive got that bookmarked already,  the whole reason i even wanted trays, was to keep em small and be able to incubate.  Monotub it is, some small ones.  Do you all think manure would be a better choice to spawn to than coir,  I keep seeing that latter flushes arent as potent and such, but is it really that much of a difference.  I have to drive 30 minutes to some dirt place to get some so,  is poo worth it.  (its cow poop and mulch)


--------------------
Everything I eat is from the Earth, right.
I am what I eat straight up Earth, right.
Nothing but a walking sack of Earth nice to meet you how do ya do.
Guess what. Ya you're one too.

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Offlinegofudgeyourself
Student
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Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 710
Loc: Flag
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
Re: Spawning to coir.... [Re: widowmaker487]
    #9171735 - 11/02/08 09:56 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

im pastureizing a brick of coir right now :smile: my first serious bulk attempt, w00t!

i got all the info i need from RR's videos about using straw.


--------------------
"believe it if you need it, or leave it if you dare."

"turn all the hate in the world, into a mocking bird. make it fly away" :peace:

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