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InvisibleinskiM
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Primordia
    #9074801 - 10/14/08 05:45 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

.


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Edited by inski (09/15/11 11:18 PM)

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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074806 - 10/14/08 05:48 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

:ooo:


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074808 - 10/14/08 05:48 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

That is just incredible! Amazing photos inski.:thumbup:

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Offlineapostle11
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074815 - 10/14/08 05:54 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

good stuff, nice pics!


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074824 - 10/14/08 06:05 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Incredible was exactly my thoughts, it seems these primordia only form in the pots that are silver coloured, maybe the blue spectrum that gets through these pots induces primordia formation!
I'm starting to believe that this may be a sclerotia forming species!
inski.


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074862 - 10/14/08 06:23 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

That would be very interesting. Will you be doing any cultivation experiments with it?

How deeply in the soil are those primordia forming?

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074871 - 10/14/08 06:28 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

They seem to be forming anywhere between the inside of the pot and the outside of the root ball, especially close to the drainage holes in the pot!
I will do everything I can to preserve this species:cool:
inski..


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074875 - 10/14/08 06:31 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I love the way they look as they're pushing their way through the soil.

That's excellent to hear that, it is an attitude I respect.:cool:

Edited by wisp (10/14/08 06:46 AM)

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074896 - 10/14/08 06:43 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I particularly like the one that has a spiral stipe, that is the only example of the papillate unidentified species, the rest are of the other unidentified species similar to Psilocybe moravica.
The mycelium of this species is quite cottony and not very robust so my experiments have been going slow, I have been refining my sterile technique and should hopefully have success soon, the warmer fruiting temperature is promising!
inski.


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074904 - 10/14/08 06:49 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, that was my favourite picture too. So how many species do you have pictures there, just two?

The mycelium is those photos looks pretty cottony. How are you starting the experiments out?

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074921 - 10/14/08 07:06 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I suspect there is two different species, the papillate one has a distinct cortinate partial veil that is usually bruised blue, the other seems to lack this feature and the acute papilla but the blueing reaction is just as intense, they could turn out to be distinct variations of the same species!
I will be using many different methods of propagation, clones, isolation of  strains from multispore germinations on agar, I may try to extract some of these primordia and see if they take to soaked corrugated cardboard also, any suggestions/techniques would be appreciated!
inski...


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Invisibleeatyualive
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074927 - 10/14/08 07:10 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

nice shots thanks!


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9074937 - 10/14/08 07:15 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Have you tried you different agar recipes to see how it effects the speed and vigour of growth of the mycelium?

You could make up a liquid culture. Then make up the final fruiting substrate, but mix in grains and/or a small amount of flower such as rice or buckwheat throughtout it. Bring it to the light water level, then sterilise it and inject the LC into it. By doing it that way you have skip the spawning step, but the added nutrients from the grains/flour will encourage mycelial growth.

There are many others ways of course and it might turn out that these species need microorganisms to fruit, so a sterilised substrate may not be suitable.

Keep us posted on how the experiments turn out.

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9074980 - 10/14/08 07:36 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

No I haven't tried different agar recipes, only PDA but I will be experimenting with MEA soon!
Liquid cultures may be the way to go and I will be trying different fruiting substrates including different mixes of horse manure, grain and saw dust!
As you say this species may need certain beneficial microorganisms in order to form primordia and a pasteurized substrate may be better than a completely sterile one, I may also try activated charcoal in my casing layer as I have heard that it mimics the beneficial actions of the bacteria Pseudomonas putida.
inski...


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Edited by inski (10/14/08 08:07 AM)

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Offlinecoolboarderguy
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9075497 - 10/14/08 11:01 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Wow that is just amazing Love your photography too! Do you think this indicates that these and maybe other psilocybin mushrooms might do more than just decompose plant matter, and that the mycillium might actually attatch itself to the roots of the plants in some sort of equally benifitial arrangement?

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Offlineholeclams
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Re: Primordia [Re: coolboarderguy]
    #9075934 - 10/14/08 12:47 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Great shots, i like how it weaves through everything looks amazing


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Invisiblekoraks
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9075947 - 10/14/08 12:51 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Looks like mycorrhiza in action, I'd never actually seen this up close before :shocked: :thumbup:

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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: koraks]
    #9076817 - 10/14/08 04:07 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

If these do turn out to be mycorrhizal, that will be a very significant find. No psilocybin-bearing mushrooms to date have been known to form mycorrhizal relationships with trees.

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9076906 - 10/14/08 04:28 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

No psilocybin-bearing mushrooms to date have been known to form mycorrhizal relationships with trees.





Except the active Inocybes.

It is difficult to see what is really going on just by looking, but true mycorrhizal relationships can be detected by cutting the root tips open and looking at it under a microscope.

Or maybe you can just look at it to tell.

Here is a mycorrhizal root tip:



And another one, this is with Amanita

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a5/Mycorrhizal_root_tips_(amanita).jpg

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Offlinecoolboarderguy
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Re: Primordia [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #9078068 - 10/14/08 07:58 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Damn thats what Im saying this could be a first, Really looks like it is. Be very interested to know.

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OfflineBeege
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Re: Primordia [Re: coolboarderguy]
    #9078453 - 10/14/08 09:02 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I am assuming workman has obtained a specimen?


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #9079577 - 10/15/08 01:06 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:

No psilocybin-bearing mushrooms to date have been known to form mycorrhizal relationships with trees.





Except the active Inocybes.




Really? Can you tell me which species of active Inocybe are mycorrhizal? I had no idea.

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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9079626 - 10/15/08 01:28 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I'm pretty sure most if not all Inocybes are mycorrhizal.  In my opinion, a pretty interesting genus.


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OfflineJuke Adro
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Re: Primordia [Re: landsnorkler]
    #9079650 - 10/15/08 01:39 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Shit I'm always late to the best threads :wink: AMAZING stuff


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: landsnorkler]
    #9079654 - 10/15/08 01:40 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

That's really interesting. Which trees are the active species mycorrhizal to?

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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Primordia [Re: Juke Adro]
    #9079663 - 10/15/08 01:45 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

That's what happens when you hang out in the pr0n forum too much. :wink:

:lol:

Real Shroomerites hang in the Hunting forum.  Everyone knows that.  :rolleyes:

:grin:


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OfflineJuke Adro
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Re: Primordia [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #9079666 - 10/15/08 01:49 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

:lol: I got addicted bad ha ha, back now :wink:


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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9080954 - 10/15/08 11:25 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Really? Can you tell me which species of active Inocybe are mycorrhizal? I had no idea.




All Inocybes are mycorrhizal. 

Quote:

Really? Can you tell me which species of active Inocybe are mycorrhizal? I had no idea.




The only active Inocybe that has been found around here is Inocybe corydalina, it grows with hardwood and conifer.  Like most active Inocybes, it is rare and widely distributed. 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c5/Inocybe.corydalina.nathan.wilson.jpg

Other psychoactive Inocybes are listed here.

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #9088969 - 10/16/08 09:43 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

.


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Edited by inski (09/15/11 11:19 PM)

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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9088985 - 10/16/08 09:45 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Neat.  Any idea what it is?


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #9089049 - 10/16/08 09:54 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Well, using Guzman's key to the sections you come to a question mark which I'm guessing means he knows there are species that fit into his key but they have not been described!
inski..


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9089081 - 10/16/08 09:58 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Very nice.  I reread the thread again.  Great job, inski.  Pushing the mycology envelope.  :thumbup:


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9089529 - 10/16/08 11:40 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Great work inski.:cool:

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Re: Primordia [Re: coolboarderguy]
    #9102438 - 10/19/08 11:37 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

excellent , i been  wondering  about the micorrizal action of some saprobios mushrooms , and how the plant and the mushrooms benefit form thew other , for example agaricus are not supost to be micorrizal but behabe like so  in casuarina tree here,and in pine some sylvaticus, they depend on the litter of the tree but maybe some micorrizal action take place,

excellent inski if this turn to be a sclerotia former.
this specimen are in the section stunsii my friend if i dont bad remenber , that will be the first record of it in the section .

kepp it up look like it takes years to understand a single mushroom or even a life time is not enouf.

friend ships is the solution..


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Primordia [Re: cactu]
    #9102679 - 10/20/08 01:20 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

:wink:


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InvisibleBlimeyGrimey
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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9102725 - 10/20/08 01:44 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

inski said:
Well, using Guzman's key to the sections you come to a question mark which I'm guessing means he knows there are species that fit into his key but they have not been described!
inski..





If yours doesn't fit into any of the sections and is in fact a new species then the new section will take on the name of your species.

You wouldn't just be naming a new species if you published the taxonomy paperwork but you'd also be naming a new section of active Psilocybes.

Congrats!!


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: BlimeyGrimey]
    #9114233 - 10/22/08 05:49 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

.


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Edited by inski (09/15/11 11:20 PM)

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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9114236 - 10/22/08 05:51 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I love your photos inski. Are they sterile once again?

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia [Re: wisp]
    #9114241 - 10/22/08 05:57 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks tripsis:cool:
They do seem to be sterile but I will attempt to print these anyway, I have actually recently been successful at germinating spores collected from a dried specimen so they aren't all completely sporeless, fingers crossed!
inski..


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Invisiblewisp

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Re: Primordia [Re: inski]
    #9114272 - 10/22/08 06:11 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

You should clone the spore producing specimens! I wonder if fruits produced from the spores will have a higher rate of fertility? I'm beginning to think that your hypothesis that all these mushrooms are just clones of one another, through the distribution of their substrate by humans, may very well be correct. If it is, then it would make sense that fresh genetics should be able to yield spores more easily.

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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Primordia UPDATE! [Re: wisp]
    #9135160 - 10/26/08 12:47 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

.


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Edited by inski (09/15/11 11:20 PM)

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Offlinemushroomhunter10
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Re: Primordia UPDATE! [Re: inski]
    #9135198 - 10/26/08 12:58 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Those look like Psilocybe bohemica and azurescens combined lol

Am I missing something here??


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Re: Primordia UPDATE! [Re: inski]
    #9137385 - 10/26/08 04:03 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

so are you going to give them a species name?


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OfflineChaos_ultt
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Re: Primordia UPDATE! [Re: Beege]
    #9137529 - 10/26/08 04:26 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Very very interesting


Keep us updated!

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