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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Ferris]
    #8597469 - 07/05/08 01:36 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

buckwheat said:
driving? have you been to Italy? i mean lol i can't believe you are blaming driving on race, amazing that you are so obsessed with race.





I haven't been to Italy, but I've been to the Netherlands, Belgium and France.
My point was that in my city, the safeness among drivers varies widely by race.
But if you really can't argue with my points, then feel free to drop out of the conversation.  If you'd like a longer response to one of your points from me, then please tell me which and I will do more than "brush it off with a single sentence".

Quote:

Ferris said:
Aside from the quite obvious socioeconomic arguments (which you have far from overcome, and will not be able to), there's still the issue that race is really just an artificial construct.  You can maybe make arguments against particular genes and I'd be forced to listen to you, or possibly blood types, but since race is just a social figment of the imagination, your whole argument is moot.




Race is not an artificial construct.  Humanity is divided among races by where those races developed around the world.
How is my argument moot?
There is wide variety among the races of the world.  What about that tribe of africans that all have two toes?  What about pygmies?  Are these differences social figments of the imagination?
Different races developed different strengths and weaknesses as they evolved around the world.  Is it so hard to believe that these strengths and differences go beyond hereditary diseases and blood types?

Traits vary widely among breeds of dog; I don't see much difference among breeds of humans.
Some breeds of dog are more intelligent than others, some breeds of human are more intelligent than others.
Some breeds of dog are more violence prone than others, some breeds of humans are more violence prone than others.


--------------------
My name is Mud

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Offlineanyone420
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Ferris]
    #8597474 - 07/05/08 01:38 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Your discriminating based on a melanin count in someones skin.

Aide from that, what do you propose as a end result to your ideals?  Kill all black people to create a superior human race?

Yeah....


Theres individuals.  And that's it. 



perrriiiyyyuddd


--------------------
for all y’all niggaz out there that be puffin shit
when the music go on, y’all listen to this alright

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Ferris]
    #8597475 - 07/05/08 01:39 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Also, I was referring to SAT scores, not IQ.
But, as you can see, there is a difference in the graph you provided, even though it looks like you just made it in paint.

In the chart, you can see IQ for white children exceeds the average of 100 in the 4th decile.
Black children only meet the average IQ in the tenth decile.


--------------------
My name is Mud

Edited by DragonChaser (07/05/08 01:44 PM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: anyone420]
    #8597482 - 07/05/08 01:42 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

anyone420 said:
Your discriminating based on a melanin count in someones skin.

Aide from that, what do you propose as a end result to your ideals?  Kill all black people to create a superior human race?

Yeah....


Theres individuals.  And that's it. 



perrriiiyyyuddd




Genetic differences go beyond melanin counts.
Thats like saying all breeds of dog are the same, except for their coat color and body shape.  Obviously, breeds have different temperaments, intelligence levels, senses of sight/smell, etc.
Scientists still don't understand what most of our gene code does.  You can't make the claim that the only difference is melanin count.

And I never mentioned killing all the black people to create a superior human race.
But I would like to sterilize all the stupid people (regardless of race).


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Offlinehoopershroomer
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Ferris]
    #8597485 - 07/05/08 01:44 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

For the record, I am an African....

"The art of being wise is the art of knowing what to overlook" -William James


--------------------
"Life lived in the absence of the psychedelic experience that primordial shamanism is based on is life trivialized, life denied, life enslaved to the ego."

"You teach the world how to treat you, by showing the world how you treat yourself."

A well developed sense of humor is far superior to any religion"

"Everything you could want and could be, you already have and are."

:peace: & :heart:

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: hoopershroomer]
    #8597491 - 07/05/08 01:45 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Then I'll overlook it for you.

And for the record, I am of Jewish and Native American descent.


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My name is Mud

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InvisibleFerris
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597496 - 07/05/08 01:47 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Humanity is divided among races by where those races developed around the world




Explain to me how that's not an arbitrary determination that was convenient to regulate social interaction, as opposed to a scientific construct.  You're thinking of genes, of which the only one all black people have in common are those regulating melatonin, as Anyone pointed out (and even then, there are different genes that come to this result, so you have to nitpick further).  There are other genes of course that could be the culprit (the one that leaves a large percentage of black people vulnerable to sickle cell anemia for instance).

The SAT is decidedly more biased than IQ tests even are.  They admit to this openly and rationalize this by claiming that universities themselves are biased in the way they teach and they are simply trying to find people that are geared towards that specific environment.  In my opinion this is a valid argument.  You're assumption that SATs are somehow equated to actual intelligence (under most rational, non-biased definitions), is completely invalid.


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Discuss Politics

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Ferris]
    #8597518 - 07/05/08 02:00 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Ferris said:
Quote:

Humanity is divided among races by where those races developed around the world




Explain to me how that's not an arbitrary determination that was convenient to regulate social interaction, as opposed to a scientific construct.  You're thinking of genes, of which the only one all black people have in common are those regulating melatonin, as Anyone pointed out (and even then, there are different genes that come to this result, so you have to nitpick further).  There are other genes of course that could be the culprit (the one that leaves a large percentage of black people vulnerable to sickle cell anemia for instance).





I believe you meant melanin.  Melatonin is a hormone important in the regulation of circadian rhythms, while melanin is a pigment in our skin.
I wasn't referring to ALL black people.  For example, aborigines of Australia are actually more closely related to Europeans than to Africans, I believe.  Which was my point- races are divided among where they evolved in the world.  The aborigines of Aussie land, while black, are not African "blacks".
On the "arbitrary determination to regulate social interaction instead of a scientific construct"... do you deny that subspecies of tigers are different than their other subspecies?  African tigers, Indian tigers and Chinese tigers are all different species, but they are still tigers, with (obvious) different traits, which show up both in their physical appearance and genetic code.
Perhaps I'm missing your point though, I just went for a jog, I've been a little sick for the past few days and I'm a little hung over from last night, and the heat didn't help much.
If I did completely miss your point, please propose it again, and after showering I will try to address it with greater clarity.

Quote:

Ferris said:
The SAT is decidedly more biased than IQ tests even are.  They admit to this openly and rationalize this by claiming that universities themselves are biased in the way they teach and they are simply trying to find people that are geared towards that specific environment.  In my opinion this is a valid argument.  You're assumption that SATs are somehow equated to actual intelligence (under most rational, non-biased definitions), is completely invalid.



I really think the only reason they "admit" to it being "biased" is because minority groups were bitching about their performance on the SATs.  If they really want equality, instead of special treatment, they should just beef up their SAT skills with something more mentally stimulating than BET or (c)rap music.
I believe that SATs are indeed equated to actual intelligence.  All the people I knew in high school who I considered to be intelligent (based on my interaction and conversations with them, not their academic performance) did superbly on the SATs.  The people I considered morons or airheads, also based on my interaction with them, did poorly.
You have to keep in mind that since I went to a high school with a graduating class of 70 I knew everyone, and was able to evaluate them on a personal level, and then compare my evaluations with their SAT scores, and I found a definitive link between intelligence and their scores.


EDIT-
I want to make it clear that I don't judge a person when I meet them based solely on their skin color.  I have a couple friends who are black or half black, and they are all well educated, well spoken, quick thinking individuals.
But for the most part, my experiences with blacks as a whole have been rather disappointing.  When I go into a theater and I hear cell phones blasting hip hop out of their shitty little speakers, and black people cracking up and yelling across the theater, I know I'm not going to get to watch a movie in peace.
When I get cut off 4 times out of 5 by a black person, I start to learn that the next time I get cut off, well, 4 times out of 5 it will be a black person cutting me off.
When I worked in a restaurant and all the servers hated serving tables of blacks, because they never got good tips, that told me something.  When I started waiting tables myself, and started getting the shaft every time I had a black table, no matter how many people there were or how nice or cool I was to them, or if I got them to laugh, and I still got shafted, well, that tells me something.
There's being fair and then there's learning from personal experience.
Maybe all of you have had vastly different experiences with blacks than I, or most of the people I know, have had.  Maybe its just black people on the east coast.
People are shitty everywhere, but certain races have certain qualities if you just keep your eyes open.  Jews and Asians are shrewd businessmen.  Whites are generally stuck up and a little pompous and closed minded.  Blacks are generally more laid back, but loud and inconsiderate as well.


--------------------
My name is Mud

Edited by DragonChaser (07/05/08 02:09 PM)

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Offlineanyone420
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597527 - 07/05/08 02:04 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

minority groups that watch BET need to be sterilized?

Your brain is huge ?


--------------------
for all y’all niggaz out there that be puffin shit
when the music go on, y’all listen to this alright

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Offlinehoopershroomer
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: hoopershroomer]
    #8597529 - 07/05/08 02:06 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

and dragon chaser can suck my dick.

stop trying so hard to defend your 'claims' and prove yourself, nobody fucking cares. I can clearly see all of this evidence and proof and hooplaa you have are just underlying means and motives you have to express your disguised racist disposistion. Not to mention every new rebuttal you make just makes you even more annoying and disdainful.

I would just like to say, Fuck Dragon Chaser and anyone like him. And thank you 420


--------------------
"Life lived in the absence of the psychedelic experience that primordial shamanism is based on is life trivialized, life denied, life enslaved to the ego."

"You teach the world how to treat you, by showing the world how you treat yourself."

A well developed sense of humor is far superior to any religion"

"Everything you could want and could be, you already have and are."

:peace: & :heart:

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: hoopershroomer]
    #8597547 - 07/05/08 02:13 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

anyone420 said:
minority groups that watch BET need to be sterilized?

Your brain is huge ?




I said stupid people need to be sterilized, regardless of race.  I know plenty of whites I'd like to see sterilized.

Quote:

hoopershroomer said:
and dragon chaser can suck my dick.

stop trying so hard to defend your 'claims' and prove yourself, nobody fucking cares. I can clearly see all of this evidence and proof and hooplaa you have are just underlying means and motives you have to express your disguised racist disposistion. Not to mention every new rebuttal you make just makes you even more annoying and disdainful.

I would just like to say, Fuck Dragon Chaser and anyone like him. And thank you 420




Since you had to bust out the vulgarity, I think your avatar is dumb, and stereotypical.
You're like the Catholics of the middle ages, I can provide endless miles of proof that the world is round, but you still keep insisting that it's flat.
As for "evidence and proof and hooplaa you have are just underlying means and motives you have to express your disguised racist disposistion"- until I was 18 I firmly believed that the races were equal.  This is because I went to private schools, where there were probably 5 black people in each school I went to.  They were all well spoken, polite and intelligent.
When I got out into the real world, I realized that reality is much different than my high schools, and changed my opinions of the races based on personal experience.  Anyone who doens't learn from personal experience is a fool.
You haven't disproven any of my claims, but you have instead directly insulted me, which raises your intelligence into question.  Keep it civil, this is the pub.


--------------------
My name is Mud

Edited by DragonChaser (07/05/08 02:16 PM)

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InvisibleYrtlzmo
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. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597553 - 07/05/08 02:14 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Yrtlzmo (02/03/13 10:48 AM)

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InvisibleYrtlzmo
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. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597561 - 07/05/08 02:16 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Yrtlzmo (02/03/13 10:47 AM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Yrtlzmo]
    #8597563 - 07/05/08 02:17 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Yrtlzmo said:
Quote:

DragonChaser said:
I said stupid people need to be sterilized, regardless of race.  I know plenty of whites I'd like to see sterilized.





I used to think this exact same thing... when I was 17. Get out in the real world, travel, talk to people you never would normally and eventually I think you'll stop thinking like this.




Being out in the real world is what taught me that people need to be sterilized.
Traveling Europe, hanging out in rich white suburbs in America, hanging out in trailer parks and the ghetto, in seedy bars and classy restaurants, taught me there are people in all levels of society that could use a good sterilization procedure.

I want to make it clear that I don't judge a person when I meet them based solely on their skin color.  I have a couple friends who are black or half black, and they are all well educated, well spoken, quick thinking individuals.
But for the most part, my experiences with blacks as a whole have been rather disappointing.  When I go into a theater and I hear cell phones blasting hip hop out of their shitty little speakers, and black people cracking up and yelling across the theater, I know I'm not going to get to watch a movie in peace.
When I get cut off 4 times out of 5 by a black person, I start to learn that the next time I get cut off, well, 4 times out of 5 it will be a black person cutting me off.
When I worked in a restaurant and all the servers hated serving tables of blacks, because they never got good tips, that told me something.  When I started waiting tables myself, and started getting the shaft every time I had a black table, no matter how many people there were or how nice or cool I was to them, or if I got them to laugh, and I still got shafted, well, that tells me something.
There's being fair and then there's learning from personal experience.
Maybe all of you have had vastly different experiences with blacks than I, or most of the people I know, have had.  Maybe its just black people on the east coast.
People are shitty everywhere, but certain races have certain qualities if you just keep your eyes open.  Jews and Asians are shrewd businessmen.  Whites are generally stuck up and a little pompous and closed minded.  Blacks are generally more laid back, but loud and inconsiderate as well.


--------------------
My name is Mud

Edited by DragonChaser (07/05/08 02:21 PM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Yrtlzmo]
    #8597569 - 07/05/08 02:20 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Yrtlzmo said: Anyway the other forms of intelligence were creative, problem solving, and then book smart/scientifically smart, I think they might have had common sense in there as well but it was a while back I just remember they had about 6 people that displayed different types of intelligence and tested them.





I guess I always just lumped those all together to form "intelligence".
My mother was an artist as well as a businesswoman and my father was a nuclear scientist (literally), so I guess I got the best of both worlds.
But when I judge people, I don't just look at book smarts.  Creativity and problem solving is there as well.  Since I was raised in an environment rich in all of them, I tend to judge people on all of those areas.


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Offlineanyone420
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597573 - 07/05/08 02:20 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Keep it civil?

Funny.. i don't think arbitrarily selecting groups to be inferior, advocating sterilizing people based upon some silly test, and making ridiculously bigoted generalizations to be civil at all. 

In fact, it's quite the opposite.


Now what race am I? 

Can you use your geographic and socioeconomic trends to find out what i am, or do i need to take a test or somethin? 


See, there was this guy named hitler... You might get along with him or somethin, i dunno.


--------------------
for all y’all niggaz out there that be puffin shit
when the music go on, y’all listen to this alright

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InvisibleYrtlzmo
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. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597580 - 07/05/08 02:23 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Yrtlzmo (02/03/13 02:43 PM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: anyone420]
    #8597581 - 07/05/08 02:23 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

anyone420 said:
Keep it civil?

Funny.. i don't think arbitrating selecting groups to be inferior, advocating sterilizing people based upon some silly test, and making ridiculously bigoted generalizations to be civil at all. 

In fact, it's quite the opposite.


Now what race am I? 

Can you use your geographic and socioeconomic trends to find out what i am, or do i need to take a test or somethin? 


See, there was this guy named hitler... You might get along with him or somethin, i dunno.




Where did I say that any one race was inferior?  I may have said less book smart, or more violence prone, but that doesn't automatically mean inferior.
I was keeping it civil by not name calling.  All I'm doing is pointing out that races are different, which, if you can't see that, you're blind.
And I wouldn't get along with Hitler mainly because I don't advocate killing entire groups of people based on race.
I advocate sterilizations based on intelligence.

EDIT- and I think you mean "arbitrarily selecting".  But there's nothing arbitrary about my selections.  They're all based on extensive personal experience, the experience of my friends and family, and studies that I've read.


--------------------
My name is Mud

Edited by DragonChaser (07/05/08 02:26 PM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: Yrtlzmo]
    #8597582 - 07/05/08 02:24 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Yrtlzmo said:
Hmm, see instead of thinking all those people should be sterilized I felt for their situation, but we're clearly quite different. I'd like to make the argument that they're necessary to society, but as soon as we have robots to replace them and their menial jobs they're gonna be fucked.




I felt for their situations too- until I saw how their kids were being raised.  And then I felt for the kids more, and realized the world would be better off if people like their parents got the old snip-snip.


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Offlineanyone420
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Re: I don't speak rap... [Re: DragonChaser]
    #8597586 - 07/05/08 02:25 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Hey man, your either against the initiation of force every time, or your not.  It's pretty simple.

Your no better than hitler really... Just birds of a feather

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