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Invisibleshroomzey
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: P.Menace]
    #9135244 - 10/26/08 01:31 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

P.Menace said:
Quote:

Mushr00m_Man said:
damnit


:imwithstupid:




:imwithstupid:

=( 

Well, Kudos to your 5g tea trip!  Thanks for the effort NB.


--------------------

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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: shroomzey]
    #9135866 - 10/26/08 08:18 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

shroomzey said:

Well, Kudos to your 5g tea trip!  Thanks for the effort NB.




Thanks.  See my trip report.  "Chrome-crystal entities and time travel."  I lost an entire night's sleep trying to come to terms with this one...

N.B.


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OfflineNoteworthy
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Nature Boy]
    #9135886 - 10/26/08 08:33 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I read on hipforums, one member found positive results from vapourising psilocybin/psylocin even if it wasnt active at the same dosage as orally..


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OfflineNature Boy
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Noteworthy]
    #9135948 - 10/26/08 09:08 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I don't doubt it.  All I can say is that my quick and dirty extraction was insufficiently pure to be pleasant enough to smoke with good effect.  In fact, it was nasty.

Vaporized pure psilocybin crystals, DMT-like, would probably work VERY well.  Unfortunately, that's not the product I ended up working with, so I can't say one way or another from first-hand experience - and that was the point - to get some trustworthy first-hand experience.

Now...if someone wants to donate some psilocybin crystals...  :crazy2:

N.B.


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OfflineNoteworthy
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Nature Boy]
    #9135957 - 10/26/08 09:14 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

dude if there is psylocibin in that gunk then it should still work after 9 hits...
there are a lot of factors at play here


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Offlinepiracetam
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Noteworthy]
    #9135965 - 10/26/08 09:22 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

<< polymer

aha.. what's up, dr. billstoner :toast:


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OfflineZinglons Acolyte
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: piracetam]
    #9136182 - 10/26/08 10:47 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

the best way to go about getting the crystals would seem to be an a/b extraction, that woul remove the fats, and it would also convert the psilocybin into the active psilocin

polar/nonpolar seems harder to get a pure product


--------------------
And they wandered off.. nine ways till bedfast.
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Offlinehaymaker
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Zinglons Acolyte]
    #9136240 - 10/26/08 11:03 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

maybe it isn't active when vapourised is due to the psilocybin not being converted to psilocin for some reason?? just my 2 cents... i'm not scientist.

nice write up, i look forward to reading more

:peace:


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Invisibleshroomzey
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: haymaker]
    #9137023 - 10/26/08 02:46 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Well, regardless of the results of this experiment.  I still believe in the future I'll have to do the research it takes to design a good pure extraction.  This may not be anytime soon, but I'm determined to see a well documented/pictorial of a psilocin/psilocybin crystal vaporization, and I imagine I would probably end up making one.  I'm tired of still seeing speculation regarding this with no concrete proof in either conclusion, saying it for sure works, or for sure doesn't.

I have a feeling though that the biggest lesson learned here is regarding purity.  I imagine the psilo-goop had a lot of nasties in it that made the smoke so horrible that obviously wouldn't bother you taken orally.  I think more effort will need to be put into a better extraction method.

*edit* What haymaker mentioned does bring up a question...

Do the contents of the psilo goop just contain p-cybin?  As the p-cin is unstable and degrades quickly with any exposure?  And if the vaporization of pure p-cybin would have the same effect as vaporized pure p-cin?  Obviously these question are hard to answer, but they are really interesting none the less...


--------------------

200 years from now, we will look back and laugh at ourselves for how stupid we were.
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Find a respected member of the community and study them.  I give thanks to: RogerRabbit, agar, hyphae, Nibin, fahtster, The shroomy 1, monstermitch, FooMan, HippieChick, Blue Helix, eatyualive, mycofile, and many, many more.
Never accept mediocrity, always return the love that is given to you.

Edited by shroomzey (10/26/08 02:50 PM)

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OfflineNature Boy
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: shroomzey]
    #9137960 - 10/26/08 05:43 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

shroomzey said:
Well, regardless of the results of this experiment.  I still believe in the future I'll have to do the research it takes to design a good pure extraction.




I wholeheartedly agree.  I think that would make all the difference.  But the fact that psilocibin is a zwitterion actually makes it more challenging than, lets say, DMT, which can be done in a one-step straight-to-base.

Extracting psilocibin from mushrooms is easy.  It will come out with water, and most alcohols.  Separating away the nasties is the whole trick.  My method did not work, and the result was too vile to smoke, but just fine to take orally.  That was the (only?) lesson.

When you make your attempt, please make sure I know about it so I can follow along!  :thumbup:

Best,

N.B.


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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Nature Boy]
    #9138124 - 10/26/08 06:13 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

from what i have read, psilocybin shed its phosphoryloxy group under acidic aquacious conditions


--------------------
And they wandered off.. nine ways till bedfast.
-----
"And lets pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space 'cause theres bugger-all down here on earth!"  -Monty Python's "The Universe Song" from The Meaning of Life
"In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely considered as a bad move."  -Douglas Adams "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"
"If the words 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence McKenna

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OfflineEndlessness
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Zinglons Acolyte]
    #9138413 - 10/26/08 07:07 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I guess before extracting with the alcohols, one way to prevent the impurities in the final product is to wash the dry shroom powder with a non-polar solvent such as naphtha or similar. The psilocybin/cin would not be soluble in it, so it would only take inactives away, resulting in a cleaner end product

the only trick would be to perfectly dry the powder after this wash because nobody would want a bit of naphtha being swallowed in the end

its not too hard though, one just needs to build an improvised vacuum filter and dry it well..  Ill post a pic of the very easy build vacuum filter here tomorrow or smt

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OfflineP.Menace
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Endlessness]
    #9138476 - 10/26/08 07:15 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Naphtha is used all the time in extracting DMT from mimosa hostilis root bark, and I am here to tell you that the evaporation process would be about the least of your worries there...
VM&P Naphtha evaporates cleanly in only a few short hours...

Trust me, I know... I have been doing it all week.

After the suggestion of that tho, one could use a method of what you suggested, defatting, and perhaps washing the resulting goop with an acidic aqueous solution to aid in the attempt of converting the psilocybin into psilocin, and extract using methanol, and freeze precip...

Does that sound feasible?


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roby000 said: thats true a shotgun is almost like a college degree in a sense that if you show it to the right person at the right time you could make a lot of money.

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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: P.Menace]
    #9138592 - 10/26/08 07:32 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

you could just do a simple a/b on the goop :shrug:


--------------------
And they wandered off.. nine ways till bedfast.
-----
"And lets pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space 'cause theres bugger-all down here on earth!"  -Monty Python's "The Universe Song" from The Meaning of Life
"In the beginning, the universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely considered as a bad move."  -Douglas Adams "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"
"If the words 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on." -Terence McKenna

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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: Zinglons Acolyte]
    #9138690 - 10/26/08 07:47 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

retread said:
Extraction of psilocybin and psilocin from psychoactive mushrooms

This is a revised copy of a previous write-up about an extraction of the psychedelic alkaloids from psychoactive mushrooms, mainly p. cubensis.  The extraction will work for all of the psychedelic mushrooms that contain psilocybin/psilocin.  It is an acid/base extraction derived from the DMT extractions that I have read about and performed.  The method that I am listing below still has not been attempted by me, so I?d like to note that it is more of a theoretical process waiting on revision until it is finally attempted. The more input I can receive the better the final process and instructions will be. Please feel free to comment.

Overview: The psilocybin is to be extracted from pulverized mushrooms.  As the dosages for psilocybin is beyond measuring with my digital scales, I will use 5 grams of dried p cubensis mushrooms.  As I know the effect of this amount of mushrooms, I can compare the final extract with the trip from the 5 grams.  The alkaloids will be removed from the mushrooms with an acidic solution and defatted with naphtha.  After this the solution will be basified and the alkaloids removed with naphtha. The naphtha will be washed with  two distilled water washes.  The naphtha will be evaporated and the crystals washed one more time with cold distilled water to remove any traces of any basic solutions used in the extraction.  The crystals that are left will be consumed and the effects judged to determine the performance of the extraction.

Materials:
Digital pH meter 1000mL Separatory Funnel
Acid (vinegar, muriatic, hydrochloric, sulfuric)  Base (baking powder)
Distilled water Three quart Mason jars
Coffee Filters Glass stirring rod
Dried p. cubensis mushrooms VM&P Naptha

Procedure:
1) Prepare the mushrooms for extraction. They should be dried completely.  All remnants of the casing layer should be scraped away.  Grind the mushrooms in a coffee grinder to a fine powder.
2) Using the digital pH meter prepare 200mL of distilled water and acid to a pH of 2 in a quart Mason jar.  You want to stir well when doing this.  After you mix this, put it in a hot water bath on the oven until it gets to about 90?F. You?ll want all solvents and naphtha, unless otherwise specified in the instructions, to be at this temperature. Don?t get it higher or you?ll risk destroying precious alkaloids. 
3) Pour the mushroom powder into the acidic solution.  If you want to mix up 25-50mL more of the acidic solution to rinse out the coffee grinder, that?s fine. Just add it back to the Mason jar with the rest of the stuff. Stir well for 5 minutes, and then stir at 10 minute intervals.
4) After allowing the powder to sit in the warm acidic solution for 45 minutes it?s time to filter it and do another wash. The liquid contains a great percentage of the initial alkaloids found in the mushrooms and it is to be kept.  Pour the mixture through a coffee filter into a second Mason jar.  Put the powder back in the first Mason jar.
5) Mix up another 200mL of distilled water and acid to a pH of 2.  Add this to the Mason jar that contains the mushroom powder.  Place that Mason jar back into the warm-water bath on the stovetop.
6) Repeat step 4-5 one more time for a total of three washes. The first one should be 45 minutes while the second and third can be for only 15 minutes each.  All of the liquid should be poured into the second Mason jar and saved.  All of the alkaloids have now been extracted and the mushroom powder may be discarded.
7) We will now de-fat the acidic solution to ensure a purer finished product.  Naphtha is what I will be recommending and using in this procedure.  Pour the acidic liquid into a separatory funnel.  Add 50mL of warm naphtha to the funnel.  Turn the funnel upside down and right side up 10-20 times.  Do this gently enough that great deals of bubbles don?t form.  You?ll need to release the pressure in the funnel.  Do this by turning the funnel so that the stopcock is aimed up and open it.  I recommend doing this every 2-3 turns.
8) Allow the layers to settle out now.  The bottom layer will be the acidic water solution containing the alkaloids and the top layer will be the naphtha containing the extracted fats.
9) Open the stopcock and save the water layer. The naphtha layer is to be discarded.  Repeat the naphtha defatting once more to ensure complete defatting.
10) Now it?s time to basify the solution and get our crystals!  The DEA site that I gleaned some of this information from states that too high of a pH can damage the alkaloids that we want to extract. They recommend 8.0-8.5pH be used.  Since we want this to be as ?gentle? as possible, we will use baking powder as our base.  Prepare 200mL of distilled water and baking soda until the pH is about 8.0.  Add to the acidic solution, stirring regularly, until the pH reaches 8.0.  The crystals are now ?loose? in the solution and ripe for the plucking!
11) Again we will be using naphtha as our solvent but this time, since the crystals are not dissolved in the liquid, they will migrate to the naphtha layer.  Put the basified liquid into the separatory funnel and add 75mL of naphtha.  It?s pretty much the same as the defatting, except we want to keep BOTH layers, but keep them separate.  Repeat this step 2-3 times saving the naphtha each time and re-extracting with fresh naphtha from the basified solution.
12) Now we have naphtha that has all of the alkaloids in it. The basified solution can be tossed.  Just to make sure that we got all of the baking soda out we?ll add some water to the naphtha in the separatory funnel and wash it out again. You can shake the separatory funnel now as hard as you want to, as the layers will separate quite rapidly.  Do this twice, tossing the water and keeping the naphtha.
13) Time to evaporate that naphtha and watch our crystals form!  Put a fan blowing on the naphtha and some heat underneath if you can. Pyrex dishes are great for extractions because you can scrape the crystals off so easy.  Don?t get it hotter than 90?F.  Naphtha takes a while to evaporate but I guarantee you that it will do just that.
14) After you evaporate the naphtha you?ll be left with some crystals.  Put them in a coffee filter and pour extremely cold water over them.  Just 100mL or so will be enough to wash away any parts still there that aren?t desired in the finished product.  Scrape the crystals off of the filter and allow them to dry in a dark place.


That should do it! Psilocybin/psilocin crystals. Feedback welcome!




I think I had this in mind when I was thinking... This sounds like what I was thinking of trying, I guess just without methanol.
Naphtha will defat the solution.
and apparently simply basifying the solution will result in crystals. again washing with naphtha, and evaporating.

I am going to look into a few other methods to this and see what I come up with


--------------------

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roby000 said: thats true a shotgun is almost like a college degree in a sense that if you show it to the right person at the right time you could make a lot of money.

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Offlinepiracetam
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: P.Menace]
    #9138962 - 10/26/08 08:33 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

use baking soda, not baking powder (which is tartaric acid, baking soda, and cornstarch).
the point is to extract psilocin, not bake muffins :tongue:

5% sol'ns are sufficient: 5% acetic sol'n, 5% sodium bicarb sol'n

Edited by piracetam (10/26/08 08:42 PM)

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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: piracetam]
    #9138989 - 10/26/08 08:39 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I didnt say baking powder, but i did read where the guy mixed them up in the tek

Quote:

Since we want this to be as ?gentle? as possible, we will use baking powder as our base.  Prepare 200mL of distilled water and baking soda until the pH is about 8.0.  Add to the acidic solution, stirring regularly, until the pH reaches 8.0.  The crystals are now ?loose? in the solution and ripe for the plucking!



right here


--------------------

http://www.sporeworksgallery.com/Cubensae/Psilocybe_cubensis_Menace


roby000 said: thats true a shotgun is almost like a college degree in a sense that if you show it to the right person at the right time you could make a lot of money.

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Offlinepiracetam
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: P.Menace]
    #9139016 - 10/26/08 08:44 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

yep, that's what I was responding to; I knew you didn't say it


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Offlineretrospect
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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: piracetam]
    #9144046 - 10/27/08 07:23 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

hey have a look at this im not sure if it would work with psilocybin. its an easy way to get pure crystals

http://www.dmt-nexus.com/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=449&p=2

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Re: Psilocybin and psilocin crystals (pix) [Re: retrospect]
    #9144218 - 10/27/08 07:59 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

NO!  That won't work.  Fine for DMT, but not for psilocibin.

N.B.


--------------------
All submitted posts under this user name are works of pure fiction or outright lies.  Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit.  Note well:  Sorry, but I do not answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend.  If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread.

                                                                               

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