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Do you answer questions, or question answers?

There is a NMDA-blocker found in Amanita Muscaria - ibotenic acid.

Laters, Youjutsu

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Maverick shroomed@rediffmail.com
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Psychedelia in India....
We arent there yet but ,
We are getting there !!!

Laters, Youjutsu

ibotenic acid

Which I have not confirmed, yet. So, please add anything that you can.

-Youjutsu

Okay, this has been updated because I thought I should provide some sources and a little more info. The information above was obtained from: http://www.uq.edu.au/~ddbfry/venomtypes.html

Also, I have another cool cone snail fact:

"Venom from the magician cone snail, Conus magus, shows promise as a non-addictive pain control 1000 times as powerful as morphine."

From: http://www.aqua.org/animals/species/venom/conesnail.html

Here are some other good cone snail links:
http://encarta.msn.com/find/Concise.asp?ti=005AD000

http://chemindy.sci.fau.edu/~mari/usscono.html

-PsiliPharm

[This message has been edited by PsiliPharm (edited November 07, 1999).]

Ibogaine is a NMDA-blocker/antagonist!

Source: http://www.ibogaine.org/lit-nmda.html

This is strange to me since most indoles are 5HT-agonists. Well this brings up an important question, is it both a NMDA-antagonist and a 5HT-agonist or just a NMDA-antagonist? If both, then this would be the IDEAL hallucinogenic drug or close to it. Though, it's effects doesn't show to be very ideal. Well, even if it's not a 5HT-agonist, it would be on the other side of the combination and be combined with the tryptamines which it's MAOI properties make it interesting for this purpose. Taking Ibogaine at hallucinogenic doses is said to be less than pleasant due to it's body load, maybe taking a lower dose of Ibogaine with an 5HT-agonist such as shrooms or DMT will fix that, who knows?

Some Ibogaine-containing plants along with several other Hallucinogenic materials can be obtained from:
http://www.jlfcatalog.com

This message was brought to you from the outer limits of the hyperspatial consciousness of PsiliPharm, where all things hallucinogenic grow wild.

I'm still looking but it shows to be a GABA-agonist, well, Muscimol is. Muscimol is Ibotenic acid's metabolite and they are structurally similar to GABA.

My Source: http://www.erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_writings4.shtml

I have also seen references to it's actions being much like that of atropine, which has anticholinergic effects. Which it was even called mycoatropine. A little bit of this information can be obtained from:
http://www.erowid.org/plants/amanitas/amanitas_info_ott.shtml

I still haven't seen a single reference to it being a NMDA-blocker, but I'll keep looking. While looking for this information, I came across some references that brought up some other questions. In the previous link there is a reference to a substance called premnazole which is another isoxazole compound like ibotenic acid that is found in two species of Verbenaceae family of plants. Okay, the question is, what two species? It also speaks of a European variety of A. muscaria contained a potentially psychoactive beta-carboline, methyltetrahydrocarboline carboxylic acid (MCTHC; I-methyl-3-carboxyl-tetrahydro-B-carboline) and two other compounds of obscure pharmacology, stizolobic acid and stizolobinic acid (also found in edible seeds of Stizolobium [Mucuna] species), have been isolated in good yield from Amanita pantherina. This to me, brings Isoxazole and Tryptamines closer where before they seemed completely different. It also makes the appearance of DMT and 5-MeO-DMT in Amanita citrina and Amanita poryphyria more believable. This reference was found at: http://www.cia.com.au/serendipity/dmt/hoasca.html#tbl4b

Quack, Quack, Quack...

Quackers, PsiliPharm

[This message has been edited by PsiliPharm (edited November 08, 1999).]

In a previous post, maverick mentions that Nitrazepam was used along with LSD which only removed some of the mental jitters but didn't have any kind of synergistic effect. This is because Nitrazepam is a benzodiazepine and not a NMDA-blocker. Benzodiazepines act on the GABA (gamma aminobutyric acid) like GHB and Ibotenic acid.

"In the meantime, benzodiazepines in current use tend to induce dependence, dull consciousness and impair the intellect. So there's not much chance of radical life-enrichment here."

Source of Information: http://www.biopsychiatry.com/

This site is probably one of my favorite sites because of it has alot of interesting information and links to more information with links to more information and so on.

Well defined is the best way to put it. Check it out!

Laters, PsiliPharm

This first one with DXM and AMT gives a pretty good explaination of the combination:
http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=53

This second one with DXM and Salvia which I don't know how it acts on the brain's receptors but it provides a good metaphor for how the combination works:

"Salvia by itself is like a guitar that goes skittering off on flights of its own that can be hard to follow. DXM is a long, slow, loping bass groove. Putting them together is like anchoring the guitar with the bass, and somehow a whole new sound emerges, almost as if they had created a third instrument."
http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=644

Here are some more trip reports.

Ketamine and DMT: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=104

Ketamine and LSD: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=538

Ketamine, DPT, Peganum harmala, and GHB: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=667

Ketamine and DPT: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=696

Ketamine, LSD, and Marijuana: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=712

Ketamine and MDMA: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=182

Ketamine, DPT, LSD, and GHB: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=690

Ketamine, 5-MeO-DMT, LSD, and GHB: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=647

Ketamine, DMT, LSD, and N2O: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=175

Ketamine, MDMA, and Marijuana: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=574

DXM and LSD: http://www.lycaeum.org/drugs/trip.report/view_report.cgi?RowID=132

Well, that's about all...there are some other combinations of Ketamine with 2C-B and some with DOB, but since I don't know whether or not they are 5HT-agonists. I figured you could find them yourselves, if your interested. This turned out to be more than a few trip reports, oh well.

Laters, PsiliPharm

"It makes perfect sense that any drug with activity akin to these, when combined with a stimulant activity, when injected in a rat, is gonna result in one freaked-out little rodent, who's going to display some rather barroque reactions to this invasion of his receptors. Its the equivalent to turning his picture of the world on its side while letting the v-hold slip, as someone pushes the fast-forward button."

In another reply, this reference was used:

Mol Pharmacol 1994, v. 45 p. 312-6:
"Dopamine uptake inhibitors had one of three effects on transporter-mediated efflux. Some drugs, in addition to inhibiting uptake, inhibited spontaneous release of dopamine. Drugs in this class included mazindol, GBR-12935, bupropion, nomifensine, and benztropine. All of the drugs with the potential for abuse by humans either enhanced release (methamphetamine, amphetamine, and ethanol) or had no effect on release (phencyclidine, cocaine, and WIN 35,428). The ability to define classes of uptake blockers based on their effects on human transporter-mediated dopamine efflux may lead to the identification of structural features of the transporter that differentiate abused from nonabused drugs."

This is a very interesting quote because it confuses the hell out of me, which means, it's late and I need to go to bed. I'll finish this later when I can think better.

But, before I leave, I want to put out this question: Does anticholinergic and antimuscarinic mean the same thing? If so, would atropine and other anticholinergic drugs decrease the effectiveness of ibotenic acid? Or, does ibotenic acid and atropine have the same basic action on these receptors? That's all, for now.

Link to The Hive: http://lycaeum.org/~strike/cgi-bin/ubb_cgi/Ultimate.cgi

Laters, PsiliPharm

[This message has been edited by PsiliPharm (edited November 08, 1999).]

They make a scopolamine patch for sea sickness(Transderm-Scop) I wonder what it would be like to strap one and eat some shrooms? It would be a sustained slow release.

Ibotinic acid wasn't listed in my textbook-so sad.

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The caterpillar said, "One side will make you grow bigger, and the other side will make you grow smaller."

"One side of what? The other side of what?" thought Alice to herself.

"Of the mushroom," said the caterpillar.

Alice looked at the caterpillar, trying to make out which were the two sides, as it was perfectly round.

I would also add something of another topic. If anyone knows of any other animals/insects who's venom, body parts, etc has any psychoactive properties besides Bufo sp., please post it.

Laters, PsiliPharm

[This message has been edited by PsiliPharm (edited November 08, 1999).]

-PsiliPharm

I have tried this once, and it was probably my biggest experience ever.

I ate 2 hits of a very clean LSD, which wasn't very strong on the other hand. Both probably equalled something like 180-200 ug. Waited for the pick, at +3h, then i snorted 100 mg of powdered Ketamine.

In a couple of minutes I had no recollection of having a body, a history, a life, or that there was a planet called Earth. I was just a floating consciousness, without form or identify, expanding to the size of the universes.

The whole experienced was done in a controlled set, i had a playlist ready (with Future Sound of London's Lifeform, highly reccomendable to this combo), and music and I became the same thing. Music was not sound anymore, it was physical and ambient.

I have a few recollections which include being in a digital forest, and later creating fully immersible realities, through some sort of pannel interface, that i created too. The realities were much like VR.

in 50 mins - 1 hour, i started to slowly reconnect to my body. for the next 2 hours to walk, move, pick things, talk, etc, i had to send orders to my body, for i wasnt entirely inside it. It was like commanding a robot through remote control, except there was no remote control, it was a thought based control.

Very interesting combination.

I wonder if anyone ever tried Ketamine and Salvia divinorum.

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o0o neuroglider o0o

Once while on 1000mg dxm I took 2 hits of cannibis/salvia mix. Everything turned into a cartoon. Also, I find that low doses of dxm greatly facilitate "breaking through" with salvia. While on 300mg, I wasn't feeling much but I had my first salvia breakthrough after smoking half a bowl. It was amazing.

In an earlier post you stated that benzodiazapines, (Gaba receptor agonists)were highly addictive. This is simply not true. The Drug enforcement powers that be have given benzo's a schedule 4(meaning low probablity of dependance). Morphine and Fentanyl are schedule 2 (high probability of dependance). An example of a schedule 1 drug is heroin (extremely high probabilty of dependance).

Anyway, as far a synergy of two drugs, I would warn against it. A close friend of mine passed away when he OD'd on ketamine and who knows what else. He too was into the "synergy" thing.

Later, Tor

In an earlier post you stated that benzodiazapines, (Gaba receptor agonists)were highly addictive. This is simply not true. The Drug enforcement powers that be have given benzo's a schedule 4(meaning low probablity of dependance). Morphine and Fentanyl are schedule 2 (high probability of dependance). An example of a schedule 1 drug is heroin (extremely high probabilty of dependance).

Anyway, as far a synergy of two drugs, I would warn against it. A close friend of mine passed away when he OD'd on ketamine and who knows what else. He too was into the "synergy" thing.

Just take a higher dose of shrooms!

Later, Tor