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Offlinelonestar2004
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Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania?
    #9110003 - 10/21/08 04:04 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Apparently, Obama's internals were leaked to a radio talk show host in Scranton. they show Obama up by only 2 in PA.
Steve Corbett, a radio talk show host in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton, accidentally received a copy of an internal email sent by Grant Olin who heads the Wilkes-Barre headquarters of the Obama campaign. The email went to 627 Obama campaign volunteers in the Wilkes-Barre Scranton region, saying that Obama Headquarters reported an internal poll which shows that Obama is only 2 points up in Pennsylvania.

Sean Smith, who is heading Obama’s Pennsylvania campaign, was interviewed by Steve Corbett via phone at 5:35 today to discuss this. He said that Grant "went rogue", and aknowledged that Grant was "reprimanded" for this.




Here is the audio.

http://audio.wilknewsradio.com/m/audio/21203046/corbett-speaks-with-sean-smith.htm

Some polls have Obama up 10 to 15 Points in PA! Bullshit, then why is Obama, Biden, and Hillary wasting so much time in Pennsylvania?

:rolleyes:


I think Obama knows he's losing in Pennsylvania.


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Offlinemaudlin
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? *DELETED* [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9110012 - 10/21/08 04:06 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by maudlin

Reason for deletion: eh



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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: maudlin]
    #9110024 - 10/21/08 04:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

why is he trying to solidify this 10-28 point lead he has in all these swing states


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9110061 - 10/21/08 04:15 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

He's just trying to make sure people are not complacent, IMO.
These are all of the recent PA polls:

Morning Call 10/16 - 10/20 600 LV 4.0 52 42 Obama +10
Susquehanna 10/16 - 10/18 700 LV 3.7 48 40 Obama +8
SurveyUSA 10/11 - 10/13 516 LV 4.4 55 40 Obama +15
Marist 10/05 - 10/08 757 LV 3.5 53 41 Obama +12
Strategic Vision (R) 10/05 - 10/07 1200 LV 3.0 54 40 Obama +14
Rasmussen 10/06 - 10/06 700 LV 4.0 54 41 Obama +13
SurveyUSA 10/05 - 10/06 653 LV 3.9 55 40 Obama +15
Morning Call Tracking 09/26 - 09/30 598 LV 4.0 48 41 Obama +7
Quinnipiac 09/27 - 09/29 832 LV 3.4 54 39 Obama +15
FOX News/Rasmussen 09/28 - 09/28 500 LV 4.5 50 42 Obama +8
Franklin & Marshall 09/23 - 09/28 767 RV 3.5 45 38 Obama +7
Morning Call 09/21 - 09/25 577 LV 4.5 47 43 Obama +4
Rasmussen 09/24 - 09/24 500 LV 4.0 49 45 Obama +4
SurveyUSA 09/23 - 09/24 1094 LV 3.0 50 44 Obama +6
Strategic Vision (R) 09/21 - 09/23 1200 LV 3.0 47 46 Obama +1
CNN/Time 09/21 - 09/23 730 LV 3.5 53 44 Obama +9



Yeah.

Obama's got Pennsylvania. He just wants to make it seem closer.


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: supernovasky]
    #9110130 - 10/21/08 04:25 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

How about a link to any poll released since May that shows McCain with a lead?


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9110335 - 10/21/08 05:06 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

In a state that could have easily gone either way, I'd be happy if he were just in the margin.  I'd be even happier if he were back in the margin because McCain was forced to the left, but that doesn't seem to be the case.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9110406 - 10/21/08 05:22 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Definitely could have been an intentional leak, throw the McCain campaign off course...


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: supernovasky]
    #9110415 - 10/21/08 05:24 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

supernovasky said:
He's just trying to make sure people are not complacent, IMO.

Obama's got Pennsylvania. He just wants to make it seem closer.




That's a backwards strategy, but I can see it


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #9110809 - 10/21/08 06:39 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Definitely could have been an intentional leak, throw the McCain campaign off course...





i thought about that too! we obviously need a life! :grin:


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

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America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9111661 - 10/21/08 08:58 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Rendell 'still a little nervous' about Penn., asks Obama to return


(CNN) — Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell has sent two separate memos to the Obama campaign in the past five days requesting that the Democratic Presidential candidate—as well as Hillary and Bill Clinton—return to campaign in Pennsylvania, Rendell told CNN's Gloria Borger.

Rendell said the McCain campaign is clearly making a push to win Pennsylvania, given the recent visits by the Arizona senator, his wife and his running mate. As a result, he wants Obama to appear in western Pennsylvania, Harrisburg and one more “large rally” in Philadelphia. Democrats generally worry that the race is significantly closer than what recent polls have suggested. According to Rendell, there is also worry among Democrats the McCain campaign has successfully raised the enthusiasm level among Republicans in the state.

“I don’t want to be selfish,” Rendell said. “But I’m still a little nervous, so I have asked Obama to come back. We understand he’s got demands from 20 different states, but we’d like to see him here.”

Obama's support appears to be weakest in the western part of the state, a region Pennsylvania Rep. Jack Murtha recently called 'racist,' and one where he badly lost to Sen. Hillary Clinton in the Democratic primary.

Obama last campaigned in Pennsylvania on October 11, a week and a half ago. VP candidate Joe Biden made an appearance with Bill and Hillary Clinton in Scranton on October 12. McCain and running mate Sarah Palin have both made visits to the state this week.

The latest CNN poll of polls in Pennsylvania suggests Obama hold a 13 point lead over McCain there. CNN currently considers the state leaning Obama.


http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/21/rendell-still-a-little-nervous-about-penn-asks-obama-to-return/


If McCain won Pennsylvania Obama could win Colorado, New Mexico, Iowa, new Hampshire and Virgina and still lose.

i think....

where is that interactive map?


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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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InvisibleFerris
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9111678 - 10/21/08 09:01 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/electoral-vote-tracker.htm

Ya, that would put him at 265 according to this one.

If you throw in Nevada though, which I know is under a lot of Dem attention (they're filtering California's resources over to there) and is leaning Dem, Obama has it.


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9111684 - 10/21/08 09:03 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:

The latest CNN poll of polls in Pennsylvania suggests Obama hold a 13 point lead over McCain there. CNN currently considers the state leaning Obama.








:rofl:

shit CNN does not even trust its own polls....


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9111692 - 10/21/08 09:04 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks Ferris, i need to bookmark that site.


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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InvisibleFerris
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9111695 - 10/21/08 09:04 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

No, I think that they just add weight to older polls, to add less credence to sudden swings.  Under that method, it's probably still within the 5 points that would keep it a swing state.


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Invisiblevonhumboldt
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9111869 - 10/21/08 09:26 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

The real issue is that McCain is not just behind in polls but has pretty much conceded or heavily reduced campaigning/advertising in the following states: Minnesota, Wisconsin, New Hampshire, Michigan, Colorado, Iowa, and New Mexico. A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

And Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in 20 years, so I doubt in this election where we'll probably witness a convincing Obama victory as well as Democrats winning additional seats in Congress that Pennsylvania will go for McCain.


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9111886 - 10/21/08 09:29 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

If McCain wins Pennsylvania and every state listed as swing by RCP he still loses by 16 votes.  So, pick another state to delude yourself into thinking is competitive.  Probably Virginia.

I'm still waiting with bated breath to know how you think the electoral college will give McCain 300+ votes. 


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9111898 - 10/21/08 09:30 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I was going to mention too that Virginia was more likely to go McCain.


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Invisiblevonhumboldt
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9111931 - 10/21/08 09:35 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

thedefone said:
If McCain wins Pennsylvania and every state listed as swing by RCP he still loses by 16 votes.  So, pick another state to delude yourself into thinking is competitive.  Probably Virginia.

I'm still waiting with bated breath to know how you think the electoral college will give McCain 300+ votes. 




Virginia does not look for McCain either:



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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9111948 - 10/21/08 09:37 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe California?


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9111998 - 10/21/08 09:44 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

thedefone said:
Maybe California?




Ha!


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9112014 - 10/21/08 09:47 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It would never happen


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9112039 - 10/21/08 09:50 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Really? :mad2:


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9112050 - 10/21/08 09:52 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I think Obama knows he's losing in Pennsylvania.




I'm not entirely sure what logic you're using to determine that the above statement makes sense, but it's definitely unusual.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9112071 - 10/21/08 09:54 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

California is so deep in party lines.  The only real independents actually vote third party here, and I suspect the majority of those are Dems who would retreat back if there were any real threat (or, you know, they would actually vote).


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9112072 - 10/21/08 09:54 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

logic



:ilold:


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9112080 - 10/21/08 09:55 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I was trying as hard as possible to avoid having to point out my sarcasm.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9112117 - 10/21/08 10:01 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

made ya do it :wink:

PS: the hippies had children, and their parents are dying


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9112417 - 10/21/08 10:50 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Noone mentioning 538 dot com?


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Minvaren]
    #9112516 - 10/21/08 11:12 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

And how about the Nickelodeon kids' poll

o/m
51-49

http://www.nick.com/shows/specials/kpp_07/


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: vonhumboldt]
    #9112517 - 10/21/08 11:12 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vonhumboldt said:
The real issue is that McCain is not just behind in polls but has pretty much conceded or heavily reduced campaigning/advertising in the following states: Minnesota, Wisconsin, New Hampshire, Michigan, Colorado, Iowa, and New Mexico. A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

And Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in 20 years, 





"A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

:rolleyes:


Then why are they still spending precious time and money these states?

And do you have a link with that statement?

the "gone" statement?


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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsyvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9112529 - 10/21/08 11:13 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Ferris said:
And how about the Nickelodeon kids' poll

o/m
51-49

http://www.nick.com/shows/specials/kpp_07/




I trust it more than CNN


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9112530 - 10/21/08 11:13 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I can explain Iowa away as a state they want to build momentum in next for next election


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Invisiblethedefone
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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9112565 - 10/21/08 11:20 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

(Link) - Anyone else see a reason to play up a supposed Obama weakness in PA?


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9113578 - 10/22/08 02:36 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I wouldn't play it up; that state is just bitter. :tongue:


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9113962 - 10/22/08 04:17 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

vonhumboldt said:
The real issue is that McCain is not just behind in polls but has pretty much conceded or heavily reduced campaigning/advertising in the following states: Minnesota, Wisconsin, New Hampshire, Michigan, Colorado, Iowa, and New Mexico. A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

And Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in 20 years, 





"A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

:rolleyes:


Then why are they still spending precious time and money these states?

And do you have a link with that statement?

the "gone" statement?




enjoy

The McCain campaign is looking at an Electoral College strategy heading into the final two weeks that has virtually no room for error and depends heavily on a dramatic comeback in Pennsylvania, which hasn't backed a Republican for president in 20 years.

While Iowa, New Mexico and Colorado are still officially listed as McCain target states, two top strategists and advisers tell CNN that the situation in those states looks increasingly bleak. Iowa and New Mexico always have been viewed as difficult races, but the similar assessment of Colorado reflects a dramatic shift for a campaign that had long counted on the state.

"Gone," was the word one top McCain insider used to describe those three states.

This source said while the polls in Colorado remain close, he and most others in the operation were of the opinion that the Obama campaign and its allies have a far superior ground/turnout operation and "most of us have a hard time counting on Colorado."


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: vonhumboldt]
    #9114044 - 10/22/08 05:00 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I live in Colorado. If it goes to McCain, I'll be shocked. I don't know about anything else.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9114533 - 10/22/08 10:41 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

thedefone said:
(Link) - Anyone else see a reason to play up a supposed Obama weakness in PA?





Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

vonhumboldt said:
A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

 





"A McCain advisor described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

do you have a link with that statement?

the "gone" statement?





Thats your fucking link?


"This is what CNN's Chief National Corespondent John King had to say..."

"Most people top in the McCain campaign now believe New Mexico and Iowa are gone, that Barack Obama will win New Mexico and Iowa. They are now off the dream list of the McCain campaign. More interestingly, most top people inside the McCain campaign think Colorado is gone."


:rofl2:


Jesus you guys are a trip.....



fuck CNN's Chief Corespondent John King!


He's not a McCain advisor.....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: vonhumboldt]
    #9114543 - 10/22/08 10:47 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

vonhumboldt said:
Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
Quote:

vonhumboldt said:
A McCain adviser described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

And Pennsylvania has not gone Republican in 20 years, 





"A McCain adviser described Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."

:rolleyes:


Then why are they still spending precious time and money these states?

And do you have a link with that statement?

the "gone" statement?




enjoy

The McCain campaign is looking at an Electoral College strategy heading into the final two weeks that has virtually no room for error and depends heavily on a dramatic comeback in Pennsylvania, which hasn't backed a Republican for president in 20 years.

While Iowa, New Mexico and Colorado are still officially listed as McCain target states, two top strategists and advisers tell CNN that the situation in those states looks increasingly bleak. Iowa and New Mexico always have been viewed as difficult races, but the similar assessment of Colorado reflects a dramatic shift for a campaign that had long counted on the state.

"Gone," was the word one top McCain insider used to describe those three states.

This source said while the polls in Colorado remain close, he and most others in the operation were of the opinion that the Obama campaign and its allies have a far superior ground/turnout operation and "most of us have a hard time counting on Colorado."







Like i told "thedefone" as much as you guys would love for CNN to be McCain political advisor's its not fucking reality!

Again do either of you have a link with A McCain adviser describing Iowa, Colorado, and New Mexico as "gone."


or all your liks just  "CNN sources"


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9114556 - 10/22/08 10:56 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

FYI

"McCain's regional spokesman Tom Kise says the report isn't true and that pulling back in Colorado isn't on the table. He spoke as Sarah Palin wrapped a daylong trip through Colorado and said that McCain would be back campaigning in the state on Friday."


http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=102237&provider=top

They are still campaigning there?


Tom Kise (McCain's regional spokesman)

A name and a title are very different from a " CNN unnamed source"....


Just more lies from the media, you guys are getting so sad...


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114562 - 10/22/08 10:58 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

What's sad is taking an internal survey that still has Obama winning, albeit by a smaller margin, and then somehow understanding that as "Obama knows he's losing in Pennsylvania". It makes no sense.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9114573 - 10/22/08 11:04 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

"I think Obama knows he's losing in Pennsylvania." because he's been giving a lot of attention to a state the Republicans have not won in over 20 years.

thats just my gut feeling, we will know the reality in a few more days.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9114575 - 10/22/08 11:06 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

And i never claimed an Obama adviser said that....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114580 - 10/22/08 11:09 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

So it takes claiming a campaign official said so to make it sad? I see pathetic things everyday that is entirely irrelevant to whether a campaign official said so.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114584 - 10/22/08 11:11 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Man Lonestar, you gotta know that you sound as nutty as I do when I'm trying to convince people that the Cubs could actually win the world series. But I got to thank you, because there'd hardly be any action here without ya.

You know guys, IF McCain wins (he won't) we're gonna hear about it forever :sad:


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9114594 - 10/22/08 11:15 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

you make "no sense"....


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9114654 - 10/22/08 11:36 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Ferris said:
I can explain Iowa away as a state they want to build momentum in next for next election




And McCain telling corn producers he opposes ethanol subsidies does not help him in that state...


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114667 - 10/22/08 11:40 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

:lol:

What are you talking about? Mcbush flip flopped on that.

"I support ethanol and I think it is a vital, a vital alternative energy source not only because of our dependency on foreign oil but its greenhouse gas reduction effects," he said in an August speech in Grinnell, Iowa, as reported by the Associated Press.


http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/11/13/8393132/index.htm


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so yeah:
- 'sex' five times
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- and thrice with actual women(all of which were prostitutes)
Best story ever!

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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: pinkfloydms]
    #9114696 - 10/22/08 11:54 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

pinkfloydms said:
:lol:

What are you talking about? Mcbush flip flopped on that.

"I support ethanol and I think it is a vital, a vital alternative energy source not only because of our dependency on foreign oil but its greenhouse gas reduction effects," he said in an August speech in Grinnell, Iowa, as reported by the Associated Press.


http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/11/13/8393132/index.htm




That link is old (2006) and in 2008 McCain still opposes subsidies for domestic ethanol production.

McCain opposes subsidies for domestic ethanol production.

"I oppose subsidies. Not just ethanol subsidies. Subsidies," McCain told an audience in Ames, Iowa.

While the ethanol subsidies Obama supports play well in the corn-growing states of the Midwest, corn-based biofuels have been criticized for the environmental impacts of growing corn, and the potential to drive up the price of food."

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2008290765_presenviro21m.html


Yesterday McCain said: that unlike Obama, he opposed subsidies for ethanol.


http://www.reuters.com/article/vcCandidateFeed7/idUSN1535588620081021


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114703 - 10/22/08 11:58 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

The only subsidies he wants are the ones involved in purchasing and refinancing home mortgages.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9114740 - 10/22/08 12:14 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

yup, :sad:


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9114757 - 10/22/08 12:22 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

McCain still flipped on his stance, and he did it only to gain votes. IMO he should have kept his first stance. Ethanol is a joke.


--------------------
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so yeah:
- 'sex' five times
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- and thrice with actual women(all of which were prostitutes)
Best story ever!

www.panicstream.com :thumbup:


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: pinkfloydms]
    #9114770 - 10/22/08 12:27 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

How the hell did this turn into a subsidies fight?

Anyway, new poll in PA!

Pennsylvania Morning Call Obama 52, McCain 41 Obama +11

Some fun internals:

Q4.. Sarah Palin

    FAVORABLE........................  40 %
    UNFAVORABLE................... 45%
    NEUTRAL/NOT SURE.........  15%
    HAVEN'T HEARD OF HER... 0%

Q12.  Next I would like to ask some questions about the presidential campaigns. In
general would you say John McCain's presidential campaign has been more positive or
more negative?

MORE POSITIVE..............................................  24%
MORE NEGATIVE............................................  53%
EQUAL NEGATIVE AND POSITIVE (VOL)............  20%
NOT SURE (VOL).............................................  4%

Q13.  In general would you say Barack Obama's presidential campaign has been more
positive or more negative?

MORE POSITIVE..............................................  45%
MORE NEGATIVE............................................  28%
EQUAL NEGATIVE AND POSITIVE (VOL)............  22%
NOT SURE (VOL).............................................    5%

Q14.  Regardless of who you may support, who do you think has a better personality and
temperament to be president, Obama or McCain?

OBAMA............................................................ 52%
McCAIN............................................................ 30%
BOTH EQUAL(VOL)  ............................................13%
NOT SURE (VOL).................................................  5%

Q15. Regardless of who you may support, who do you think would work better with both
Democrats and Republicans in Congress, Obama or McCain?

OBAMA............................................................ 41%
McCAIN............................................................ 38%
BOTH EQUAL(VOL)  ............................................15%
NOT SURE (VOL).................................................  6%


This is the 4th poll in 2 weeks that has Obama at +10 or more. The only one that didn't had Obama at +8. You really want us to believe that McCain truly thinks he has a shot in PA? The ONLY reason he is fighting for PA, is because he has nothing left to fight for. If he loses PA, he loses the election.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9115185 - 10/22/08 01:48 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:
"I oppose subsidies. Not just ethanol subsidies. Subsidies," McCain told an audience in Ames, Iowa.




I have to side with McCain on this one.  I'm not sure though if he means corn-based ethanol subsidies or ALL ethanol subsidies.  Because any sane person would oppose the corn ones with the scientific data we have now, which is where most of that money goes.

Also, something tells me that most of the people in that audience assumed that their other food and farm and federal grazing land subsidies were safe when McCain generalized there.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9116933 - 10/22/08 06:53 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

You people should remember that Obama has constantly polled higher than his actual numbers on election day. This was evident in nearly all of the primaries in which he ran against Hillary Clinton.

I don't think the Obama campaign is feeling their lead is safe for that reason, hence the extra campaigning.


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

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He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #9116971 - 10/22/08 06:58 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think it will hold true inter-party.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9116999 - 10/22/08 07:02 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I think it will likely be more pronounced.

If there were numerous Democrats who stated their intent to vote for him in polls but then couldn't bring themselves to pull the trigger in the booth, I imagine there will be even more people doing so when you include Republicans, since everyone knows they are racists and bigots.


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

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He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #9117055 - 10/22/08 07:12 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

No, the way I see it is they were given two fairly even choices in the primary, and they went for the conservative, known choice of the two.  Inter-party, we're talking wide, wide ideological differences.  They didn't vote against Obama in the primaries, they voted FOR someone in their own party.

I'm not saying that the Heisenberg uncertainty principle doesn't still apply to some extent, but I refuse to believe that it's making more than a couple people cross party lines.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Ferris]
    #9119650 - 10/23/08 04:06 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

You people should remember that Obama has constantly polled higher than his actual numbers on election day. This was evident in nearly all of the primaries in which he ran against Hillary Clinton.




This isn't exactly true, especially in the battleground states:

Michigan:
Final Results -- -- 55.4 39.9 Clinton +15.5
RCP Average 01/06 - 01/14 -- 54.0 30.5 Clinton +23.5

South carolina:
Final Results -- -- 55.4 26.5 17.6 Obama +28.9
RCP Average 01/15 - 01/25 -- 38.4 26.8 19.2 Obama +11.6

Florida:
Poll Date Sample Clinton Obama Edwards Spread
Final Results -- -- 49.7 33.0 14.4 Clinton +16.7
RCP Average 01/22 - 01/28 -- 48.4 28.8 14.2 Clinton +19.6

Georgia:
Final Results -- -- 66.4 31.1 Obama +35.3
RCP Average 02/01 - 02/04 -- 50.3 32.3 Obama +18.0

Missouri:
Final Results -- -- 47.9 49.2 Obama +1.3
RCP Average 01/30 - 02/04 -- 47.5 41.8 Clinton +5.7

Virginia:
Final Results -- -- 63.6 35.4 Obama +28.2
RCP Average 02/06 - 02/10 -- 55.0 37.3 Obama +17.7

Wisconisn:
Final Results -- -- 58.1 40.7 Obama +17.4
RCP Average 02/08 - 02/14 -- 46.3 42.0 Obama +4.3

North Carolina:
Final Results -- -- 56.2 41.5 Obama +14.7
RCP Average 04/28 - 05/05 -- 50.0 42.0 Obama +8.0

Indiana:
Final Results -- -- 50.7 49.3 Clinton +1.4
RCP Average 05/02 - 05/05 -- 49.0 44.0 Clinton +5.0

Oregon:
Final Results -- -- 58.2 40.6 Obama +17.6
RCP Average 05/08 - 05/18 -- 52.2 40.2 Obama +12.0


So yeah... That kind of demolishes that argument.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: supernovasky]
    #9120150 - 10/23/08 10:22 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

You should look at the aggregate polling versus actual aggregate voter proportion to see if you're right.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9120183 - 10/23/08 10:34 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I'm sorry, I might be a bit confused, but anyhow, what I've shown is that the RCP average of all polls actually LAGS Obama's performance in nearly every battleground state.

By the way, let me put this "leaked internals" theory to rest... Tons of new polls today.

Pennsylvania Big10 Battleground Obama 52, McCain 41 Obama +11
Pennsylvania Morning Call Obama 52, McCain 42 Obama +10
Pennsylvania Quinnipiac Obama 53, McCain 40 Obama +13


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: supernovasky]
    #9120232 - 10/23/08 10:50 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I wasn't meaning to give you a hard time. I was just suggesting a way to kill his theory on the spot. If you take the average polled % for Obama for all primary states and then the actual average % for all primary states, if the latter is greater than the former, you've got it.


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: Redstorm]
    #9122483 - 10/23/08 07:28 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Don't wanna sound like a jerk, but maybe we should just wait until the election and see how it really goes?

We can all admit that polling is in inexact science at best. Besides, somebody can even get the most votes and still lose, so what's the point in debating :shrug:


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: lonestar2004]
    #9124240 - 10/24/08 12:45 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

thats just my gut feeling



Your gut feeling is the only measure by which you judge the world around you.  Facts be damned. 

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_10788843

By the way, you should be glad McCain is pulling out of New Mexico. Just look at what Rassmussen is reporting.  Oh.. I'm still waiting to see your electoral projections.. or are you afraid of something?


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Re: Leaked Obama Internals Show Him Within Margin in Pennsylvania? [Re: thedefone]
    #9124517 - 10/24/08 01:44 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

But defone, this has all happened before!!! :rolleyes:

McCain's gonna win in a landslide!!


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