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OfflineIcAnFeeLthErain
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Registered: 05/24/08
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? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings
    #9074981 - 10/14/08 07:36 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I am unclear to the biological reasons for parameters necessary for primordia formation and pinning.

As described in many casing teks I have evenly packed my substrate into 3"x5" gladware tubs (covered on the sides and bottom) and layered 1/4" of 50/50+ casing material.  My inquiry is related to this post-casing stage where mycelium needs incubating temperatures to recuperate and break the casing layer.  I believe some experienced cultivators may even avoid letting mycelium break the casing layer, this is where I am unsure!

I believe I am correct in my knowledge that the new casing requires high levels of humidity to form pins, so I am trial running a tek in which I replace the aluminum foil that would cover the casings for this recuperating stage with the plastic gladware lids.  The fit is much tighter with less room for air to be kept between the lid and the soil surface.  Is this feasible for proper pin formation?  I noticed last time when using foil with holes to cover new casings that it took more than 7 days to see pinning, and carried on IMO slow growth taking 7 more days til the veils broke on most of the fruits.  Even at this point fruit bodies only averaged 3" in height, with caps no bigger than 1.5" in diameter.

What are the proper early pin-formation parameters for fast maturity of casings and the biological reasons behind them?


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"We are here to awaken from the illusion of our separateness" -Thich Nhat Hanh

Take your sweet time, everything is a once in a life time experience.

Cakes?  No Thanks.

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Offlinefr33d0mfry
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Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: IcAnFeeLthErain]
    #9075078 - 10/14/08 08:34 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I can't help you out with biological reasoning, but putting those gladware lids on your shit may hinder pinning.

As far as i know, pinning triggers are as follows;

Light
Fresh Air Exchange
Temperature drop

There might be more, but those are the main 3 i believe.

Gladware lid=No FAE, or even Gas exchange(for colonizing mycelia)


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I am the first person to admit that I'm wrong about something, If I post anything misinforming or misleading, do not hesitate to call me out on it. IF I'm actually wrong, that is. I usually wont post something unless i know it to be 100% true, but mistakes happen.
If you try to tell me i'm wrong about something im positive of, i will argue with you until you stop breathing.

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: fr33d0mfry]
    #9075086 - 10/14/08 08:40 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Temp drop doesn't have much effect on tropical species, and 'incubation' above room temperature can lead to higher incidence of contaminants.

Get the lid off. The number 1 pinning trigger is fresh air.  Other pinning triggers are near 100% humidity and bright high frequency light such as daylight or 'natural daylight' fluorescent lamps.
RR


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Offlinefr33d0mfry
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Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #9075104 - 10/14/08 08:47 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Temp drop doesn't have much effect on tropical species




I learned something new just now, lol

No more cold shocking for me.


Thanks RR.


--------------------
I am the first person to admit that I'm wrong about something, If I post anything misinforming or misleading, do not hesitate to call me out on it. IF I'm actually wrong, that is. I usually wont post something unless i know it to be 100% true, but mistakes happen.
If you try to tell me i'm wrong about something im positive of, i will argue with you until you stop breathing.

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OfflineIcAnFeeLthErain
How ya like your Chang's Sauce?
Male


Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 331
Loc: Bright Side of the Road
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #9075273 - 10/14/08 09:44 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

do you put casings directly in the FC or allow to incubate after crumbling?


--------------------
"We are here to awaken from the illusion of our separateness" -Thich Nhat Hanh

Take your sweet time, everything is a once in a life time experience.

Cakes?  No Thanks.

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OfflineUnknownStrain
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Registered: 10/14/08
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Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: IcAnFeeLthErain]
    #9075551 - 10/14/08 11:15 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

If you are crumbling, I hope you are doing so to spawn to a bulk
substrate.

There is no need to crumble cakes unless you plan on using them
to spawn with.

Rolling wet cakes in dry verm, and then misting.. gives cakes a casing.

With trays, I usually begin the fruiting elements once the casing
starts lightening up in color from the white mycelium beneath;
Although, you may place cased trays inside a fruiting camber
immediately.

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OfflineIcAnFeeLthErain
How ya like your Chang's Sauce?
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Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 331
Loc: Bright Side of the Road
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: UnknownStrain]
    #9076562 - 10/14/08 03:08 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I'm following Magash's rye tek.  A link is featured in the footnote.


--------------------
"We are here to awaken from the illusion of our separateness" -Thich Nhat Hanh

Take your sweet time, everything is a once in a life time experience.

Cakes?  No Thanks.

Edited by IcAnFeeLthErain (10/14/08 03:10 PM)

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Invisibleseven
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Registered: 06/09/08
Posts: 1,478
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Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: IcAnFeeLthErain]
    #9076622 - 10/14/08 03:24 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

check it out man: you can use the glad lids if you put alot of holes in it and cover the holes with micropore tape. this is just during colonization. when you fruit it, take the lids off. you can case after full colonization and fruit right away,or you case and put the lids back on till you see mycelium poking threw: patch those spots then fruit. patching helps induce a more even pin set. somme people even just use a clean spoon and patch with existing uncolonized casing material.casing


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OfflineIcAnFeeLthErain
How ya like your Chang's Sauce?
Male


Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 331
Loc: Bright Side of the Road
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: ? regarding primordia formation and pinning in casings [Re: seven]
    #9079986 - 10/15/08 06:56 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Last time around I covered casings w/ aluminum foil and allowed myc. to pop out in several places before putting patching and putting into the FC.  Then I started reading RR's arguments that if a casing layer becomes colonized then it is no longer functioning as a casing layer.  I attributed this recolonization stage as the reason for having slow pinning and lots of mycelium around the base of the fruits.  So I hypothesized two solutions:

1.) Case my substrate and cover w/o air exchange for one day and store in the incubator.  My hypothesis here was that mycelium would use up all O2 recolonizing in a day (or less) and then I would remove the lids to reintroduce O2 and this would initiate pinning on a fully recovered myc. base.

2.)  Case my substrate and place them directly into the FC, allow to recolonize at room temperatures (70 degrees), and keep humidity in the martha high.

Either sound good?


--------------------
"We are here to awaken from the illusion of our separateness" -Thich Nhat Hanh

Take your sweet time, everything is a once in a life time experience.

Cakes?  No Thanks.

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