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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work
    #823975 - 08/17/02 03:20 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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InvisibleRebelSteve33
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #823994 - 08/17/02 03:27 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

I've never read any of his work, but it seems that you have made some really great realizations from reading it!


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Namaste.

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Anonymous

Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824020 - 08/17/02 03:39 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

I have read Be Here Now and The Only Dance there Is.

Some of it was good and some of it wasn't.

Cheers,

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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: ]
    #824026 - 08/17/02 03:41 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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InvisibleRevelation

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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824077 - 08/17/02 04:00 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

I absolutely love Be Here Now. The first time I read it was also the first time I took MDMA (actually second..but this was the first time I felt it). What a profound thing. It was like it all came together and I just felt it align.

As I was reading it, I realized that I already knew exactly what he was talking about. And that has stuck with me. I don't know how much of it I would have comprehended had I not been rolling. Because that's what MDMA is...Being Here Now. I've given it to people to read and they just haven't understood it at all...they didn't take anything out of it. They just weren't on that level...

"Conscioussness Equals

Energy=

Love=

Awareness=

Light=

Wisdom=

Beauty=

Truth=

Purity.

It's all the SAME trip.

It's all the SAME

Any trip you want to take

leads to the SAME place"


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OfflineTraveller
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824255 - 08/17/02 05:09 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

BE HERE NOW is a great book! i haven't read any of the others. i think i'd like to walk around Tokyo with Ram Dass. where does he hang out these days?

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824367 - 08/17/02 05:55 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

Let's talk about how after some 40 years of meditation and study to increase his awareness, he went into total denial after his stroke. He lay on the floor paralyzed for something like 12 hours and kept telling himself that he could get up any time that he wanted, he just didn't want to...


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Anonymous

Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824376 - 08/17/02 05:58 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

^^^^^ As the swamster said. That's one thing.

Cheers,

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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Swami]
    #824541 - 08/17/02 07:13 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

he went into total denial

Sounds like more swami nonsense to me. I think you'd better read "Still here". People in "total denial" don't tend to write books about their experience of having a stroke and facing death.

Lets see how you fare when you have a stroke swami.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Xlea321]
    #824746 - 08/17/02 11:46 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

As per usual, you have it wrong. Ram Dass admitted exactly that in his book "Still Here". Reread it.

And as per usual, you go off on a tangent. How I may or may not fare after a stroke is totally irrelevant to Ram Dass' denial.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Swami]
    #824759 - 08/18/02 12:11 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

From the book "Still Here"

"As I got up to answer the phone, my leg gave way under me and I fell to the floor. In my mind, the fall was still part of my "old-man fantasy." I didn't realize that my leg was no longer working because I'd had a stroke.

I reached for my phone, on the table near my bed. "R.D.? Are you there?"; I heard the voice of an old friend in Santa Fe. When I didn't respond coherently, he asked, "Are you sick?"; I suppose I still didn't answer, so he said, "If you can't speak, tap on the phone. Tap once for yes and twice for no." When he asked whether I wanted help, I tapped "no" over and over again.

When he asked whether I wanted help, I tapped "no" over and over again.

When he asked whether I wanted help, I tapped "no" over and over again.

When he asked whether I wanted help, I tapped "no" over and over again.

When he asked whether I wanted help, I tapped "no" over and over again."


Gee, no denial there! Sounds like he is still trapped by the ego just like the rest of "us".




--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #824762 - 08/18/02 12:22 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

I've read(many years agao) Be here now, Grist for the Mill, The Only Dance there is and The Meditator's handbook. They all had their place and relevnce in my life at one point.


--------------------
"Being crazier than a shithouse rat is not sufficient grounds for banishment"


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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #824860 - 08/18/02 03:05 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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OfflineTypingwords
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #824861 - 08/18/02 03:09 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

"Journey to Awakening" (the meditator's handbook) is the best book I've read on meditating. IN fact it's one of the best books I've ever read. Even if you already know how to meditate I would still reccomend reading it.

His brief period of denial doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the way he lives his daily life. YOur mind is probably all fucked up after something like that, and you could fall back into the ego's trap. Flashes of enlightenment can occur, and so can the opposite. why do you find that reason to believe he's full of shit and his whole life is a lie?


--------------------
everything everyone everywhere.
forever and ever

Edited by Typingwords (08/18/02 03:14 AM)

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Typingwords]
    #824892 - 08/18/02 04:08 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

You responded to Freak, but sounds like you are responding to my post.

why do you find that reason to believe he's full of shit and his whole life is a lie?
That is a powerfully inaccurate assessment of what I said. Why do you find the need to create words that were never spoken and then attack these imaginary words?

My statement stands alone without embellishment. To summarily rephrase: denial and awareness cannot co-exist in the same moment. His lifetime of meditation left him insufficiently prepared to "Be Here Now" during that crisis.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Anonymous

Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Swami]
    #825031 - 08/18/02 06:38 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

Exactomundo.

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InvisibleXlea321
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Swami]
    #825157 - 08/18/02 08:00 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

As per usual, you have it wrong. Ram Dass admitted exactly that in his book "Still Here". Reread it.

What a truly childish view of "attaining awareness" you have. Do you think that when you have worked on "attaining awareness" you won't feel frightened when you collapse with a stroke?

What is your point?


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Anonymous

Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Xlea321]
    #825197 - 08/18/02 08:09 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

As per ususual....

What a truly childish view of "attaining awareness" you have.

Why are these comments necessary to the discourse?

They add little to the substance and some may think them detracting.

Cheers,

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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: Xlea321]
    #825238 - 08/18/02 08:24 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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Anonymous

Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #825267 - 08/18/02 08:37 AM (21 years, 9 months ago)

I think Ram uses the Living Bible so the doctrines you alluded to do not apply to him.

I'm a KJV man myself. j/k

Cheers,

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #825654 - 08/18/02 12:36 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

OK, you can borrow my 'Still Here,' but you have to return my 'Grist for the Mill' first.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #825706 - 08/18/02 01:01 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #825740 - 08/18/02 01:17 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

Ram Dass,who comes from a Conservative Jewish family devoid of spirituality, experienced Something Primal under psychedelics, and set out for India in search of someone who could tell him what 'It all meant.' Although claiming to have been drawn by the simplicity of Buddhism, he was most influenced by Neem Karolie Baba, a Hindu Yogi - a believer in God, in a Hindu tradition - who was described in BE HERE NOW as living in Sahaj Samadhi...in full awareness of Sat Chit Ananda, and therefore in God-Realization.

Ram Dass in NOT a Christian, but he understands that Hinduism absorbs all faiths into itself, and there is more than enough room for Jesus, although He is not the ONLY avatar of God. He may be the only avatar to appear in the midst of middle-eastern culture, but He is not the ONLY avatar ever to appear on this planet. Perhaps you ought to take this idea as a springboard into the notion that on OTHER WORLDS in this and other galaxies, God's Logos - His ONLY Begotten Son - may be silicon based. He may not be Humanoid. If you deny the probability of life on planets in 100 billion galaxies, each with 100 billion stars, around which are innumerable planets like ours (Nitrogen/Oxygen atmosphere Captain - class M planet)...then you are far worse off than any pre-Copernican astronomer who never knew that we were a tiny speck in a medium sized galaxy to begin with.

Time to climb out of that teenie-weensie little conceptual box that you have constructed around yourself; painted with Bible stories alone; without the Gilgamesh Epic and other precursors that gave rise to it. Time to become a truly catholic (i.e., universal) Man, free from the very particularities of the culture that birthed you. People walk on water in other cultures too. They are 'born of a virgin' in other cultures too.

When I was in the 2nd grade, I had a REVELATION. When the new girl, Nancy Simko, who moved to my street was asked by our attractive Jackie Kennedy-looking teacher, Miss Sword, what her address was, she said "10 Dorrien Road." I sat upright, thinking "No!...'I' live at 4 Dorien Road!" It was never clear to me that other people ALSO had numbers in front of their addresses. I thought that my family was SPECIAL because we had a number in front of our address on Dorrien Road. It stupidly escaped me that the Holahans were at 3 Dorrien Road, and the Sandows were at 12 Dorrien Road, etc. Other people have THEIR saviors, and their saviors are salvific for THEM! If you can't understand this it is ONLY because of EGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGOEGO.Can you hear the echo in the emptiness of a Heart that rejects the hope of countless billions of human beings who have never heard of Jesus?


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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InvisibleWorld Spirit
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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #826322 - 08/18/02 04:20 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

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Re: Let's talk about Ram Dass and his work [Re: World Spirit]
    #826651 - 08/18/02 06:23 PM (21 years, 9 months ago)

Nowhere in my post did I 'rate' avatars. Who am I to may such an evaluation anyway? I have, however, chosen to call myself a Christian, because in Christ I have found everything that I discovered in the teachings of the other avatars, and I am, after all, a Western man. I will not judge the history of the world. That is reserved for God alone - the Creator, Redeemer and Destroyer.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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