|
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
Sporelific
Stranger



Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 56
Loc: Somewhere In Time
Last seen: 12 years, 6 months
|
I'm so confused over casing...
#8676910 - 07/24/08 03:56 PM (16 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Thanks to SW and their fantastic sale on B+, I finally have some growing in two, 1 quart, PF jars...quite aggressively in fact. First spores were purchase from the spore store...needless to say they were crap and a waste of money and a big dissapointment...which is why they are not sponsors...I know-I know.
I want to case but I am finding it increasingly difficult to sort out all the information available just on these boards about casings. (who'd-a thunk...TOO much information?!) So here I propose what I plan to do and you tell me if I got it or if I am way off base.
I plan on using a dark and deep dish pan/tub from wal-fart, lined with foil, and placed inside a plastic bag punched with holes for a humidity-tent, like I do my gourmet shrooms. It works wonders for the oysters.
So I plan on adding an inch of moistened verm to the bottom and spreading my cakes (which I plan on slicing or crumbling...whichever I be in the mood for I guess) on top of that.
I have a worm composting bin and several weeks ago I grabbed out a bunch of mostly finished compost and dried it (it has chunks of uncomposted egg shell in it, but that takes forever to decompose. Its good for the wormies). I had read about hydrating a coir brick (which are so cheap in my neck of the woods...$2.50 at the local co-op) with worm "tea", adding gypsum (I'mma thinkin 1/4 cup?), than placing that after is has been pasteurized on top of the crumbled cakes...but that would make a nutritious layer that would colonize with mycelium...would it not?
So then it would not be casing...it would be substrate. So adding a layer of wax paper to the surface of this would help create a micro-climate that will induce pinning when removed. Once removed, should I add more WT-coir to the colonized surface or just peat moss? Then THAT (the peat moss) would be the casing....am I correct?
Would it be easier to mix the verm in with the WT-Coir instead of laying it seperately on the bottom or would I really need it at all? Then I would just add a layer of pasturized mix (WT-coir/verm) on the bottom, then the crumbled/sliced cakes, then another inch or two more of mix on top of that, topped off the wax paper and eventually peat moss once the top layer is fully colonized.
Have I boggled yer brains yet? Am I understanding this process very well or no?
I'mma noob (I am not afraid to admit it) and I want the best possible flush from these first two jars because its been a long time comin.
--------------------
Sporelifica
|
noobieshroomie
Back again




Registered: 07/18/08
Posts: 12,769
Loc: Not Too Sure
|
Re: I'm so confused over casing... [Re: Sporelific]
#8677205 - 07/24/08 05:21 PM (16 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
hey whats up im a noob too but have done ALOT,ALOT,ALOT of reading the spore store is a bunch of shit i ordered 4 syringes from them about 2 months ago my account was charged for them but i never got any thing,not even an answer to my many e-mails 6 to be exact. go with the hawks eye
-------------------- AMU
Best Thread Ever
CapZilla said:
not sure what GE and FAE are but i should probably get some.
Citric said:
Your signature is wrong on colonization temps!
GOOD JUDGMENT COMES FROM EXPERIENCE
EXPERIENCE COMES FROM BAD JUDGMENT
ROOM TEMP 70-75 IS BEST FOR COLONIZATION
Thank you mycochef
|
PowerOfTheCoir
Newbie Sympathizer



Registered: 07/02/08
Posts: 421
Last seen: 14 years, 24 days
|
|
Glad to hear that you switched over to a sponsor for spores. The sponsors here universally rock - the one that had customer service problems got dumped because of it. Everyone here has their own favorite sponsor(s), but they all have established (and awesome) records in the Sponsors forum.
Suggestions for your casing project:
You've clearly been doing quite a bit of reading - bravo! You've also run into the big problem with all of the mushroom info on the net - it conflicts. Some techniques are old, some are just bad, and some don't make it clear how they combine with other techniques. Putting them together into your own start-to-finish "tek" is the toughest part of moving past cakes.
First, lose the verm layer on the bottom. This is a technique called "bottom casing." It was a neat idea, but experience has shown most people here that it doesn't give any noticeable benefit and increases the chance of bottom pinning and contamination.
Second, your coir mixed with worm tea and gypsum is a great idea. Your decision to pasteurize it is another good one - it's loaded with good and bad organisms and pasteurization does a good job of only leaving good ones. You're correct that this mixture will be nutritious and get colonized. This is the heart of "bulk" growing. You take something nutritious and mix it with colonized cake or grains. Then, the whole thing colonizes giving you a bigger ("bulked") source of nutrition and moisture than you had before. The only modification I would make to your plan is to mix the cake material and coir together in your tray. This will speed up colonization. Once colonized, you'll have one solid mass of substrate. Until it's colonized, you run the risk of contamination. There will be some bad guys in there, but your colonized cake material has such a big head start that it will usually devour anything in it's path.
Third, the mix of coir and cake shouldn't be more than 4" thick. I'm not sure how deep you planned, but there is such a thing as too deep. If O2 can reach the bottom, you'll get anaerobic bad things growing down there.
Fourth, gypsum is a great additive that will keep the PH from dropping too low in the substrate and provide valuable minerals. For maximum benefit, I'd suggest using 10% as much gypsum as you have coir (by volume and after the coir is hydrated). That means 10 cups of coir gets 1 cup of gypsum, not 9 cups coir and 1 cup gypsum)
Fifth, Bro, you are truly warming my heart. You are one of the rare new guys that understands the difference between a casing layer and a substrate. The term "casing" is wrongly used to describe just about anything except a cake in many "teks." You're right, adding more nutritious material isn't casing - it's just adding more substrate. Casing is non-nutritious and should not fully colonize. Peat moss is a good casing material, but most people find that 50% peat and 50% vermiculite works best. You should use hydrated lime to bring the ph of your peat to 8-8.5. Adding gypsum the same way you did to the coir before adding lime will work even better since lime doesn't create a very stable PH. Without gypsum, it will drop quickly once the mycellium starts putting out acidic metabolites. With gypsum, the PH will stay where you set it and make the casing a zone of absolute hell for invading contaminants. Hydrate the verm and add it last - it doesn't affect the PH. Oh, and use hydrated lime, not dolomitic. Also, check for magnesium content. Magnesium is evil and anything over 3% spells death (I think).
Good luck with this project!
-------------------- Check out my first ever TEK!
Shroom capsules with the Cap-M-Quik (pics)
|
MYSTIQUE
Say Hi to the elves for me.




Registered: 04/28/07
Posts: 1,764
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
|
|
Wow so much reading my head hurts.
What I think you want to do is
Layer of casing Layer of sub Layer of sliced cakes as spawn Layer of wet verm
Um don't make a layer of verm on the bottom mix it in with the sub if ya wants. But a layer of that will just contam or something not good.
If you do slice up mash the cakes whatever(Id leave em as cakes and shotgun them.) Id mix it with the spawn and not just make a layer of that on top of the verm. That will make those poor chunk of cake waterlogged and kill them.
You can use wax paper or plastic bags with holes cut in it to use as a casing while it is incubating.
For the casein layer after I would use 50/50 peat and coir.
Really if you want to do this right look up one good tek and follow it to the T and don't try and mix a mish mash of all of them.
-------------------- Dont know what the fuck I just said? READ THIS
http://www.shroomery.org/5122/The-Shroomery-Mushroom-Glossary
I ain't a hippy but I'm covered in dirt
Sippin lots of mushroom tea in a tye-dye shirt
Chasin' the Grateful Dead, no shoes on my feet
Beggin' in the parking lot for something to eat,
DO NOT USE FIRE IN YOUR GLOVE BOX!!!!!!!
|
MYSTIQUE
Say Hi to the elves for me.




Registered: 04/28/07
Posts: 1,764
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
|
Re: I'm so confused over casing... [Re: MYSTIQUE]
#8677376 - 07/24/08 06:19 PM (16 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
sorry that 50/50 coir or peat and verm
-------------------- Dont know what the fuck I just said? READ THIS
http://www.shroomery.org/5122/The-Shroomery-Mushroom-Glossary
I ain't a hippy but I'm covered in dirt
Sippin lots of mushroom tea in a tye-dye shirt
Chasin' the Grateful Dead, no shoes on my feet
Beggin' in the parking lot for something to eat,
DO NOT USE FIRE IN YOUR GLOVE BOX!!!!!!!
|
PowerOfTheCoir
Newbie Sympathizer



Registered: 07/02/08
Posts: 421
Last seen: 14 years, 24 days
|
Re: I'm so confused over casing... [Re: MYSTIQUE]
#8677383 - 07/24/08 06:21 PM (16 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Oh yeah - a note about verm.
Some people mix it in with bulk substrates. You probably don't need to. It's only benefits are a fluffy texture and good water storage. Coir does both of these extremely well without any help. For your grow, save the verm for the casing mix.
-------------------- Check out my first ever TEK!
Shroom capsules with the Cap-M-Quik (pics)
|
Sporelific
Stranger



Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 56
Loc: Somewhere In Time
Last seen: 12 years, 6 months
|
|
PoweroftheCoir... That is definately sounding like a plan to me! I'mma thinkin the sub will be less than 3", but it is good to know 4" is the max for depth.
NoobieShroomie...I did the research too...but thought I'd try 'em out anyway. The prices are very alluring...but needless to say, I deserve a chorus of "I told you so's"! 
Thanks Mystique! I like to mish-mash a lot of teks outside of mycology as well. Maybe a fault of mine. I like to take all the best ideas and try em all out at once. LOL
--------------------
Sporelifica
|
|