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Offlinesupernovasky
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Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table
    #8871825 - 09/03/08 01:57 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

WOW! Anyone sickened at the crimes of this administration can definitely take a little pleasure in Biden's statement today:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/09/biden-rips-bush.html

Quote:

    Looking to the future but with one eye on the past, Biden also promised that an Obama-Biden government would go through Bush administration data with "a fine-toothed comb" and pursue criminal charges if necessary.

    "If there has been a basis upon which you can pursue someone for a criminal violation," he said, "they will be pursued, not out of vengeance, not out of retribution - out of the need to preserve the notion that no one, no one, no attorney general, no president, no one is above the law."






:smile: Sure makes me glad he's on our side.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8871928 - 09/03/08 02:24 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

What laws did he break?


All I know is possibly wiretapping, though I don't think they've acknowledged enough information to say one way or the other.


Possibly torture related if the president is considered a member of the armed forces, which I kinda doubt but don't know.


That's about all I recall.


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Offlinesupernovasky
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: johnm214]
    #8871954 - 09/03/08 02:28 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Wiretapping is the big one. And torture. You've hit two major ones on the head. Another one is misrepresentation of evidence to go to war with Iraq, of which there are plenty of allegations.

This applies not only to the Bush administration, but also senior officials. Dick Cheney, for instance, refuses to acknowledge subpoenas, as does Carl Rove. When they are out of the white house, they will no longer have power to refuse. Like it or not, many Americans believe there was severe wrongdoing in the white house and I'm glad that these candidates will go through ALL of the records of the previous administration.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8871980 - 09/03/08 02:34 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Gonzales should have been impeached, that bastard, but I don't know about the rest.


Rove perhaps charged with contempt along with cheney.


I just don't know if bush violated the law.  How is lying about the war a crime, with citations please, and can you prove that he did lie?

I don't know if bush is covered by the vienna convention statute that provides criminal sanctions or any other torture law, but make the case for me, I'll listen.


As for the wiretaps, hazy hazy issue.  I really don't know if he commited any crimes cuz we know just about nothing about who was targeted and why.  Without that info its impossible to tell, and tehy'd have to impeach him, pretty much, to figure out what he did and why.


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Offlinesupernovasky
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: johnm214]
    #8872073 - 09/03/08 02:49 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quite honestly, John, although I am knowledgeable, its not a case that I can make. I'm no law buff, I'm a science buff. I have heard convincing cases before for crimes on several Bush administration individuals. The charges against Dick and Rove are obvious, but as far as Bush, a little less obvious. With the wiretapping issue, they don't need to impeach at all. They just need to wait until he is out of office and review all of his wiretaps. I remember reading many times that millions of conversations were warrentlessly wiretapped. If it came about as an executive order, then I fail to see how he would be immune.

All of this stuff would have to be investigated, but obviously it has SOME merit if leading candidates are talking about the possibility.

There are a few other issues that need to be adressed....

The current administration's defining people as enemy combatants and denying them many human rights seems to border on criminal, especially with the recent "Bin Laden Taxi Cab Driver" case where the court ruled against the government and the government still decided to keep him detained.

Torture, rendition, the use of overseas prisons for US citizens, I mean, there is a lot here to investigate.

I just am glad a candidate is coming out and saying that it all WILL be investigated.


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8872169 - 09/03/08 03:03 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Biden just wants to throw everybody in jail.

Do you really think Bush, Cheney or anyone else in his administration are in any kind of actual legal jeopardy? This seems to be grandstanding by Biden as a campaign strategy.


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Offlinesupernovasky
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872181 - 09/03/08 03:06 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I DEFINITELY think Cheney is, Chemy, for contempt.
Even the bar association has said so. You know, the people who license lawyers.


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8872186 - 09/03/08 03:07 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Retracted


Edited by Chemy (09/08/08 10:28 PM)


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Offlinesupernovasky
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872209 - 09/03/08 03:12 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

:smile: I just think that plenty of investigating needs to be done. Administration officials are not above the law. Just look at Nixon :wink:


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8872216 - 09/03/08 03:14 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

supernovasky said:
I DEFINITELY think Cheney is, Chemy, for contempt.
Even the bar association has said so. You know, the people who license lawyers.



By the way, the state's issue professional licenses, not the Bar, there are mandatory states that require Bar membership before issuing licenses, but the Bar does not issue licenses.

I don't know anything about law, I have studied some type of rules that govern society for the past 6 years on and off, but I forget what that's called:)


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Offlinesupernovasky
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872222 - 09/03/08 03:15 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I mean, I'll say it again, I'm much more of a scientist then I am a lawyer. But it would be silly to say that there are not convincing cases out there for the prosecution of several administration officials. I'm just glad that someone is saying they'll give it the time of day, rather than just not investigate it at all.


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8872249 - 09/03/08 03:19 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

supernovasky said:
But it would be silly to say that there are not convincing cases out there for the prosecution of several administration officials. I'm just glad that someone is saying they'll give it the time of day, rather than just not investigate it at all.



And nobody likes Cheney, if there ever was a defendant that a jury could unanimously convict it would be him, I can imagine Cheney looking directly at every juror singly and saying "go fuck yourself, you don't rule me" or something similar.

But, if anyone is above the law it would be Cheney:shrug:


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: supernovasky]
    #8872390 - 09/03/08 03:48 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

From

Bush Derangement Syndrome


To

Palin Hysteria Syndrome


back to


Bush Derangement Syndrome


how do u keep up?


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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InvisibleMinstrel
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: lonestar2004]
    #8872407 - 09/03/08 03:54 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Oh shit!  An what an election ploy!  The Dems think they can capitalize on this strange loathing of Bush/Cheney.


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Minstrel]
    #8872427 - 09/03/08 03:59 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

:smile:


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OnlineGastronomicus
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872828 - 09/03/08 05:37 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Chemy said:
Wow, the bar association, well Cheney is done if the bar association says so:rolleyes:




:rofl2:

Yup, cuz them damn yankee lawyers shur don't know nothin bout the law


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Make my Funk the P Funk, I wants to get Funked up


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Gastronomicus]
    #8872880 - 09/03/08 05:46 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Retracted


Edited by Chemy (09/08/08 10:30 PM)


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OnlineGastronomicus
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872939 - 09/03/08 05:55 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I didn't say that a statement by the Bar would be usable in court, I just said that if the Bar says that Cheney is eligible for Contempt then odds are there's stuff that will be usable. But if you could properly interpret statements then you would know that


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Make my Funk the P Funk, I wants to get Funked up


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OfflineChemy
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Gastronomicus]
    #8872968 - 09/03/08 06:01 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Gastronomicus said:
I didn't say that a statement by the Bar would be usable in court, I just said that if the Bar says that Cheney is eligible for Contempt then odds are there's stuff that will be usable. But if you could properly interpret statements then you would know that



Quote:

Gastronomicus said:
Yup, cuz them damn yankee lawyers shur don't know nothin bout the law




How am I supposed to interpret that statement.

Quote:

I just said that if the Bar says that Cheney is eligible for Contempt then odds are there's stuff that will be usable.





This is the original statement:
Quote:

Yup, cuz them damn yankee lawyers shur don't know nothin bout the law




Wow, that statement was supposed to mean: "I just said that if the Bar says that Cheney is eligible for Contempt then odds are there's stuff that will be usable."

Who in their right mind would interpret that statement to mean what you later clarified?

I will begin writing a new Gastronimus translation software program:

First line:
"Yup, cuz them damn yankee lawyers shur don't know nothin bout the law"

Translates to:

"if the Bar says that Cheney is eligible for Contempt then odds are there's stuff that will be usable."


Edited by Chemy (09/08/08 10:32 PM)


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OfflineRebirtha
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Re: Biden: Criminal Charges Against Bush Admin. are on the Table [Re: Chemy]
    #8872990 - 09/03/08 06:08 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Your question

"Do you really think Bush, Cheney or anyone else in his administration are in any kind of actual legal jeopardy?"

His answer:
The Bar association has analyzed this administration and concluded that there are actual legal grounds against this administration. The bar association isn't going to court against them, but they hold some credibility upon legal matters.

What's the confusion?


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