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InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male

Registered: 11/16/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Avg germination times
    #878573 - 09/11/02 05:49 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

I think this might be an interesting project:
what I am looking for are average germinations times for various strains on various types of agar at various temperatures. It would be fun to compile them all. (errr.. maybe) :P
This caught my attention because my girlfriends pet schnauzer innoculated 11 MEA plates almost exactly 2 days ago and it appears as if at least 3 of the plates have germination already. At an avg. temp of 79 Faherheit ( 26.1 Celsius) This was with a B+ print obtained from Ryche Hawk a while back.


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Offlineaural
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Registered: 05/04/00
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #879167 - 09/12/02 12:15 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

I'm pretty sure germination is dependant on the age and condition of the spores,much more than on the strain itself.


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OfflineZed
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: aural]
    #879237 - 09/12/02 01:15 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

well, it depends a lot on the strain u use.

if your lucky and keep temps perfect u will prolly be looking at around 10days.

but usually its from 2weeks-1month

Zed

oh shit, just re-read your post and your question was for specific strain germ times...sorry about that. (id delete my post if i was able to)


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Edited by Zed (09/12/02 01:18 AM)


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Offlineaural
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Zed]
    #879292 - 09/12/02 01:43 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

In reply to:

if your lucky and keep temps perfect u will prolly be looking at around 10days.

but usually its from 2weeks-1month





Huh?? I'd say more like 3 days average with fresh spores,and no more than 7-10 days even with pretty old spores.


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Offlinecomario2
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: aural]
    #879488 - 09/12/02 03:28 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

i agree with aural


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comario


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OfflineDinoMyc
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Registered: 11/14/99
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #879618 - 09/12/02 04:39 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Information like this would indeed be informative.
If you have much experience with expermental analysis, or even if not, please do follow through with this.. it does take some effort, but the results are rewarding (in many ways, in this case).


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If I made affirmation, I apologize.
I merely came to listen, came to say.


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InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
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Registered: 11/16/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Avg germination times [Re: DinoMyc]
    #879636 - 09/12/02 04:53 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

obviously there are many experimental factors to consider, but I do believe that this could provide some insight into overall lifecycle information on Ps. cubensis sub-species/strains.
  Yes aural, spore age is a determining factor also which is another one to add to the list.  Which is why it would be nice if spore sellers would date their spores.  I may just put in a request for just that.  This is more useful for sporeprints, moreso than spore syringes (which have a relatively limited viability lifespan).
  I still think that given the wide range of sub-strains/species(?) of Ps.Cubensis currently extant, that this could shed some new light on our fungal friends.
  Yes DinoMyc.. (nice reference to Jimmy Walker I might add)  :smile:  ... I do have _some_ experience with experimental analysis.    Thanks for the encouragement.
    This does require scrupulous attention to detail, but I am sure some of the more science minded experimenters here could actually donate some information.
  thanks to everyone who supplies informative posts. 


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OfflineVisigoth
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Registered: 11/28/01
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #879799 - 09/12/02 06:15 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

My friend scraped some treasure coast spores onto some nutrient agar on Tuesday afternoon. The plates were put into an incubator at temps averaging 84-85. Is is now thursday and significant growth is noted. My friend thinks they'll be completely colonized no later than Sunday.

Vis


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Offlineaural
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #880335 - 09/12/02 12:22 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

I wasn't trying to dampen your spirit of scientific experimentation or anything...

I just think that unless you produce and harvest all the spores of the different strains yourself, under the same conditions,any measurements of germination time will be irrelevant.


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OfflineZed
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: aural]
    #881911 - 09/13/02 12:48 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

lmfao, well i dunno what was wrong with me that night i posted but for some reason i thought the post asked about colonization times....i musta been well stoned :\

hehe, sorry about that :s

Zed


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InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male

Registered: 11/16/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Avg germination times [Re: aural]
    #881945 - 09/13/02 01:11 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

  part of the idea here is too establish whether or not some strains do better across a broader or more narrow temperature band and also perhaps on differing types of substrates.  Essentially the information that would be useful here is:
  a) age of spores
  b) strain and origin of spores (vendor, wild print, etc)
  c) storage conditions (glass plate, sterilized paper, etc)
  d) type of agar and additives (PDA, MYPA,  was end substrate added?, etc)
  e) type of sealant (Parafilm, saran wrap, etc)
  f) average temperature during germination (if possible standard deviation)
  g) germination time
  h) (only if doing very precise work) % germination
 
  I think that would about cover it.  This way even if several different cultivators are using different temperatures for example, if all the other variables are held constant then we can obtain useful information from this.
  Reproducibility is one of the cornerstones of any modern experiment. 
  oh don't worry my curiousity is far from squashed.  :wink: 


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Offlineaural
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #881959 - 09/13/02 01:18 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

In reply to:

part of the idea here is too establish whether or not some strains do better across a broader or more narrow temperature band and also perhaps on differing types of substrates




Then I would suggest taking germination time out of the equation completely,and measuring something like sq. cm of agar covered in X days since innoculation using a standardized size of agar fragment.....or something like that!


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InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male

Registered: 11/16/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Avg germination times [Re: aural]
    #882154 - 09/13/02 02:35 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

The idea here is to primarily establish properties specific to germination. :wink:
Outgrowth on agar would be a different, although related, thing.
     


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Offlinetriptoking
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #883140 - 09/13/02 11:30 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

The info could help us all a great deal--I'm sitting on some inactive 7 day old cultures, not knowing whether I screwed up or God is taking her time. 30 degree C (86F) is still cited as optimal for some Psilocybe strains which is right where my water bath/incubator is pinned, but do we really know and at what phase? Incidentally "linear" mycelial growth is sometimes plotted as a function of temp. or other independent cariable. In this case:Beween 30C and room temp, nearly a two fold difference--this should translate to anywhere between a 4 and 8 fold difference in colonization times! You bet I have an interest in the difference between 5 days and a month or more. But if I may make a suggesation, if we make it too fussy to measure, no one will care to take the time.


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Invisibletripndicular
My Minds Eye IsRhizomorphic

Registered: 08/25/02
Posts: 2,791
Loc: Bowels of HELL
Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #883157 - 09/13/02 11:42 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I did a Thai strain in 4 days . The house temp is 78-81* F, above my oven where I stored them reaches 84* F in afternnon .
I am fairly certain there is no contams as of yet , the mycelium seems a bit aerial .
In less than 12 hours it has more than doubled in size .
May the mushroom godess bless you're endeavors !  :cool: 


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Any information I give is not intended to aide you in the production of potentialy illegal substances !None of my exp comes from growing illegal varities , so take it as you will .
So with that said here is our mission statement .

Then the priest fell into a trance or swoon,& said unto the Queen of heaven ; Write unto us the ordeals; write unto us the rituals; write unto us the law !


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Invisibletripndicular
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Registered: 08/25/02
Posts: 2,791
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Re: Avg germination times [Re: Alkaloids]
    #883173 - 09/13/02 11:55 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Sorry for not reading more before opening mouth .
a. age -UNKNOWN recently purchased though
b. strain/origin- THAI (allI was told) PRINT
c. storage cond.- PAPER SEAL/ IN PLASTIC BAGGIE
d. agar type - MAE used medicaly sterile water
e. sealant -NONE putin partially closed zip loc
f. avg temp - 78*F - 81*F / temp swings in 84*F max for short periods of time
g. germ time - 4 days confirmed visible fluffy white
h. % germ - ?????? I did 4 dishes all 4 are looking good ...........so far.

May the mushroom godess bless you're endeavors !


--------------------
Any information I give is not intended to aide you in the production of potentialy illegal substances !None of my exp comes from growing illegal varities , so take it as you will .
So with that said here is our mission statement .

Then the priest fell into a trance or swoon,& said unto the Queen of heaven ; Write unto us the ordeals; write unto us the rituals; write unto us the law !


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InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male

Registered: 11/16/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Avg germination times [Re: triptoking]
    #883184 - 09/14/02 12:03 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

good point TripToking.  Should we take a poll to see how many variables people are willing to keep track of and/or control?  *lol*
  I am confident that this could really be useful for honing in on optimal conditions for various strains.
  Any suggestion as to where to draw the "fussy" line TripToking?  :smile: 


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