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OfflineFunkBuddha
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any Revolutionaries here?
    #8548132 - 06/21/08 05:29 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I know I've seen several Ron Paul supporters posting here and I'm sure I'll get flamed for even mentioning the name, but are any of you going to the march in D.C. on July 12th?

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8548236 - 06/21/08 06:01 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I thought this was about revolution, not ron paul support, I'll pipe down now

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OfflineFunkBuddha
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8548284 - 06/21/08 06:14 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
I thought this was about revolution, not ron paul support, I'll pipe down now




You may get your wish.

Peaceful or violent, I've got a gut feeling one will be  coming soon.

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8548333 - 06/21/08 06:27 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Most of my gut feelings are followed by the release of copious amounts of shit.  I see you are similarly afflicted.


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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8548472 - 06/21/08 07:03 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
Peaceful or violent, I've got a gut feeling one will be  coming soon.



There isn't a chance in hell. Seriously.

You don't even know 1/10th of what the feds have up their sleeve, now add the military and Blackwater and Erik Prince associates and you have one hell of a fight on your hands, good luck with all that shit.


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8548516 - 06/21/08 07:17 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
I know I've seen several Ron Paul supporters posting here and I'm sure I'll get flamed for even mentioning the name, but are any of you going to the march in D.C. on July 12th?




If I was in the area I'd probably go to the march.

I was/am a ron paul supporter and voted for him.

I'll prolly vote Barr for president despite the concerns of some, given his statements about his past, I'm comfortable with him.

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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8548557 - 06/21/08 07:36 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

common sense lately has been revolutionary...

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OfflineFunkBuddha
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: johnm214]
    #8549982 - 06/22/08 06:47 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I had some problems with Barr too, but I'm over it. The man says he has seen the light and I have no reason not to believe him. He certainly defends the positions well.

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OfflineFunkBuddha
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550006 - 06/22/08 07:11 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Chemy said:
Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
Peaceful or violent, I've got a gut feeling one will be  coming soon.



There isn't a chance in hell. Seriously.

You don't even know 1/10th of what the feds have up their sleeve, now add the military and Blackwater and Erik Prince associates and you have one hell of a fight on your hands, good luck with all that shit.




Revolutions don't have to be fought with guns. A revolution can also be a a change in thought.

Remember what Sam Adams said. "It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds."

And your statement above isn't true. Al Qaeda nd the Iraqi resistance seem to be giving our mighty military all sorts of problems. Not to mention the fact that collateral damage involving United States citizens would be hard to downplay in the media.

Then you have to convince the military and the contractors to fire upon U.S. citizens. I'm sure this wouldn't be impossible, but it would be a hurdle.

I'm certainly not advocating violence by any means, but revolution is possible. The battle has to be for the hearts and minds of the populace. Once that fight is won the mighty military and the contractors would be useless.

My goal for now is to plant the seeds of Liberty in the minds of as many people as possible before this place ends up being more of a Police State. It's not easy though. Too many people have been polarized. They don't realize that both major parties are working against them.

My job is to awaken the Remnant .

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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8550267 - 06/22/08 10:18 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
Remember what Sam Adams said. "It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds."




That quote is from a time when the Government and the people were armed with the same exact muzzle loading weapons, a very level playing field, that saying does not apply between a bunch of couch potato (or in your case) lean hippy, weekend warrior militiamen and the modern US Government.

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
And your statement above isn't true. Al Qaeda nd the Iraqi resistance seem to be giving our mighty military all sorts of problems. Not to mention the fact that collateral damage involving United States citizens would be hard to downplay in the media.




You're comparing an American militia with Al-Qaeda!!!! :lol: Good for you for completing the first step that the US Government would paint American revolutionaries as American Al-Qaeda, to get the public all riled up to fight against the American revolutionaries.

And your statement comparing Al-Qaeda to American militias is so flawed I don't know where to begin.

  • Al-Qaeda is an international terrorist organization.
  • Al-Qaeda has cooperation from Muslim countries.
  • Al-Qeada has resources in the area of hundreds of millions of dollars and arms and explosives from militaries.
  • Al-Qaeda operates with training that was originally provided by the CIA, they are very hard to infiltrate, observe and destroy.



Quote:

FunkBuddha said:

Then you have to convince the military and the contractors to fire upon U.S. citizens. I'm sure this wouldn't be impossible, but it would be a hurdle.




That would be sooooooooooooo easy, so very easy.
The President would just hold a press conference labeling the militiamen as "terrorists" and maybe even make a beheading or execution video with a sheep victim, or even better a young Christian child, and have the CIA certify the video is from the militia or revolutionaries, and there you go, then most citizens and military are ready to kill your ass for being on the wrong side.

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
I'm certainly not advocating violence by any means, but revolution is possible. The battle has to be for the hearts and minds of the populace. Once that fight is won the mighty military and the contractors would be useless.




Every militia or armed citizen group is heavily infiltrated by the feds, and the splinter groups are watched, if a revolution pops off the militiamen would be given surrender or die orders and none of this standoff nonsense would apply.

The militias really are nothing more than weekend warriors, they shoot at targets once week to once a month while wearing their fatigues, they read the poor mans james bond and learn how to make pipe bombs or AN-FO, if they actually make any they get busted since they're all heavily infiltrated, The BATFE just destroyed (last week) a bunch of homemade explosives seized from the Michigan militia.





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Edited by Chemy (06/22/08 10:38 AM)

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550440 - 06/22/08 11:54 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

not all of the retired/inactive military is employed by
'security' firms, there are many that are involved with these
firma as well as the american military that will not take up
arms against the pupulation of the US in a time of civil unrest,
many more that will defect and take their equipment with them,
if you believe the military/government/blackwater has not been
infiltrated, you are mistaken

answer this question, if you as an american service man are told
to fire on a group of civilians in your home town, would you
follow that order, would you gun down your friends, neighbors 
and family because you were ordered to do so?

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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8550511 - 06/22/08 12:23 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
answer this question, if you as an american service man are told
to fire on a group of civilians in your home town, would you
follow that order, would you gun down your friends, neighbors 
and family because you were ordered to do so?




Quote:

press conference labeling the militiamen as "terrorists" and maybe even make a beheading or execution video with a sheep victim, or even better a young Christian child, and have the CIA certify the video is from the militia or revolutionaries, and there you go, then most citizens and military are ready to kill your ass for being on the wrong side.




Would the feds/military/private contractors fire on civi's??
Read up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco_Siege

The Ministry of Truth has their propaganda machine well tuned, damn well. How many sheep are there (civi's and military) compared to the "freedom fighters"?

Just because I am smart enough to see through propaganda, does not mean the 200 million* servicemen, private contractors and citizens that are sheep would not follow direct orders to eliminate any threats.

*Pulled that figure out of my ass

Anyway, I've been hearing of militiamen talking smack about how the manure is going to hit a jet engine for a decade, and the constant threat of revolution has been discussed for long before I was even born. When is it going to happen? Never.

If the feds have the militias so well infiltrated, then guess what, the feds know exactly who is in the military that would become a traitor, so in times of civil unrest, those militiamen in Blackwater and the Military would find themselves dead or in a brig, or maybe even "questioned" at GitMo or a secret facility in Afganistan.


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God bless you all and I hope you receive the help you need to turn away from your lives of sin.

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550542 - 06/22/08 12:35 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Chemy said:
Would the feds/military/private contractors fire on civi's??
Read up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco_Siege





hahaha, I'm pretty well versed in these incidents


Quote:

The Ministry of Truth has their propaganda machine well tuned, damn well. How many sheep are there (civi's and military) compared to the "freedom fighters"?




it's easy when it's the evil islamic fundies, it's a little more
difficult when it's your own flesh and blood, the very people
you grew up with, your best friend from second grade. this is
the reason the government needs these security contractors,
because they know much of the military is going to stand down




Quote:

If the feds have the militias so well infiltrated, then guess what, the feds know exactly who is in the military that would become a traitor





these arent militiamen holding these positions, they're ordinary
citizens with no ties to these groups, many dismiss them the
same way any of the rest of us would. they are the same men and
women that are fighting in Iraq today


why cant you give John Q Soldier credit for being able to think for himself?

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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550552 - 06/22/08 12:40 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Here's a lineup:

Revolutionaries:
  • Militiamen that target shoot on weekends while wearing BDU's to increase the "ambience" of being a soldier.
  • Former and active duty military (a handful)
  • Hippies that are of no use in a firefight (the enemies life has value, I can not harm him)
  • Gangsters that would kill and loot anything in sight, that have no perception of actions and consequences (useless cocksuckers).


Now the Government:
  • Army, Army Rangers, Army Special Forces
  • DOJ agencies: FBI, BATFE and DEA
  • Marines, Marine Recon
  • Navy Seals
  • Blackwater
  • Local Police and SRT teams
  • County Sheriffs Offices and SRT teams
  • State Police and SRT teams


Shooting family or members of the community would only apply if they do not surrender, or in some cases like a no knock warrant someone would just be eliminated if they pose a threat to life or limb.


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God bless you all and I hope you receive the help you need to turn away from your lives of sin.

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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8550557 - 06/22/08 12:42 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
why cant you give John Q Soldier credit for being able to think for himself?



I've met hundreds if not a thousand Jarheads, maybe that's my malfunction:shrug:


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God bless you all and I hope you receive the help you need to turn away from your lives of sin.

Mushrooms and drugs make you gay, you can reverse this homosexual condition with rehab, get help! Stop being gay!

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550578 - 06/22/08 12:49 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Chemy said:
Here's a lineup:

Revolutionaries:
  • Militiamen that target shoot on weekends while wearing BDU's to increase the "ambience" of being a soldier.
  • Former and active duty military (a handful) in fact quite a large handful, possibly as man as are currently serving in the armed forces now, possibly even more, many of whom have served in Special Forces, Marine Recon, The Navy Seals, etc...
  • Hippies that are of no use in a firefight (the enemies life has value, I can not harm him)
  • Gangsters that would kill and loot anything in sight, that have no perception of actions and consequences (useless cocksuckers).many of whom are serving in active or inactive capacities in the military
  • Army, Army Rangers, Army Special Forces
  • DOJ agencies: FBI, BATFE and DEA
  • Marines, Marine Recon
  • Navy Seals
  • Blackwater
  • Local Police and SRT teams
  • County Sheriffs Offices and SRT teams
  • State Police and SRT teams


Now the Government:
  • Army, Army Rangers, Army Special Forces
  • DOJ agencies: FBI, BATFE and DEA
  • Marines, Marine Recon
  • Navy Seals
  • Blackwater
  • Local Police and SRT teams
  • County Sheriffs Offices and SRT teams
  • State Police and SRT teams






corrected to portray a little more accuracy

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OfflineFunkBuddha
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8550738 - 06/22/08 01:44 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Well shit, my last post must have ended up in the bit bucket. Oh well, I'll just retype my point.

All throughout history, revolutions have been fought and won. Both peaceful and violent. Some take longer than others, but the revolutionaries always win eventually.

It just takes brave people standing up and putting a stop to it and when people are kicked around long enough, they will. I'm not talking about weekend warrior militia types. I'm talking about your average Joe with a wife and kids who realizes that his children's future is at stake.

The trick to revolution isn't getting people pissed enough. That's the easy part. People don't have to agree on what they want, they just have to agree on what they don't want. The tricky part is filling the vacuum that is created when one government is replaced with another.

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Invisibleelbisivni
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8550742 - 06/22/08 01:46 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
The man says he has seen the light and I have no reason not to believe him.



1) He's a politician.
2) What is this light and where can I find it?


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8550749 - 06/22/08 01:48 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

The American people are not the least bit interested in your bullshit and will shoot you down themselves.  The notion that a cadre of disaffected misfits and malcontents is even remotely indicative of the will of the great majority of Americans is borderline psychotic.  By which I mean you have not only constructed a castle in the sky, you have moved in.


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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8550755 - 06/22/08 01:50 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
All throughout history, revolutions have been fought and won. Both peaceful and violent. Some take longer than others, but the revolutionaries always win eventually.




Can you name a peaceful revolution? I can't think of one to save my life.

I'm not trying to argue, I know what your goal is, and I agree with your goal, and if you intend to achieve this goal peacefully then more power to you.:super:


--------------------
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God bless you all and I hope you receive the help you need to turn away from your lives of sin.

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550765 - 06/22/08 01:53 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

The sexual revolution was almost entirely peaceful.  There remain some small group of assholes shooting up abortion clinics and providers but they are no greater in number than the random psychokiller.

Also, the collapse of the Soviet Union was quite peaceful.  Until Putin, anyway.


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OfflineFunkBuddha
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8550860 - 06/22/08 02:35 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

A quick google search....

1948 - India/Pakistan (liberation from British Empire)
1973 - Thailand (the "October Rising")
1974 - Portugal (the Carnation revolution)
1981-1989 - Poland (Solidarity)
1986 - Filipinos (the People-power or Yellow revolution)
1987-1989 - Estonia-Lithuania-Latvia (the Singing Revolution or Baltic Way)
1989 - Czechoslovakia (the Velvet revolution)
1989 - Bulgaria
1989-1990 - East Germany
2000 - Yugoslavia (the Bulldozer revolution)
2003 - Georgia (the Rose revolution)
2004 - Ukraine (the Orange revolution)
2005 - Lebanon (the Cedar revolution)

I don't recognize half of them.

Before any revolution can happen we need a change in thought. It's not bad enough yet.

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8553174 - 06/23/08 04:55 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
A quick google search....

1948 - India/Pakistan (liberation from British Empire)





pakistan wasnt founded peacefully

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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: FunkBuddha]
    #8553534 - 06/23/08 08:12 AM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I'm so glad Ron Paul got voted out early. "The tyranny of the minority".

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InvisibleCrasher
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8554558 - 06/23/08 02:02 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

Chemy said:
Here's a lineup:

Revolutionaries:
  • Militiamen that target shoot on weekends while wearing BDU's to increase the "ambience" of being a soldier.
  • Former and active duty military (a handful) in fact quite a large handful, possibly as man as are currently serving in the armed forces now, possibly even more, many of whom have served in Special Forces, Marine Recon, The Navy Seals, etc...
  • Hippies that are of no use in a firefight (the enemies life has value, I can not harm him)
  • Gangsters that would kill and loot anything in sight, that have no perception of actions and consequences (useless cocksuckers).many of whom are serving in active or inactive capacities in the military
  • Army, Army Rangers, Army Special Forces
  • DOJ agencies: FBI, BATFE and DEA
  • Marines, Marine Recon
  • Navy Seals
  • Blackwater
  • Local Police and SRT teams
  • County Sheriffs Offices and SRT teams
  • State Police and SRT teams


Now the Government:
  • Army, Army Rangers, Army Special Forces
  • DOJ agencies: FBI, BATFE and DEA
  • Marines, Marine Recon
  • Navy Seals
  • Blackwater
  • Local Police and SRT teams
  • County Sheriffs Offices and SRT teams
  • State Police and SRT teams






corrected to portray a little more accuracy




Much more accurate.

You don't attack the military, you harass the infrastructure. An American revolution wouldn't last an hour if you were trying to set up ambushes.

But if you were disabling cargo cranes at major ports and sections of pipeline that span the country....

I just wish "revolutionaries" actually looked past the flowery images of an overthrown oppressor and saw the very real horror of at least a decade of surviving like an animal to accomplish it.


--------------------
Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...

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OfflineChemy
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Crasher]
    #8554609 - 06/23/08 02:21 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Crasher said:

Much more accurate.

You don't attack the military, you harass the infrastructure. An American revolution wouldn't last an hour if you were trying to set up ambushes.

But if you were disabling cargo cranes at major ports and sections of pipeline that span the country....

I just wish "revolutionaries" actually looked past the flowery images of an overthrown oppressor and saw the very real horror of at least a decade of surviving like an animal to accomplish it.



No armed revolution can succeed without disabling the military structure.

You are talking about insurgency operations, how effective is insurgency? I know that you know first hand insurgency is ineffective and insurgency in America would be doomed before it even began.

Ok, here's my last point, a revolution can not be initiated without organization of revolutionaries, the formation of such an organization can not happen without FBI infiltration and CIA and NSA surveillance.

Even if the revolutionaries were smart enough to form a central organization and cells where the lower level members and cells have no direct knowledge of the central unit or other cells, this revolution would still be doomed to be an epic failure, IMHO.


--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous

Narcotics Anonymous

Get help, help is free and available 24/7/365.

God bless you all and I hope you receive the help you need to turn away from your lives of sin.

Mushrooms and drugs make you gay, you can reverse this homosexual condition with rehab, get help! Stop being gay!

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InvisibleCrasher
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8555703 - 06/23/08 07:18 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

You are talking about insurgency operations, how effective is insurgency? I know that you know first hand insurgency is ineffective and insurgency in America would be doomed before it even began.





Insurgency can be effective. Look at what USSF did in Afghanistan before it became a prolonged conventional military affair. A suitcase of money, a couple dozen green berets, and a pissed off population. Magic.

Look at Iraq. Several countries are basically financing the insurgency (despite the doubts of some shroomerites) while the US provides training to Iraqi Army and Police forces that are heavily infiltrated by Badr, Sadr, Dawa, etc.

A US insurgency, while I agree, would fail in reality, could hold out by the same dissent within the military ranks that Iraq is experiencing.

If anything, we'd see a coup d'etat from a very angry military after certain conflicts are abandoned. No one wants another emasculated military like the Clinton Era military. 


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Give me silence, water, hope;
Give me struggle, iron, volcanoes...

Edited by Crasher (06/23/08 07:21 PM)

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Invisiblehamandcheese
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #8555958 - 06/23/08 08:22 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:

FunkBuddha said:
A quick google search....

1948 - India/Pakistan (liberation from British Empire)





pakistan wasnt founded peacefully




pakistans secussion from india wasn't peaceful... however when india peacefully seceded from british rule pakistan was a part of it.

i just find this funny tho... Indian/Pakistan  agreed  in their hatred of british rule enough to peacefully break free but as soon as an arguement over religion came about they imedately turned to violence. Ain't that grand.


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Crasher]
    #8556314 - 06/23/08 09:53 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

But if you were disabling cargo cranes at major ports and sections of pipeline that span the country....





Absolutely, why bother attacking the military/defense apparatus when you could simply deprive the enemy of his finance/security.

Take MEND organization who uses oil bunkering to generate huge profits to hire out "cults" and gangs to attack. The insurgency is completely open source, while one group is hired on monday to cut a oil pipeline, they hire another on tuesday to kidnap a foreign worker. Its the future of warfare.

Also, partial systems vs complete systems disruption, its much more effective to keep a state in a partial system of destruction because the nation state has to pour funds in to finance the system.

In theory this is how it would work. The Minutemen have been mustered to stop immigration in the porous mexican border, they are not accountable in any way to the federal government and lack almost complete judicial oversight, with many in law enforcement and the military also joing the paramilitary. Increasing drug violence from Mexico slowly leaks into the border areas, and the area erupts into a low intensity war, sparked by assassinations, carbombs, kidnappings, murders and not to mention the huge financial framework that employs said "thugs" to ensure their supply lines are problem free.

The blackmarket makes billions a year, and the ones who orchestrate it, have the money and power to back up and protect their supply lines. The violence in Mexico will eventually be exported to america, as drug cartels and paramilitary vigilantes, and governments battle to control the lucrative supply lines that run across the US border.

This is in my opinion is the only way you'll see a insurgency in the US in the future.

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Offlineanarchist1776
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Re: any Revolutionaries here? [Re: Chemy]
    #8559575 - 06/24/08 07:11 PM (15 years, 8 months ago)

I haven't given any thought to attending the march.  Maybe I should look into that.


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Alex

"The difference between free-market capitalism and state capitalism is precisely the difference between, on the one hand, peaceful, voluntary exchange, and on the other, violent expropriation" (Murray N. Rothbard, 1973).

"The market is not a jumble of distorted and unrelated events.  Instead, it is a highly complex but orderly and efficient mechanism which provides a means for each person to realize the maximum possible value and satisfaction commensurate with his abilities and resources" (Linda & Morris Tannehill, 1970).

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