Home | Community | Message Board


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #8562238 - 06/25/08 11:52 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Quote:

Senor_Hongos said:
86 percent of convicted child molesters who molested boys describe themselves as homosexual or bisexual.




This is a very sad topic, but this sentence is fortunately quite funny.

Males that molest other males are usually homosexual or bisexual - OMG surprise!




:lol:

I thought that one was too obvious to address.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #8562255 - 06/25/08 11:56 AM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

It is just so hard to get a straightforward answer to my reasonable queries




I feel your pain, brother. :heart:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCrasher
αἱρετίζω
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 6,220
Loc: Tardy to the Party
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8562777 - 06/25/08 01:56 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

What I don't understand is what you hope to accomplish here? 




Even more puzzling is the folks that know I am a broken record and yet still wander in to counter my lame arguments with even lamer counter-arguments.

:rofl2:




So your counter argument to the post is to ignore everyone's perspective and continue on with negative inflammatory comments?

I didn't see a single reply regarding a baseless accusation that religious people commit as many as, if not more, unmoral acts than non-religious people.


--------------------
Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...

Edited by Crasher (06/25/08 05:39 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAsante
Omnicyclion prophet
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,296
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #8562804 - 06/25/08 02:04 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I thought most people who molested boys were lesbians :confused:

That said, child molestation is a crime of violence. It is up for debate whether a pedophiliac act can even be described as heterosexual or homosexual, as the motives often tend to be violent in nature, expressing themselves sexually, rather than sexual acts accompanied with violence. This is hotly debated on all forms of rape by the way.

Evidence would be prison sex - otherwise straight makes in jail who take their frustrations out on other men, then after release continue a heterosexual lifestyle.

Its not sex as an act of love, of fondness of, but as anb act of aggression, in case of pedophiles directed at a helpless target, like muggers who only mug the elderly.






I for one like to see the crime statistics of believers vs nonbelievers also.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here

Edited by Asante (06/25/08 02:09 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Crasher]
    #8562957 - 06/25/08 02:49 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Crasher said:
I didn't see a single reply regarding a baseless accusation that religious people commit more unmoral acts than non-religious people.




No one claimed this.  :confused:  OC said that religious folks do not commit fewer immoral acts than non-religious folks.  Presumably, the religious dictates by which they live would cause them to commit fewer immoral acts, yet the prison population does not reflect this difference.  :shrug:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAsante
Omnicyclion prophet
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,296
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8562993 - 06/25/08 02:59 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Presumably, the religious dictates by which they live would cause them to commit fewer immoral acts, yet the prison population does not reflect this difference.





Have you a source for this? And ofcourse of people who were religious before the offense, not ten-to-lifers who became saints in jail :smile:


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Asante]
    #8563020 - 06/25/08 03:06 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Lets take a look.

Teen pregnancy out of wedlook is considered immoral by most western religions.

Teens rarely get pregnant in prison.

The highest rates of teen pregancy occur in the most religious areas of the country.

Do the math.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRoseM
Devil's Advocate
Female User Gallery


Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 22,518
Loc: Mod not God Flag
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Asante]
    #8563062 - 06/25/08 03:16 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I would love to see a source citing either position.

I recall the teenage pregnancy study but can't find it on this damn iPhone.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Asante]
    #8563076 - 06/25/08 03:20 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Criminals are polled as to their religious affiliation upon entry into prison, and all the major religions are well-represented.  I'll see if I can find links, but common sense indicates that, of the 2 million people in jail and prison, many of them are religious.  Consider the percentages of the U.S. population--if 1 out of 130 people in the U.S. are in jail or prison, what are the odds that they are all non-religious?

Much info here: http://moses.creighton.edu/jrs/2005/2005-11.html

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCrasher
αἱρετίζω
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 6,220
Loc: Tardy to the Party
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8563623 - 06/25/08 05:42 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
Criminals are polled as to their religious affiliation upon entry into prison, and all the major religions are well-represented.  I'll see if I can find links, but common sense indicates that, of the 2 million people in jail and prison, many of them are religious.  Consider the percentages of the U.S. population--if 1 out of 130 people in the U.S. are in jail or prison, what are the odds that they are all non-religious?

Much info here: http://moses.creighton.edu/jrs/2005/2005-11.html




Many of them state a religious affiliation, which may or may not make someone religious. Many catholics I've encountered claim to be so, and follow about 0% of their affiliated practices.

Now, if the basis for this thread was purely affiliation, it would be an entirely different matter, IMO.


--------------------
Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Crasher]
    #8563634 - 06/25/08 05:45 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

I think that the lack of application of their beliefs is exactly the point here.  If we are only allowed to examine the behavior of those few religious believers who practice what they preach, the data will be skewed.  Besides, we might not be able to contact all three people whom we would need to survey.  :smirk:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
Spore Print Collector
 User Gallery


Registered: 05/25/08
Posts: 13,018
Loc: Registered: 6/04/02
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8563642 - 06/25/08 05:48 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

And how many "found God" between committing the crime and the sentencing?  I'm sure someone going into prison is going to admit they are a hardcore, unrepentant atheist because they really, really think that will help them get early parole.  :rolleyes:

And, the quote I offered earlier shows why the OP's reasoning is flawed.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #8563657 - 06/25/08 05:53 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

There is no way to know what their religious affiliation was prior to committing the crime.  However, the # of people in prison is a LARGE chunk of the population of one of the most religious countries in the world.  Don't you think it is likely that religious folks commit just as many crimes as non-religious folks?  I agree with the author of your quote that religious beliefs have little or nothing to do with ethical behavior, but this is NOT what the religious folks claim.  If being religious is supposed to improve your behavior, why are so many people in the U.S. committing crimes?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibledaytripper23
?
Male

Registered: 06/22/05
Posts: 3,595
Loc: Flag
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8563666 - 06/25/08 05:54 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Got to love statistics.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8563679 - 06/25/08 05:58 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Besides, we might not be able to contact all three people whom we would need to survey.




:rimshot:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleCrasher
αἱρετίζω
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/13/01
Posts: 6,220
Loc: Tardy to the Party
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8563773 - 06/25/08 06:20 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

If being religious is supposed to improve your behavior, why are so many people in the U.S. committing crimes?




because affiliation is not belief. Many people  only pay lip service, but I believe that that says more about their agenda than anything about religion , or true followers.


--------------------
Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Veritas]
    #8563882 - 06/25/08 06:58 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

if 1 out of 130 people in the U.S. are in jail or prison

It's up to 1 out of every 100 and a big fraction are harmless potheads and such who just wanna be left alone.

The Associated Press link where I first read this is gone, sorry, but if you google around, you can probably find the source article and others that back this:

--

NEW YORK (AP) — For the first time in U.S. history, more than one of every 100 adults is in jail or prison, according to a new report documenting America's rank as the world's No. 1 incarcerator. It urges states to curtail corrections spending by placing fewer low-risk offenders behind bars.

Using state-by-state data, the report says 2,319,258 Americans were in jail or prison at the start of 2008 — one out of every 99.1 adults. Whether per capita or in raw numbers, it's more than any other nation.

The report, released Thursday by the Pew Center on the States, said the 50 states spent more than $49 billion on corrections last year, up from less than $11 billion 20 years earlier. The rate of increase for prison costs was six times greater than for higher education spending, the report said.

The steadily growing inmate population "is saddling cash-strapped states with soaring costs they can ill afford and failing to have a clear impact either on recidivism or overall crime," the report said.

Susan Urahn, managing director of the Pew Center on the States, said budget woes are pressuring many states to consider new, cost-saving corrections policies that might have been shunned in the recent past for fear of appearing soft on crime.

"We're seeing more and more states being creative because of tight budgets," she said in an interview. "They want to be tough on crime. They want to be a law-and-order state. But they also want to save money, and they want to be effective."

The report cited Kansas and Texas as states that have acted decisively to slow the growth of their inmate population. They are making greater use of community supervision for low-risk offenders and employing sanctions other than reimprisonment for offenders who commit technical violations of parole and probation rules.

"The new approach, born of bipartisan leadership, is allowing the two states to ensure they have enough prison beds for violent offenders while helping less dangerous lawbreakers become productive, taxpaying citizens," the report said.

While many state governments have shown bipartisan interest in curbing prison growth, there also are persistent calls to proceed cautiously.

"We need to be smarter," said David Muhlhausen, a criminal justice expert with the conservative Heritage Foundation. "We're not incarcerating all the people who commit serious crimes. But we're also probably incarcerating people who don't need to be."

According to the report, the inmate population increased last year in 36 states and the federal prison system.

The largest percentage increase — 12 percent — was in Kentucky, where Gov. Steve Beshear highlighted the cost of corrections in his budget speech last month. He noted that the state's crime rate had increased only about 3 percent in the past 30 years, while the state's inmate population has increased by 600 percent.

The report was compiled by the Pew Center's Public Safety Performance Project, which is working with 13 states on developing programs to divert offenders from prison without jeopardizing public safety.

"Getting tough on criminals has gotten tough on taxpayers," said the project's director, Adam Gelb.

According to the report, the average annual cost per prisoner was $23,876, with Rhode Island spending the most ($44,860) and Louisiana the least ($13,009). It said California — which faces a $16 billion budget shortfall — spent $8.8 billion on corrections last year, while Texas, which has slightly more inmates, was a distant second with spending of $3.3 billion.

On average, states spend 6.8 percent of their general fund dollars on corrections, the report said. Oregon had the highest spending rate, at 10.9 percent; Alabama the lowest at 2.6 percent.

Four states — Vermont, Michigan, Oregon and Connecticut — now spend more on corrections than they do on higher education, the report said.

"These sad facts reflect a very distorted set of national priorities," said Sen. Bernie Sanders, an independent from Vermont, referring to the full report. "Perhaps, if we adequately invested in our children and in education, kids who now grow up to be criminals could become productive workers and taxpayers."

The report said prison growth and higher incarceration rates do not reflect an increase in the nation's overall population. Instead, it said, more people are behind bars mainly because of tough sentencing measures, such as "three-strikes" laws, that result in longer prison stays.

"For some groups, the incarceration numbers are especially startling," the report said. "While one in 30 men between the ages of 20 and 34 is behind bars, for black males in that age group the figure is one in nine."

The racial disparity for women also is stark. One of every 355 white women aged 35 to 39 is behind bars, compared with one of every 100 black women in that age group.

The nationwide figures, as of Jan. 1, include 1,596,127 people in state and federal prisons and 723,131 in local jails. That's out of almost 230 million American adults.

The report said the United States incarcerates more people than any other nation, far ahead of more populous China with 1.5 million people behind bars. It said the U.S. also is the leader in inmates per capita (750 per 100,000 people), ahead of Russia (628 per 100,000) and other former Soviet bloc nations which round out the Top 10.

The U.S. also is among the world leaders in capital punishment. According to Amnesty International, its 53 executions in 2006 were exceeded only by China, Iran, Pakistan, Iraq and Sudan.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Diploid]
    #8563934 - 06/25/08 07:12 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

BTW, in keeping with the theme of this thread, realize that many (most?) religious people are anti-marijuana and help keep prohibition laws on the books that maintain the US's planet wide per-capita incarceration record.

I wonder what would Jesus do if he saw me smoking a joint? Throw me in a government cage or leave me alone?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Diploid]
    #8563989 - 06/25/08 07:24 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Jesus was the original hippie. He would be bogarting that joint BIG time. :spliff:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleblewmeanie
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc: Flag
Re: The Generic Religion Bashing thread [Re: Diploid]
    #8564001 - 06/25/08 07:27 PM (15 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
BTW, in keeping with the theme of this thread, realize that many (most?) religious people are anti-marijuana and help keep prohibition laws on the books that maintain the US's planet wide per-capita incarceration record.

I wonder what would Jesus do if he saw me smoking a joint? Throw me in a government cage or leave me alone?



Im pretty sure it would go down like this...




--------------------
The Prophecy!

Learn To Code

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Genetics and Homosexuality------I don't think so
( 1 2 3 4 all )
chemkid 9,680 78 07/29/02 03:45 PM
by chemkid
* A thought on religion
( 1 2 3 all )
Druginduced 5,193 47 12/24/03 08:25 AM
by fireworks_god
* Homosexuality and The Bible
( 1 2 3 all )
RebelSteve33 6,119 45 09/09/02 11:33 AM
by Zahid
* homosexuality
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 all )
ribbit 9,288 105 01/16/03 02:44 AM
by TeTr0
* philosiphy of religion
( 1 2 3 4 all )
aluminum_can 9,889 77 08/10/01 03:58 AM
by Zen Peddler
* Comparing religions ChillyShed 825 7 12/22/03 10:37 PM
by Swami
* organized religion= loss of appreciation 1stimer 806 3 09/15/02 07:19 PM
by Anonymous
* Importance of Genetic Homosexuality
( 1 2 3 all )
chemkid 4,935 55 12/21/02 03:39 AM
by nubious

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
4,415 topic views. 0 members, 7 guests and 34 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.027 seconds spending 0.006 seconds on 16 queries.