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OfflineKada
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I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims
    #8662735 - 07/21/08 11:23 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I slowly stopped doing alot of the things a person would do to prevent contaimination. The only thing i do to prevent contaims is to steam sterilize my jars for 90 minutes. I even cut out boiling water for my syringe, i just use filtered water from my fridge. I don't use a glove box, i just wash my hands. I do boil my needle before i reuse it for 10-15 minutes, but thats about it.

When i make a syringe, i just scrape my print into a clean cup, then fill it with water from the fridge and suck it up into the syringe. Im going to start doing the mycelium syringe tek, because it's aot faster colinization.

Am i just getting lucky here, or is making your jars right, then sterilizing your syringe between uses really all someone needs to do? I have followed every safty method RR's vid shows, and i have disregaurded almost every sterile tek in his vid. I never get contaims.

Luck or something else? My house is clean, i take 2 showers a day, and i handle my materials carefully. I just never bother with glove boxes, gloves, masks, alcohol, lysol, air purifiers, or flow hoods. I do pf tek brf jars.


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~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

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My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.


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OfflineBrandNewbie
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Kada]
    #8662792 - 07/21/08 11:35 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Can you do my shit for me? :wink:


--------------------
Question: Why do women wear make-up and perfume? 
Answer: Because they're ugly and they stink.

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Offlinedirtworshipper
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Kada]
    #8662801 - 07/21/08 11:37 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I'm going to have to say that you're pretty lucky.
I doubt you'd have as much luck with grains, unfortunately.

But congratulations for all of the success
Who cares if it's luck or not in the successful end?


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“You've got as many lives as you like, and more, even ones you don't want.” - George Harrison

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Offlinemoho456
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: dirtworshipper]
    #8662816 - 07/21/08 11:41 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I'm a total slob, I work with grains, and I cut corners with great success too.

Maybe its a combination of environment, luck, and established paranoia.


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Invisibleseven
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: moho456]
    #8663254 - 07/21/08 01:18 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

id say environment factors play a big roll in contams. i know older houses have alot of contams. moldy ass old houses . haha! air movement is a factor. most people go overboard just to be on the safe side. which is a good idea. i plan on useing grains on my first grow so i will be very carefull.  also i doubt you will ever advance in mycology cutting corners like that. other aspects of this hobby are less forgiving. ie: agar work. id say you are lucky. but you can take my words with a grain of salt so to speak.


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grind

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InvisibleDJYoshaBYD
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: seven]
    #8663289 - 07/21/08 01:27 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Luck or something else? My house is clean, i take 2 showers a day, and i handle my materials carefully. I just never bother with glove boxes, gloves, masks, alcohol, lysol, air purifiers, or flow hoods. I do pf tek brf jars.




I clean my area around me before I work.. like bleach wipe the counter, a lil lysol in the air.. stop any fans, etc.. I NEVER wear gloves except when I am handling and mixing my coir.. just a precaution.. I use alcohol and PC any metal instruments I will use.. I just stick them in with my jars.. killing 2 birds, ya know?

Im all about being clean, but I never use my glove box unless my cats are shedding real bad, or im working with agar..

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OfflineIzord
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Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8663489 - 07/21/08 02:34 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I've been doing it the easy way for years.  Don't own Lysol or Chlorox.  I use filter disks on my grain jars and shoot my spores thru there with a needle which I never flame. I do use a cool a technique which I think I thought of.  It is that I pressure cook my grain twice.  Once to activate the endospores and once to kill them on the next day. I never soak my grain.  Just add a fixed quantity of grain and water to my jars.  Too fucked up right now to tell you exactly how much, but I use quart jars. I wrote it down somewhere, anyway.  I add water and grain, pc, wait till the next day and pc again. So I never soak or even rinse my grain. 

I get about 9 out of 10 good jars and take the bad one outside and dump the mold into my forest then rinse the jar with the hose then take it inside and put it in the dishwasher.

I'll say it again, I don't own lysol or chlorox and don't use any alcohol to sterilize anything when I grow.

I get great harvests, enough for me and all my relatives. I keep in touch with the mother for regular communications and advice.  : )  I'll try some different strains now and then for some hardy ones and I've been lucky enough to avoid bad contams.

I feel sorry for people with contamination problems.  After learning how to grow from a guy who was crazy about spraying the air with chlorox and the table with lysol and wearing a mask while he worked with strains and shit like that, I had to find a better way for myself.

Iz.

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Invisiblethemange
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8663504 - 07/21/08 02:40 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

DJYoshaBYD said:
I clean my area around me before I work.. like bleach wipe the counter, a lil lysol in the air.. stop any fans, etc.. I NEVER wear gloves except when I am handling and mixing my coir.. just a precaution.. I use alcohol and PC any metal instruments I will use.. I just stick them in with my jars.. killing 2 birds, ya know?




same here:thumbup:. if you critically think about sterility you can pinpoint what needs to be clean and what doesnt.

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InvisibleDJYoshaBYD
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Izord]
    #8663534 - 07/21/08 02:47 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

pressure cooking doesnt "activate the endospores"... lol.. you could probably get a 10 out of 10 if you you used it right... lol

I mean, there IS a reason that you take sterile precautions.. so you have 100% success...

his way was not bad at all.. i mean, in a way, your way is slightly careless.. you shouldnt need to PC twice, but hey.. if it works, I guess it works.. I would for sure chalk up your success with almost no contams as luck...

it also really depends on your living environment.. sure you dont lysol and stuff right away, but I bet your house isnt a pig sty either.. really, as long as you turn off the fans and dont have too much moving air around your all good..

you shoot the spores through the filter, but I wonder how well this technique you use would work if you got out of using spores for every grow and started using a live culture.. you would have to crack open the lid, and then I bet 10 bucks that you would get contams on every jar you opened if you didnt sterilize the air...

the reason your jars, after sterilizing, dont get contams, is because you are not exposing them to the air.. just a dirty needle.. at least alcy the needle, and that may bring you up to 100% success.. but if you are working on any substrate or tek that you need to open the jar to get stuff in, then it will most likely contam..

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Invisiblepsylopsycho
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8663726 - 07/21/08 03:47 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I would say congratulations on all the luck that you have had. Although I think that this post may leave alot of noobs a bit unhappy if they start throwing sterility to the wayside.

Being a bit OCD'ish when it comes to mycology seems to be a staple.

I think I will stick with sterility!

Congrats though!

:thumbup:


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Someone actually said: "some 1 told me to try long brown rice and water and vermiculite and pressure cook for 1 hour i did but nothing happen that is y was wonting to no if i need spores ""

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InvisiblePhraggle
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Kada]
    #8664096 - 07/21/08 05:36 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Wow. You must be a complete noob or something since according to some people it is absolutely impossible to cut corners and have success. :rolleyes:


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Offlineshevanel
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Phraggle]
    #8664128 - 07/21/08 05:47 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

sterile technique = :thumbdown: :rolleyes:


Edited by shevanel (07/21/08 05:50 PM)

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OfflineMarioTrip
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: shevanel]
    #8664232 - 07/21/08 06:13 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

you can get away with sloppiness for awhile but not forever.


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I'm Livin' It, distribute it
The streets are inhibited
By cut throat niggas just like me
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Invisiblepsylopsycho
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: MarioTrip]
    #8664304 - 07/21/08 06:38 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

MarioTrip said:
you can get away with sloppiness for awhile but not forever.




Amen Brother        :thumbup:


--------------------


Someone actually said: "some 1 told me to try long brown rice and water and vermiculite and pressure cook for 1 hour i did but nothing happen that is y was wonting to no if i need spores ""

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InvisibleJenkins22
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: psylopsycho]
    #8664358 - 07/21/08 06:50 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

if u get a sealed needle from the pharmacy for like 10 cents then there is no need to sterilize if u use it right out the pack. They're already sterile.

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OfflineMad River
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Jenkins22]
    #8664399 - 07/21/08 06:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

And if you buy crunchy peanut butter, you don't have to mix in your own nuts-- they're already in there! :smile:

I learned this the hard way. :sad:

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Offlineray40cal
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Mad River]
    #8664485 - 07/21/08 07:14 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I poop in my terrarium.  But really, i don't even use tyvek or anything like that, my PC only goes up to 10psi, only time lysol is in the air is for grain to grain work, never set the pH on my casing layers... Only contam issue I have had to deal with (once) was casing layer after the 2nd flush. I even put bugs from my backyard into the FC to eat fruit flies, gnats or whatever those fuckers are.


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OfflineIzord
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8677292 - 07/24/08 05:46 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Hey DJYoshaBYD,

You said

"pressure cooking doesn't "activate the endospores"... lol.. you could probably get a 10 out of 10 if you you used it right... lol"

It's not the pressure cooking, it's the heat and moisture that break their shell and start them growing.  Endospores are created to resist times of poor environment so the bacteria can survive. Warmth and moisture and maybe nutrients available signal them to start growing.  That's why people soak their grain overnight before pc'ing. 

I just found it's easier not to soak at all.  Just add ingredients to my jars, put in pressure cooker and pc for an hour then wait till the next day and pc again.  I don't even take them out of the pc.  Consider that the easy way to soak.  And the first pc kills all the stuff outside the endospores, then the signal for the endospore to hatch, just like soaking, and then pc again the next day before new endospores form.  It's just like soaking and rinsing, except easier, because it skips those two time consuming steps.  I guess it takes me about two minutes to turn off the stove and turn it on again the next day, but I use a timer to clock the actual pc time. 

So LOL right back at you, yes my pc technique does "activate" and KILL the endospores.

And their isn't any need for me to flame my needles.  I use sterile ones, and cap them, and replace them after a few times. The filter disks they go through are sterile because I keep the pressure cooker closed till the jars are cool and I'm ready to inoculate.

And you are right that I'm successful because I keep the jars closed, I never take off the filter disk till I'm ready to spawn, and I've never had a spawn go bad at that point.  I can just look at my jars and see the nice fluffy white ones and by that time they are ready to run the spawn.

The technique requires a Little patience to let that pc sit somewhere overnight with jars inside.  But I don't want to work unnecessarily and chunking one jar out of 10 is a lot easier on me that going crazy with Lysol, chlorox, and alcohol.  The alcohol belongs in my belly not on a rag to wipe the table. : ) And fuck rinsing grain and soaking.  What a hastle!!  and Unnecessary. Unless you went to get a prize in Guinness book of world records for least contams. (Or you think toil is a virtue.)

Moderation in everything buddy.

Peace.

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OfflineIzord
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: MarioTrip]
    #8677298 - 07/24/08 05:48 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

MarioTrip said:
you can get away with sloppiness for awhile but not forever.




How about since 1984?  Is that close to forever?  Or more than awhile?

Iz  : )

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Offlineshevanel
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Izord]
    #8677481 - 07/24/08 07:09 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Izord said:

I just found it's easier not to soak at all.  Just add ingredients to my jars, put in pressure cooker and pc for an hour then wait till the next day and pc again.  I don't even take them out of the pc.

Consider that the easy way to soak.    I guess it takes me about two minutes to turn off the stove and turn it on again the next day, but I use a timer to clock the actual pc time. 
.





That sounds lazy & cool but assuming your PC doesn't handle over 20 quarts, who knows but you , I think it's easier to soak 2-3 5 gallon buckets of seed in mesh bags overnight then start running the PC in batches thereafter.

I suppose your method works if your making grain for spawn masters or just a small grow, thats fine.. but if you're trying to nock out more than 10ish jars or so soaking in batches doesn;t seem more wastefull than spending almost 2 days to completely do 1 pc cycle.

I don't understand how anyone would want to Pc jars then wait until the next day to pressure cook the SAME jars again... afterall, isn't that nearly same amount spent soaking grain for 24 hours?

I'm very confused.

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OfflinePowerOfTheCoir
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Izord]
    #8677607 - 07/24/08 07:43 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Izord said:
Hey DJYoshaBYD,

You said

"pressure cooking doesn't "activate the endospores"... lol.. you could probably get a 10 out of 10 if you you used it right... lol"

It's not the pressure cooking, it's the heat and moisture that break their shell and start them growing.  Endospores are created to resist times of poor environment so the bacteria can survive. Warmth and moisture and maybe nutrients available signal them to start growing.  That's why people soak their grain overnight before pc'ing. 

I just found it's easier not to soak at all.  Just add ingredients to my jars, put in pressure cooker and pc for an hour then wait till the next day and pc again.  I don't even take them out of the pc.  Consider that the easy way to soak.  And the first pc kills all the stuff outside the endospores, then the signal for the endospore to hatch, just like soaking, and then pc again the next day before new endospores form.  It's just like soaking and rinsing, except easier, because it skips those two time consuming steps.  I guess it takes me about two minutes to turn off the stove and turn it on again the next day, but I use a timer to clock the actual pc time. 

So LOL right back at you, yes my pc technique does "activate" and KILL the endospores.

And their isn't any need for me to flame my needles.  I use sterile ones, and cap them, and replace them after a few times. The filter disks they go through are sterile because I keep the pressure cooker closed till the jars are cool and I'm ready to inoculate.

And you are right that I'm successful because I keep the jars closed, I never take off the filter disk till I'm ready to spawn, and I've never had a spawn go bad at that point.  I can just look at my jars and see the nice fluffy white ones and by that time they are ready to run the spawn.

The technique requires a Little patience to let that pc sit somewhere overnight with jars inside.  But I don't want to work unnecessarily and chunking one jar out of 10 is a lot easier on me that going crazy with Lysol, chlorox, and alcohol.  The alcohol belongs in my belly not on a rag to wipe the table. : ) And fuck rinsing grain and soaking.  What a hastle!!  and Unnecessary. Unless you went to get a prize in Guinness book of world records for least contams. (Or you think toil is a virtue.)

Moderation in everything buddy.

Peace.




You're both right about the endospores, but the "PC activates them" statement is what's so misleading. The PC doesn't do jack either way - hydrating them does. Hydration and cooking happen for you at the same time, so your tek as a whole does activate them and make them vulnerable to the second round in the PC. You would probably also activate them if you did the same technique, but instead of PCing the first time, you just added the water and shook the jars up to wet down the grains. I think you already are saying this, but it's important that new readers understand that heat has nothing to do with endospore germination.

As far as soaking in general goes, it's not just used to germinate endospores. The soak hydrates the seed coat and makes it more flexible. This allows you to get more water into grains during a subsequent simmer and greatly reduces the chance of exploded grains. Putting dry grains and water in a jar and then PCing works too, but with a little more work you can improve the grain moisture content. It's just a matter of what your priorities are (intelligent people pick both techniques).


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Shroom capsules with the Cap-M-Quik (pics)

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OfflineIzord
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: shevanel]
    #8679258 - 07/25/08 05:08 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

shevanel said:
Quote:

Izord said:

I just found it's easier not to soak at all.  Just add ingredients to my jars, put in pressure cooker and pc for an hour then wait till the next day and pc again.  I don't even take them out of the pc.

Consider that the easy way to soak.    I guess it takes me about two minutes to turn off the stove and turn it on again the next day, but I use a timer to clock the actual pc time. 
.





That sounds lazy & cool but assuming your PC doesn't handle over 20 quarts, who knows but you , I think it's easier to soak 2-3 5 gallon buckets of seed in mesh bags overnight then start running the PC in batches thereafter.

I suppose your method works if your making grain for spawn masters or just a small grow, thats fine.. but if you're trying to nock out more than 10ish jars or so soaking in batches doesn;t seem more wastefull than spending almost 2 days to completely do 1 pc cycle.

I don't understand how anyone would want to Pc jars then wait until the next day to pressure cook the SAME jars again... afterall, isn't that nearly same amount spent soaking grain for 24 hours?

I'm very confused.





Sorry man, It's not two days, it's one day per 7 jars. (My pc holds 7 jars)  Yes it's spawn masters, and yes it requires patience.  But it's a lot easier because there is no rinsing, soaking, drying steps involved. 

All you do is open your baggie  of grain you bought from whole foods, put a cup of rye and a cup of water into a quart, put the ring on with a big filter disk instead of a metal cap. and pc for 45 mins, wait overnight and pc for 45 min. Cool, shake, noc. and start the next batch if you want.

I can do 49 jars a week this which is way more than I need.  Requires a tiny bit of patience but saves a lot of steps and work.

You have to realize you can do other things while the pc is sitting there.  Like read or work or play.  It doesn't require any effort on your or my part while it sits.

And why would anyone want to do it this way?  Because it's a lot easier.  And you're right, it's not for commercial growers who need pounds and pounds of rye ready at one time.  But for someone growing at home for themselves, especially the first time it's the easiest way, and maybe the best since the wet grains are never exposed to contamination.  It's just kind of idiot-proof.

And because you use exactly the same amount of water and grain each time, once you figure it out, you have a perfect moisture content each time.

KISS = Keep it simple silly.


Edited by Izord (07/25/08 05:17 AM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Izord]
    #8679456 - 07/25/08 08:00 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

While pf cakes and the process to inoculate them is quite forgiving, proper sterile technique assures a higher level of success.

I always have to roll my eyes at posts that say "I never get contamination", because even with all the precautions I take, I still get them occasionally. Proper technique can reduce contaminants to a nuisance level, but rarely eliminate them completely.

Many drunks make it home from the bar on a regular basis, but we don't recommend drunk driving based on their accounts.
RR


--------------------
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OfflineBejeezis
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8679510 - 07/25/08 08:24 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

"Many drunks make it home from the bar on a regular basis, but we don't recommend drunk driving based on their accounts."
RR

Priceless


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___________________________________________________________

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Offlinesinzok
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams *DELETED* [Re: Bejeezis]
    #8679525 - 07/25/08 08:32 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by sinzok

Reason for deletion: Deleting posts manually sucks.


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OfflineMad River
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: sinzok]
    #8679676 - 07/25/08 09:22 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Bejeezis said:
"Many drunks make it home from the bar on a regular basis, but we don't recommend drunk driving based on their accounts."
RR

Priceless




Not really. It's not exactly an accurate metaphor. People sure like to bash things that stray from the status quo around here. If it works for the dude, it works for the dude.

He is not even calling what he does a Tek, or recommending that others do it. He's simply relating what he does that works for him. Maybe it can help other people to find their own middle ground that works for them, that will probably be different from his middle ground.

People who stray from dogma seem to get crucified around  here.*



*All opinions expressed in this post are those of a total noob. :rofl:

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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Mad River]
    #8679701 - 07/25/08 09:33 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:


People who stray from dogma seem to get crucified around  here.*




agreed.

it seems like the initial point of a thread is often lost people condemning the OP's methods. it becomes a "good luck:rolleyes:" .."thats a horrible idea" flame fest.

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OfflineBejeezis
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Mad River]
    #8679764 - 07/25/08 09:56 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Mad River said:
Quote:

Bejeezis said:
"Many drunks make it home from the bar on a regular basis, but we don't recommend drunk driving based on their accounts."
RR

Priceless




Not really. It's not exactly an accurate metaphor. People sure like to bash things that stray from the status quo around here. If it works for the dude, it works for the dude.

He is not even calling what he does a Tek, or recommending that others do it. He's simply relating what he does that works for him. Maybe it can help other people to find their own middle ground that works for them, that will probably be different from his middle ground.

People who stray from dogma seem to get crucified around  here.*



*All opinions expressed in this post are those of a total noob. :rofl:




I disagree! It's a perfect metaphor!

Just like you said, what works for the dude works for the dude.  What works for the drunks works for the drunks. And in both cases, it is not the most reliable method to an end. RR isn't saying it won't work or flaming the OP.

The bottom line is: Success cannot be guaranteed but your chances can be improved significantly if you do certain things.

Personally, I am no where near sterile. It works fine, i have contam issues from time to time and I'm sure I'd have less if i went that extra mile... but it works for me. Just like the drunk driving home... it works.... but it's not "playing it safe." 

The OP asked if it was luck or if sterile practices were unnecessary and I believe that most of the seasoned mycologists here (save for a few rude individuals) are trying to say "It's not a question of necessity but of what one is willing to risk to save time/effort."

I used to be very sterile when i started this hobby and i had great success... but I also found mycology to be a terribly tedious and time-consuming hobby. I decided to cut corners one by one as i went and now i am at a level where most of the old hands here would prolly shake their head at me. But i also cut my time spent working in half.

What works for you works for you, but that doesn't mean you are doing it the "Best" way, ya know?

Sure, the drunk doesn't HAVE to take a cab or find a DD but his chances of making it home safely are much greater if he does! :thumbup:

Cheers!


--------------------
___________________________________________________________

Whether you're here to learn or teach the art of mycology,
do so with an open mind.

My posts are 100% fictional... 
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Edited by Bejeezis (07/25/08 10:11 AM)

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OfflineMad River
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Bejeezis]
    #8680007 - 07/25/08 11:17 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Mad River said:Maybe it can help other people to find their own middle ground that works for them...




Quote:

Bejeezis said:I decided to cut corners one by one as i went and now i am at a level where most of the old hands here would prolly shake their head at me. But i also cut my time spent working in half.




That's exactly what I was getting at.

My main problem with the drunk driving analogy is that if you get contaminants, it's an inconvenience and waste of time and maybe money. If you kill or maim yourself or someone else drunk driving, that's another stratosphere altogether.

Peace. :peace::flowers::peace:

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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Mad River]
    #8680211 - 07/25/08 12:23 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

If you kill or maim yourself or someone else drunk driving, that's another stratosphere altogether.




LOL ok ok I agree with yout here :grin:

Cheers!


--------------------
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Whether you're here to learn or teach the art of mycology,
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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Bejeezis]
    #8680245 - 07/25/08 12:32 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Maybe I'm just too literal. :crazy:

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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: Mad River]
    #8680450 - 07/25/08 01:37 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Yup drunk driving is bad news.  Someone could get killed.

But if you try the No-Soak, No-rinse, Double PC Cook Shake and Noc, the worst that could happen is 7 cups of wasted Rye and 20 minutes of your time gone.

The best is that you get 6 or 7 good spawn masters for 20 minutes of time using just 7 cups of rye, a spore syringe, and NO Chlorox, Lysol or Alcohol.

And here's the exact recipe adjust according to your elevation and pressure cooker.  For each quart jar use one cup or 250 ml rye and a little less than a cup, about 220 to 240 ml water depending on how long you cook for.  I use about 45 minutes to an hour each time.

Buy some of those big filter disks from here: http://www.mycosupply.com/cgi-bin/shopper.cgi?preadd=action&key=SFDI01


No lime, No calcium.

And don't open your jars till you are ready to spawn some coir or poo or coir/coffee or something.

Good luck.

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Kada]
    #8680783 - 07/25/08 03:22 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I'd say you are lucky.

I did several BRF batches with no contams, even as my technique got less and less sterile.  I got pretty cocky about it and didn't understand how anyone could get contamination regularly.  And then I did three or four batches with 100% contamination in a row.  I got frustrated and quit for a while.  I just came back to it and had two more batches contam on me thoroughly.  I'm going to get anal again and try one more batch and see what happens. 

Be more careful than you think you need to be, I seem to have jinxed myself somehow by getting too lax.


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:amanitajar: :rose:

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: veilbreaker]
    #8682098 - 07/25/08 09:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

veilbreaker said:
I'd say you are lucky.

I did several BRF batches with no contams, even as my technique got less and less sterile.  I got pretty cocky about it and didn't understand how anyone could get contamination regularly.  And then I did three or four batches with 100% contamination in a row.  I got frustrated and quit for a while.  I just came back to it and had two more batches contam on me thoroughly.  I'm going to get anal again and try one more batch and see what happens. 

Be more careful than you think you need to be, I seem to have jinxed myself somehow by getting too lax.




Why don't you try the double pc rye tek?  It's easy and idiot proof.  : )  LOL!

Does require a TINY bit of patience, but sounds like you've learned that already.  What do you have to lose?  Iz.

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Izord]
    #8683394 - 07/26/08 08:42 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

It should also be noted that once you've had a trichoderma outbreak, your chances of failure go up exponentially after that.  Even a small spot of green on a casing layer can release billions of sticky spores into the air, which stick to your walls, ceiling, carpet, etc.

Once you've been growing for a few years, the procedures required for success become more and more anal for that reason.  It should be noted that I try to give advice for the best chance of success.  Often, growers can succeed with less precautions, but it's not advisable. In my opinion, the costs of failure even if only 10% of the time, are far more than the care required for repeated success.

As for the no-soak, no-rinse grain prep method, that's what was described in Stamets' The Mushroom Cultivator published in the 80s.  Since that time, we've developed better ways of doing grains that result in less sticking and clumping together, but that doesn't mean the old methods don't still work.  I wish the best of luck to all, regardless of the methods you use.  It's all good.
RR


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #8683978 - 07/26/08 12:22 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Amen.

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: shevanel]
    #8685738 - 07/26/08 08:46 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

lol at RR " its all good" . Roger for some reason you remind me of the Bob Ross of cultivation. :smile: good point on the mean green.


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: seven]
    #8685837 - 07/26/08 09:07 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I was a dirty pig for a while, got great results, I didnt even pasteurise my casings and had amazing success, I used to G2G in open air sitting myself and the jars on my carpet with the ducted heating on blowing all over the place..... still with success, I used to inoc jars in the open and pour dishes in open air all with success, got attacked by the green goblin once, everything went to crap after that, and everything I done got hit by contams, it forced me to be as sterile as possible, now I dont G2G sitting on the carpet or inoculate jars while cooking dinner, I pasteurise, I pc every tool, I use spray, I wear gloves, I use a glove box, I use iso, I simmer, I soak, I would never be a dirty bugger again.


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Juke Adro]
    #8685866 - 07/26/08 09:11 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

jesus..and i thought my sig was big

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: themange]
    #8685897 - 07/26/08 09:16 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

You thought wrong!


:tongue:


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Juke Adro]
    #8685912 - 07/26/08 09:19 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Damn straight!

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Juke Adro]
    #8686409 - 07/26/08 10:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

What is the world coming to. You quoted Sterben???  :rofl:

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Mad River]
    #8692964 - 07/28/08 03:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

lol, I was gonna quote you, but you have never said anything worth while :rofl2:


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: ray40cal]
    #8692982 - 07/28/08 04:04 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ray40cal said:
I poop in my terrarium. 


:thumbup: me too


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: C. duckie]
    #8693062 - 07/28/08 04:24 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I pooped on juke's avatar

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8693082 - 07/28/08 04:29 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

i don't poop on account of my lack of orifices.

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: themange]
    #8693122 - 07/28/08 04:42 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

hmm... :confused:

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OfflineJuke Adro
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8693152 - 07/28/08 04:49 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

DJYoshaBYD said:
I pooped on juke's avatar




dude thats my mum, your sick :rofl2:


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Juke Adro]
    #8693169 - 07/28/08 04:52 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

well, I want to fuck your mothers mouth.. lol.. no offense.. haha.. the lil caterpillar from the labyrinth can join in.. haha

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: DJYoshaBYD]
    #8693284 - 07/28/08 05:18 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

no comment :nonono:


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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contaims [Re: Juke Adro]
    #8694217 - 07/28/08 08:17 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

im confused

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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contams [Re: themange]
    #8696646 - 07/29/08 09:54 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Part of me thinks the moderators should have locked this thread as soon as it deteriorated from an educational discussion to a sophomoric dissertation about shitting on someone's mother...And part of me thinks I should stay out of it and let the thread drift off into obscurity...

Instead...I'm going to see if we can't restore this from a childish rant to an educational thread...The kind this forum was designed to provide...

1) Yes...People get blasted sometimes for touting methods that stray from the "established" methods...And, although thinking outside the box is a necessary part of the evolution of every science...THIS IS A FORUM FOR BEGINNERS...They come here to learn the PROPER METHODS for growing mushrooms...You can't blame the establishment for wanting to preserve that...Perhaps there should be a SUB-FORUM for ideas and concepts that rage against the norm...So that they can be discuss safely without promoting them as "the new best way" until they've been explored in depth and put to the test...

2) After working half of my adult life, teaching children to read and writing professionally, I'd like to go on record as saying I think RR's analogy about drunk driving was SPOT ON...I thought it when I read it and I'm amazed anyone would waste time arguing about it's validity as an analogy...They're not meant to be taken literally folks, just a tool used to make you look at a subject from a different angle...

Finally...and here's where the restorative question comes in...

Is it possible that contam problems relate not only to your home environment, but to your geographic location???

I lived in a very old house in Massachusetts...It had hard wood floors, radiators for heat, window units for AC and housed 5 dogs...I never had a contam problem...

I moved to Florida...Now I live in a brand new home...It has wall to wall carpets, central air and heat...4 dogs and a cat...Contam problems now abound...I get more contaminated jars and casings then healthy ones...

Same methods...Same amount of care...

I think it's the geographic location...Although...The wall to wall carpets have me suspicious too...

OK...I'm done...


--------------------
My father started me on this hobby over 30 years ago...I ask  beginner's questions whenever they occur to me...Usually to stir the pot and get people's thoughts...When I post a REPLY...IT SHOULD NOT BE ACCEPTED AS GOSPEL TRUTH...It's just what I THINK...

PEACE ALL!!!

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Re: Me too. I cut corners at every step, yet i never get BAD contams [Re: shevanel]
    #8696707 - 07/29/08 10:12 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I hate the PC'ing the jars part.  It's easy as hell to toss my bird seed in a container and let them soak though.  It's the putting in jars and lidding and pc'ing that's the pain.  So i guess for me PC once per jar is plenty enough.  Soak >> PC once is the way to go for me.


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OfflineMad River
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contams [Re: Brillig]
    #8698235 - 07/29/08 03:53 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Brillig said:
Part of me thinks the moderators should have locked this thread as soon as it deteriorated from an educational discussion to a sophomoric dissertation about shitting on someone's mother...And part of me thinks I should stay out of it and let the thread drift off into obscurity...

Instead...I'm going to see if we can't restore this from a childish rant to an educational thread...The kind this forum was designed to provide...

1) Yes...People get blasted sometimes for touting methods that stray from the "established" methods...And, although thinking outside the box is a necessary part of the evolution of every science...THIS IS A FORUM FOR BEGINNERS...They come here to learn the PROPER METHODS for growing mushrooms...You can't blame the establishment for wanting to preserve that...Perhaps there should be a SUB-FORUM for ideas and concepts that rage against the norm...So that they can be discuss safely without promoting them as "the new best way" until they've been explored in depth and put to the test...

2) After working half of my adult life, teaching children to read and writing professionally, I'd like to go on record as saying I think RR's analogy about drunk driving was SPOT ON...I thought it when I read it and I'm amazed anyone would waste time arguing about it's validity as an analogy...They're not meant to be taken literally folks, just a tool used to make you look at a subject from a different angle...

Finally...and here's where the restorative question comes in...

Is it possible that contam problems relate not only to your home environment, but to your geographic location???

I lived in a very old house in Massachusetts...It had hard wood floors, radiators for heat, window units for AC and housed 5 dogs...I never had a contam problem...

I moved to Florida...Now I live in a brand new home...It has wall to wall carpets, central air and heat...4 dogs and a cat...Contam problems now abound...I get more contaminated jars and casings then healthy ones...

Same methods...Same amount of care...

I think it's the geographic location...Although...The wall to wall carpets have me suspicious too...

OK...I'm done...




Florida is Moldapalooza.

How's that for a metaphor?! :laugh:

:peace:

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InvisibleBrillig
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Re: I cut corners at every step, yet i never get contams [Re: Mad River]
    #8699171 - 07/29/08 07:53 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

SPOT ON BROTHER!!!


--------------------
My father started me on this hobby over 30 years ago...I ask  beginner's questions whenever they occur to me...Usually to stir the pot and get people's thoughts...When I post a REPLY...IT SHOULD NOT BE ACCEPTED AS GOSPEL TRUTH...It's just what I THINK...

PEACE ALL!!!

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