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Cracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper
Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 8,808
Loc: Swamp
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Everybody needs to take these classes!
#8213866 - 03/30/08 10:27 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Physics, Biology and Organic Chemistry.... maybe a genetics course too. In that order. Maybe organic could be swapped before biology.
Physics and Organic have helped further my understand of life so much more than any book I've read.
I know this is a ridiculous claim, but at the basis of everything, we're just electricity breaking and forming bonds, undergoing conformation changes, these conformations changes alter our susceptibility to newer, never before seen/noticed "things" in life. It's wild. We act and interact with each other and a majority of the time don't even recognize it. We're no different from the periodic table having different affinities to other elements/molecules/people.
The whole anthropomorphic aspect of science is downright ridiculous. It's a shame for people to not recognize the beauty in the dance that our microscopic tenants partake in. Seriously, it's ridiculous. It makes me want to cry. And I know what's his name made a thread about throwing away everything even your text books, but ya know, I feel like I have to get an overview of the beauty of this *insert most beautiful adjective you can think of* Life. Life shouldn't been a 4 letter word for all that is intertwined within/around/amongst it.
-------------------- The best way to live is to be like water For water benefits all things and goes against none of them It provides for all people and even cleanses those places a man is loath to go In this way it is just like Tao ~Daodejing
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deranger
Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 6,840
Loc: off the wall
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8214353 - 03/30/08 12:34 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I've always wanted to take a few courses in these areas (except physics), just to get a general idea of it all. Neurobiology and cognitive neuroscience would be interesting too
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,009
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: deranger]
#8214653 - 03/30/08 01:43 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I think if I had to do it over I would take engineering, strength of materials and steel fabrication. and I would have taken fine art - steel sculpture perhaps and I think I would have been creative in those dimensions.
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Cracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper
Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 8,808
Loc: Swamp
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: deranger]
#8214675 - 03/30/08 01:48 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
SyntheticMInd said: I've always wanted to take a few courses in these areas (except physics), just to get a general idea of it all. Neurobiology and cognitive neuroscience would be interesting too
Ya know, I dreaded physics and now, while I still dread it, physics has explained EVERYTHING. Physics is the bridge between, "this happens because this comes before it."
Neurobiology/biology, chemistry... LIFE is PHYSICS.
Without physics, we'd just be memorizing bullshit and not knowing how to explain "how" things happen.
neurobiology would be based on quantum physics so either way you'd have to face what everything is using/doing.
-------------------- The best way to live is to be like water For water benefits all things and goes against none of them It provides for all people and even cleanses those places a man is loath to go In this way it is just like Tao ~Daodejing
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deranger
Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 6,840
Loc: off the wall
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8214723 - 03/30/08 01:56 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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yeah you're right, I guess it would bind everything together in a way. just the thought of it doesn't sound too appealing, it wasn't too fun in high school either. but sure it does have its place, and not everything that's important is fun
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NiamhNyx
I'm NOT a 'he'
Registered: 09/01/02
Posts: 3,198
Last seen: 14 years, 9 months
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8216299 - 03/30/08 08:25 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I'm thinking about taking one class this summer, intro biology, because they're running it 3 days a week instead of the usual 5 and there are two sections to get done if I ever wanna get into the good stuff like botany!
I'm more of an arts/social science kind of student, but I would really like to have some natural science in there as well.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8216717 - 03/30/08 09:30 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Cracka_X said: Physics, Biology and Organic Chemistry.... maybe a genetics course too. In that order. Maybe organic could be swapped before biology.
Physics and Organic have helped further my understand of life so much more than any book I've read.
I know this is a ridiculous claim, but at the basis of everything, we're just electricity breaking and forming bonds, undergoing conformation changes, these conformations changes alter our susceptibility to newer, never before seen/noticed "things" in life. It's wild. We act and interact with each other and a majority of the time don't even recognize it. We're no different from the periodic table having different affinities to other elements/molecules/people.
The whole anthropomorphic aspect of science is downright ridiculous. It's a shame for people to not recognize the beauty in the dance that our microscopic tenants partake in. Seriously, it's ridiculous. It makes me want to cry. And I know what's his name made a thread about throwing away everything even your text books, but ya know, I feel like I have to get an overview of the beauty of this *insert most beautiful adjective you can think of* Life. Life shouldn't been a 4 letter word for all that is intertwined within/around/amongst it.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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ChiefGreenLeaf
Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 1,596
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8219860 - 03/31/08 02:57 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Those are my favorite subjects! along with psychology...
Edited by ChiefGreenLeaf (03/31/08 02:58 PM)
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8220733 - 03/31/08 05:43 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes! I would add anatomy, Earth science, physical anthropology & World History to that list. Studying these subjects not only feeds a sense of wonder, but also helps one develop a sense of perspective.
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backfromthedead
Activated
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Veritas]
#8220742 - 03/31/08 05:45 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Psychoacoustics??
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flangenips
Batshitinsanse
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Posts: 1,520
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: backfromthedead]
#8220835 - 03/31/08 06:01 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Biology is quite fun to learn. More specifically i really wish i took the beginners biology course so i could've done mycology at level 2 and Ethnobotany at level 2 as side papers. From what i've heard those are two awesome subjects. Though the begginers biology is a whole year paper that is apparently really boring. Physics and Quantum Physics is also great to read, but i only enjoy it in layman's thinking, not too big on all the math involved.
-------------------- All are lunatics, but he who can analyze his delusions is called a philosopher. - Ambrose Bierce
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Ginseng1
Elegant Universe
Registered: 09/02/04
Posts: 3,310
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: flangenips]
#8220930 - 03/31/08 06:17 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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grade 10 geography.
-------------------- Flowing through beginningless time since time without beginning...
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vigilant_mind
unfazed
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8220969 - 03/31/08 06:22 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Take philosophy.
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NiamhNyx
I'm NOT a 'he'
Registered: 09/01/02
Posts: 3,198
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Veritas]
#8221840 - 03/31/08 09:21 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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While we're at it, I'd like to add cultural anthropology and archaeology to the list as well...
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backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: NiamhNyx]
#8221858 - 03/31/08 09:24 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Basic electronics.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: backfromthedead]
#8221868 - 03/31/08 09:27 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
backfromthedead said: Psychoacoustics??
Sound waves that kill people indiscriminately and have no remorse?
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backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#8221949 - 03/31/08 09:40 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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mmm??
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
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Posts: 24,855
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8223262 - 04/01/08 07:16 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Everyone should take kindergarten finger-painting classes too.
-------------------- If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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backfromthedead
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: fireworks_god]
#8223837 - 04/01/08 11:08 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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And learn 'hot cross buns' on the recorder.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
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Posts: 45,441
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: backfromthedead]
#8224775 - 04/01/08 03:34 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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This one?
*cue hip hop beat*
Lock your doors Hide your daughters! Cuz Swami's been drinking That ole firewater.
Ooh, ain't she wicked, Aint she fine? Don't she blow your little mind?
Curly hair, Baby blues Long, lean legs High-heel shoes.
Hot cross buns Maple syrup Skin-tight jeans Straight from Europe.
Come closer.
Come closer!
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Edited by OrgoneConclusion (04/02/08 07:38 PM)
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backfromthedead
Activated
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#8225386 - 04/01/08 05:27 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Log in to view attachment
Sounds like a new hit single. Now pass the firewater.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: backfromthedead]
#8225441 - 04/01/08 05:42 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I joke a lot and I know you probably won't believe this being April 1 and all, but I (a white hippie)recorded that song I wrote back in 1979. Yes, it was the first ever RAP song recorded (because I can't sing a note) done long before anything hit the airwaves. It was supposed to be a single, but never got released.
I would upload, but the cassette is just about unplayable.
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backfromthedead
Activated
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#8225509 - 04/01/08 06:05 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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That'd be a fun listen.
I wanna do the rest of the lyrics, that was fun.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#8225583 - 04/01/08 06:23 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
It was supposed to be a single, but never got released.
The world must not have been ready for it. Then or now.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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backfromthedead
Activated
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: LunarEclipse]
#8225649 - 04/01/08 06:36 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,009
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8229962 - 04/02/08 06:23 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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hey neurobiology is not based upon quantum physics. regular physics chemistry and biology are involved, not quantum physics
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: LunarEclipse]
#8230273 - 04/02/08 07:35 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Low blow.
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: redgreenvines]
#8230363 - 04/02/08 07:57 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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But chemical bonding relies on the principles of quantum physics. :smartass:
edit - BTW, I have taken those classes, and I loved them
Edited by Qubit (04/02/08 07:58 PM)
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Cracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper
Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 8,808
Loc: Swamp
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: DieCommie]
#8232103 - 04/03/08 02:45 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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thank you, DieCommie
Quote:
hey neurobiology is not based upon quantum physics. regular physics chemistry and biology are involved, not quantum physics
Ok ok ok, hey a lot of us don't know this or think about it but here we go...
chemistry is basically about the interactions of elements dubbed a name by they electron, proton, and neutron composition, right?
Electrons, protons, neutrons = atom
The basic building block of everything is... = atom
very general, beginning physics is more along the lines of newtonian or classical(I think they're the same.. maybe not? correct me if wrong) physics where objects interact on large scale. ok atoms... tightly compacted... crystal lattices... whatever... It's a much more tangible physics
More advanced physics deals with electronics OR WAIT WHAT?.... electrons, protons, and neutrons and their effects and properties known as of now. but not very complete and it's more a matter of "this does this just because" (probably not, but I'm in physics without calculus so all I'm given is equations.. i know, i'm depriving myself and probably should've taken with calc. )
NOW QUANTUM PHYSICS THE STUDY OF SUBATOMIC PARTICLES. WHICH ARE Protons Neutrons Electrons
Then protons and neutrons are apparently composed of quarks and I just lose it! there's a lot more but I don't know much more in depth than that... and maybe a tidbit about neutrinos.
So by this simple deduction, QUANTUM MECHANICS IS EVERYTHING
oh, I'm sorry, biology. So you have protein synthesis and get a protein strand... This strand undergoes folding based on balancing its charges. (oh baby, everything is related can't you feel it!)
okok, Ion channels? ooo what're these ions... Ca+ or Ca++ and K+ and whatever else. Hormone receptors. G-protein receptors!! CYCLIC AMP!!!! Signal Transduction Cascade!!!!
ok, whew. So hopefully you come to find that these words ppl have for certain things, which seem to be a supercompilation of subatomic partciles are merely words. And that Protien Kinase 1 doesn't just activate Protein Kinase 2 JUST BECAUSE that's what it says in the book.... BUT... because their composition and, if you wanna go there, the flow of energy.
please tell me you feel me, because if not then you're gonna have to wait until I'm in grad school.
-------------------- The best way to live is to be like water For water benefits all things and goes against none of them It provides for all people and even cleanses those places a man is loath to go In this way it is just like Tao ~Daodejing
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: DieCommie]
#8232249 - 04/03/08 04:20 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
DieCommie said: But chemical bonding relies on the principles of quantum physics. :smartass:
:
how so?
Inorganic seems to be described as those magnetic balls you can buy, and organic is like a sticky balloon kinda..
Both are pretty explainable macroscopically, no?
I don't know a bunch about electron wave functions and such, but isn't quantum phys more smaller scale? You don't have much uncertainty w/ chemical bonding.. its all kinda kinetics and magnatism
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deimya
tofu and monocle
Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 825
Loc: ausländer.ch
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: Cracka_X]
#8232325 - 04/03/08 05:40 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Cracka_X said: very general, beginning physics is more along the lines of newtonian or classical(I think they're the same.. maybe not? correct me if wrong)
not exactly: newtonian physics is classical physics but the converse is not quite right. There was a couple of smart people after Newton like Lagrange, Laplace, Hamilton, Jacobi and others who supplemented newtonian mechanics with concepts of lagrangian, hamiltonian and the like, making life much more easy by dealing with everything in terms of energy. Yet it is equivalent, you can mostly do everything with Newton's three laws, yet sometimes it is much easier to use, say, Lagrangian mechanics to arrive at identical results.
Quote:
More advanced physics deals with electronics OR WAIT WHAT?.... electrons, protons, and neutrons and their effects and properties known as of now. but not very complete and it's more a matter of "this does this just because" (probably not, but I'm in physics without calculus so all I'm given is equations.. i know, i'm depriving myself and probably should've taken with calc. )
Applying quantum mechanics to subatomic particles, atoms, molecules or solids tell you pretty much why things behave the way they do. It is not hand waving, although you may be able to get some rough quantitative results with (good) hand waving arguments
Quote:
NOW QUANTUM PHYSICS THE STUDY OF SUBATOMIC PARTICLES. WHICH ARE Protons Neutrons Electrons
Then protons and neutrons are apparently composed of quarks and I just lose it! there's a lot more but I don't know much more in depth than that... and maybe a tidbit about neutrinos.
Yes, quantum mechanics apply to subatomic particles and the current model is called the Standard Model of particles. But it also apply as I said to atoms, molecules, light, and very much so to solids. Properties of metals, insulators and semiconductors for example are explained using quantum mechanics applied to atomic and electronic lattices. This belong to the field of solid state physics and condensed matter physics. But maybe you guessed, there are vast fields concerned with quantum optics, atomic and molecular physics, quantum chemistry, and they all use some form of conventional quantum mechanics. It is applicable from the very microscopic to the mesoscopic. And even to the macroscopic ! For example, white dwarf stars are understood to be stable only because of Pauli's exclusion principle which gives rise to an outward electronic degeneracy pressure. These are concepts used all over in solid state physics.
Quote:
So by this simple deduction, QUANTUM MECHANICS IS EVERYTHING
yes and no. Complex emergent laws often force us to abandon a microscopic description for a better suited set of rules adapted for a given scale. While we somehow know that at the core there's probably a viable microscopic description, most of the time we are unable to make the direct link between quantum mechanic and the phenomena we observe a few length scales above, or we do so by using rough approximations based on experimental observation and intuition about how we see things behaving rather than by raw mathematical grinding through the microscopic physical model.
Quote:
oh, I'm sorry, biology. So you have protein synthesis and get a protein strand... This strand undergoes folding based on balancing its charges. (oh baby, everything is related can't you feel it!)
okok, Ion channels? ooo what're these ions... Ca+ or Ca++ and K+ and whatever else. Hormone receptors. G-protein receptors!! CYCLIC AMP!!!! Signal Transduction Cascade!!!!
ok, whew. So hopefully you come to find that these words ppl have for certain things, which seem to be a supercompilation of subatomic partciles are merely words. And that Protien Kinase 1 doesn't just activate Protein Kinase 2 JUST BECAUSE that's what it says in the book.... BUT... because their composition and, if you wanna go there, the flow of energy.
please tell me you feel me, because if not then you're gonna have to wait until I'm in grad school.
It is true that at the beginning of my physics education I too had the feeling that everything could be explained with a microscopic physical description, giving some bachelor a false sense of superiority toward other disciplines, but as you progress you notice that all these promises of superior descriptive power are illusions, and surely you eventually come back down on earth. The explanatory gap across energy and length scales is particularly big in high energy physics, biology, chemistry of big molecules, etc. While I have hope that we'll eventually get there, I strongly advice against making presumptuous claims.
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deimya
tofu and monocle
Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 825
Loc: ausländer.ch
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: johnm214]
#8232343 - 04/03/08 05:54 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
johnm214 said:
Quote:
DieCommie said: But chemical bonding relies on the principles of quantum physics. :smartass:
:
how so?
Inorganic seems to be described as those magnetic balls you can buy, and organic is like a sticky balloon kinda..
Both are pretty explainable macroscopically, no?
I don't know a bunch about electron wave functions and such, but isn't quantum phys more smaller scale? You don't have much uncertainty w/ chemical bonding.. its all kinda kinetics and magnatism
You need quantum mechanics to explain why chemical bounding exists in the first place and why they behave the way they do. But once you have these results and under certain assumptions you can abandon the microscopic quantum description for a much more convenient set of rules at the scale of molecules, a set which on average works very nicely.
Indeed, because of temperature and of the very large quantity of molecules involved, chemical reactions take place in a very noisy environment, and so applying statistical physics to this system of molecules you end up with chemistry. No need to keep trace of entanglement and superposition anymore.
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perosiste
Overcomplicates shit for fun
Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 1,030
Last seen: 4 years, 5 months
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Re: Everybody needs to take these classes! [Re: backfromthedead]
#8232359 - 04/03/08 06:05 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I vote Logic
its hard to explain a damn thing without a logical argument
-------------------- Risk Management will be the downfall of western civilization
Edited by perosiste (04/03/08 06:11 AM)
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