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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9007499 - 09/30/08 10:43 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #9007569 - 09/30/08 10:59 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:

This is not a partison issue to me.




it's not one for me either, it's a 'lets clean house' issue to
me vote incumbents out, replace them with people that will work
for us, the US population is to blame for listening to these
officials and taking the bullshit at face value

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9007584 - 09/30/08 11:02 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

supernovasky said:
I don't like the final years of the Clinton presidency.




like it or not, they happened


Quote:

And I FULLY agree: We NEED to bring back the Glass-Steagal act. But I'm afraid that would be too litte, too late.




so lets work towards a common goal, remove the power hungry
from power, bringing back a bit of legislation does no good
when the people that voted for it are still in office

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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9007736 - 09/30/08 11:31 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9007743 - 09/30/08 11:33 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

> McCain was one of the people who voted for it.

And Obama was one of the people that abused it.

Quote:

so lets work towards a common goal, remove the power hungry
from power, bringing back a bit of legislation does no good
when the people that voted for it are still in office




Hence my preaching about voting third party.  *sigh*


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Just another spore in the wind.

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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: Seuss]
    #9007761 - 09/30/08 11:36 AM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9007998 - 09/30/08 12:27 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

> Obama abused it? How-so?

Remember how proud he is of his time as a community organizer?  He worked for Miner Barnhill & Galland, from 1993 until 2002, helping prepare lawsuits against financial institutions to force CRA compliance.  He was made partner in 1996, about the same time that the housing bubble started to form.  (I doubt that the two are related, but interesting none-the-less.)  The work he did helped to directly feed the housing bubble.  Clinton pushed the changes through, and Obama (along with many others, left and right) helped take advantage of them.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008016 - 09/30/08 12:31 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

supernovasky said:
Prisone: Remember this, McCain was one of the people who voted for it.




that is correct...and guess which two presidential candidates I'll not vote for

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: Seuss]
    #9008038 - 09/30/08 12:35 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
> Obama abused it? How-so?

Remember how proud he is of his time as a community organizer?  He worked for Miner Barnhill & Galland, from 1993 until 2002




http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=ZTcxMDhjOTc2MGI0OTE1Y2QyMDYwYWE5MGY3OWJmY2I=

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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #9008126 - 09/30/08 12:54 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflinePhred
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008180 - 09/30/08 01:04 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

And - as always - Supernovasky sees some commentary by some Bush-hating chucklehead somewhere on the vast IntraWeb and without doing any followup investigation on matters outside his specialty, uncritically assumes it is gospel truth.

Problem is, the current crisis is not the result of deregulation, regardless of what Obama claims. And it certainly has nothing to do with the 1999 repeal of the Glass-Steagall act.

I could expend some time typing this up in my own words, but I looked around a bit and found a guy who has covered most of  the same points I was going to make (and added some more besides) so I'll just cut and paste him. Any emphasis in bold is my doing, not the author's - http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&refer=columnist_wallison&sid=a6M1QA55PB9Y

Quote:

In the debate on Sept. 26, Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama argued that the current crisis in the financial markets is the result of Republican deregulation.

The advertising from his campaign has been saying the same thing, and this claim is becoming a fixed element in the talking points of Democratic candidates this year.

The credibility of the charge depends on ignoring several important facts:

-- There has been a great deal of deregulation in our economy over the last 30 years, but none of it has been in the financial sector or has had anything to do with the current crisis. Almost all financial legislation, such as the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. Improvement Act of 1991, adopted after the savings and loan collapse in the late 1980s, significantly tightened the regulation of banks.

-- The repeal of portions of the Glass-Steagall Act in 1999 -- often cited by people who know nothing about that law -- has no relevance whatsoever to the financial crisis, with one major exception: it permitted banks to be affiliated with firms that underwrite securities, and thus allowed Bank of America Corp. to acquire Merrill Lynch & Co. and JPMorgan Chase & Co. to buy Bear Stearns Cos. Both transactions saved the government the costs of a rescue and spared the market substantial additional turmoil.

None of the investment banks that got into financial trouble, specifically Bear Stearns, Merrill Lynch, Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc., Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs Group Inc., were affiliated with commercial banks, and none were affected in any way by the repeal of Glass-Steagall.

It is correct to say that there has been significant deregulation in the U.S. over the last 30 years, most of it under Republican auspices. But this deregulation -- in long-distance telephone rates, air fares, securities-brokerage commissions, and trucking, to name just a few sectors of the economy where it occurred -- has produced substantial competition and innovation, driving down consumer costs and producing vast improvements and efficiencies in our economy.

The Internet, for example, wouldn't have been economically possible without the deregulation of data-transfer rates. Amazon.com Inc., one of the most popular Internet vendors, wouldn't have been viable without trucking deregulation.

-- Republicans have favored financial regulation where it was necessary, as in the case of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, while the Democrats have opposed it. In 2005, the Senate Banking Committee, then under Republican control, adopted a tough regulatory bill for Fannie and Freddie over the unanimous opposition of committee Democrats. The opposition of the Democrats when the bill reached the full Senate made its enactment impossible.

Barack Obama did nothing; John McCain endorsed the bill in a speech on the Senate floor.

-- The subprime and other junk mortgages that Fannie and Freddie bought -- and the market in these mortgages that their buying spawned -- are the underlying cause of the financial crisis. These are the mortgages that the Treasury Department is asking for congressional authority to buy. If the Democrats had allowed the Fannie and Freddie reform legislation to become law in 2005, the entire financial crisis might have been avoided.

Policies that center on deregulation are probably hard for the voting public to grasp, and that has allowed Democratic candidates to spread the idea that there is a connection between deregulation and the current crisis. But an Obama victory, based in part on the claim that deregulation has caused the financial crisis, will create a mandate for new regulation where it isn't necessary and will do harm to our economy.

Peter J Wallison




Seuss is sharp enough to have already pointed out factors which tended to discount the whole blame-it-on-repeal-of-Glass-Steagall meme. This guy's comments confirm it. There can be arguments made that the repeal of sections of Glass-Steagall was a bad idea. It cannot, however,  be argued that the repeal is a contributing factor to the current mess, since the entities involved in the current mess are in no way shape or form affected by the provisions (pre or post repeal) of the Act in the first place.




Phred


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008181 - 09/30/08 01:04 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

> yeah, and Obama's a muslim.

He claims to be a Christian.  Personally, I suspect he is an atheist, based upon his own words.  There is no question that he worked for a the law firm Miner Barnhill & Galland, from 1993 until 2002.  There is no question that he was made partner in 1996.  There is no question that he worked on lawsuits against financial institutions for failing to comply with the CRA.  There is no question that the CRA, after the changes made by Clinton, is the beginning of the housing bubble.  With all of this in mind, it seems pretty clear that Obama was one of those creating the problem that we are facing today.

Again, a lot of other players were involved, both on the left and the right.  Greed is a powerful motivator.  But your choir boy is guilty for helping create these problems.  Would the problem still be here had he stayed in Indonesia?  Certainly.  Did he profit from the problems at the expense of the US economy?  Certainly.  Obama took advantage of a system created by Clinton helping a lot of very wealthy people become even more wealthy at the expense of the rest of us.  This is fact.  If you don't believe me, look at how much money these very wealthy people are giving back to Obama in his pursuit of the presidency.

> from a non-partison organization (say, factcheck.org)

You are claiming that factcheck.org is non-partison?  Uh... ok...

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OfflinePhred
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008191 - 09/30/08 01:05 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

Whoa... are you trying to say Obama didn't work closely with ACORN in his community organizing days? Sorry, guy... that's a matter of public record.




Phred


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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: Phred]
    #9008198 - 09/30/08 01:07 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflinePhred
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008208 - 09/30/08 01:09 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

I closed a duplicate thread here http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/9007858/an/0/page/0/gonew/1#UNREAD

Those interested in completeness can click the above link if they wish.


Phred


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OfflinePhred
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008213 - 09/30/08 01:11 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

factcheck.org only deals with non-controversial stuff. The fact that Obama worked with/for ACORN in his community organizing days is hardly controversial. It's what community organizers do, duh.




Phred


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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008284 - 09/30/08 01:25 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

.


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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflinePhred
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Re: The CRA was NOT responsible for this (hear that, Seuss? Phred?) [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008433 - 09/30/08 01:50 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

LOL!

You really are too much, guy.

Your rebuttal is to claim a Fellow in Financial Policy Studies doesn't know anything about the Glass-Steagall Act.

Quote:

The bill allowed banks to transform into commercial "bank holding companies.




Not quite accurate, but close enough. Let's not quibble for the sake of argument, let's assume your assertion as stated is factual. What you are still not grasping is that none of the investment banks that are in trouble were affiliated with commercial banks.

Quote:

Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley, the last two big independent investment banks, announced Sunday night they are scrapping the old business model and becoming commercial bank-holding companies.




What's your point in posting this?

What's the date on that article, Super? Do you always have this much trouble distinguishing between past tense and present tense?





Phred


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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008445 - 09/30/08 01:52 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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OfflineAnonymousRabbit
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. [Re: AnonymousRabbit]
    #9008461 - 09/30/08 01:55 PM (15 years, 6 months ago)

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Edited by AnonymousRabbit (05/19/22 01:08 AM)

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