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Offlinecokaznrebel
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jars not recovering from shake
    #8189953 - 03/25/08 12:17 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

So I inoculated 9 jars with a MS syringe about 3-4 weeks ago.

When I saw that the jars were about 30% I decided to shake them, which was recommended to me. After shaking 5 of the 9 jars, none of them have recovered. Each of them showed promising rhizomorphic growth before the shake. Since the shake, I can see the white kernels but they are dormant and not doing anything. Some of the rye kernals look wet near the top of the jars that i shook, but some also look wet in the ones that are almost done colonizing.

Tommorow im going to open one of the stalled shook jars and smell it for a contaminate.

The jars moisture content and sterile procedure was near perfect.

Is thier anything I can do to save these jars?

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8189964 - 03/25/08 12:22 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

most of the time when they dont recover from the shake its a bacteria problem.


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[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8189991 - 03/25/08 12:32 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

I thought it was a bacterial problem as well, it actually looks in spots to be bactilus wet spot.

I just wonder how it could have gotton there, since, before the shake they were beautiful looking.

Im thinking that when i shook it, a kernal hit the tyvek and brought a contaminate in from the it.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190014 - 03/25/08 12:44 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

too wet, and too hot, will usually do it.

do you incubate at all? how did your prep go?


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[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190020 - 03/25/08 12:46 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Psychoslut said:
too wet, and too hot, will usually do it.

do you incubate at all? how did your prep go?




I incubate in a TiT that is always hovering around 79-80 degrees.

It was around 83 for a week before i adjusted it down.

The jars were pre-made by a shroomery sponser (before i got my PC) so i would assume that the moisture content was perfect.

I inoculated through the silicon injection port inside of a glovebox, flame sterilizing between each jar.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190028 - 03/25/08 12:51 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

thats too hot. if you like to keep your house cool in the winter like i do (65-68) you might benefit from incubating somewhere around 72-75

i wouldn't go over 75. heat invites bacteria.


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[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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OfflineCryogenicz
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190033 - 03/25/08 12:55 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

How long has it been since the shake?

-Graham


--------------------
www.MycoPath.com
Mushroom Spawn, Cultures, Fungi Bags, Casings, Master Grain Jars, Bags for In-vitro, Laboratory supplies, and much more!
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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190041 - 03/25/08 12:57 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

People regularly incubate around 80 degrees, and get noticably faster growth.

Even if heat invites bacteria, how do they manage to get through the tyvek filter and into my jars?

My house typically hovers around 74-76, so yes I probably could take them out of the TiT, but I would not think that the temperature difference between outside the tub and inside the tub would be enough to invite bacteria inside my tub, yet alone inside my jars.

I also was thinking it could be the spore syringe, but im unsure of bacteria inside a SS. I ordered it from an old vender that is no longer one. I didnt know they werent a vendor until after i ordered it.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190052 - 03/25/08 01:00 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

meh, take it or leave it.

yur the one asking questions, remember? if you know whats going on than whats the point of this thread?


--------------------



[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Cryogenicz]
    #8190065 - 03/25/08 01:10 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Cryogenicz said:
How long has it been since the shake?

-Graham




2 days for some jars, 7-8 days for others. they all look the same, colonized kernels mixed with uncolonized kernels with some condensation inside the jars and some wet looking rye near the condensation.

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190067 - 03/25/08 01:11 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Psychoslut said:
meh, take it or leave it.

yur the one asking questions, remember? if you know whats going on than whats the point of this thread?




Im going to take your advice and ditch the TiT now thats its warmer around here.

Im still just baffled about how bacteria manages to get inside my jar.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190073 - 03/25/08 01:14 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

the jars don't exactly get 100% sterile. just sterile enough to let the mycel take a strong foothold before anything else.

high heat and too much moisture puts the ball in the bacterias court.


--------------------



[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Registered: 11/08/04
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190088 - 03/25/08 01:23 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Thanks for clarifying that, I was under the impression that the jars were indeed 100% sterile and that if you got a contaminate its usually in your sterile procedure.

Im going to give it a whirl and re-PC the jars and inoculate with 4-5 CC of fresh LC to replace any lost moisture. I know it probably wont work but i guess it will be my little experiment :smile:

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190099 - 03/25/08 01:28 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

did it look like somebody cummed in your jar before you shook it?

if it did its definately a bacteria problem. IMO moisture content and bacteria are newbies biggest challenges when it comes to grain jars. the temp range is usually pretty forgiving. IME 80 is too hot, but can work as long as moisture content is 100% perfect.

i like to keep my jars at a nice 75 degrees.


--------------------



[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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OfflineCryogenicz
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190105 - 03/25/08 01:32 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Jars are 100% sterile, the problem lies with your inoculation, not your jars. Bacteria originates from your inoculation.

-Graham


--------------------
www.MycoPath.com
Mushroom Spawn, Cultures, Fungi Bags, Casings, Master Grain Jars, Bags for In-vitro, Laboratory supplies, and much more!
Mushroom Supplies. Fast Turnaround Times. Great Service.
orders@mycopath.com
enter code shroomery for 10% off product.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Cryogenicz]
    #8190116 - 03/25/08 01:38 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

oh yeah. its been a little while since Ive done any growing.

i was mixing jar cultures and pasteurized subs. it is weird though how too much moisture almost always brings on a bacteria problem in jars.  :shrug:


--------------------



[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Psychoslut]
    #8190121 - 03/25/08 01:41 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

The jars looked great actually. The grains that werent colonized by the rhizomorphic myc was still loose and looked the same as the first day I recieved the jars in the mail. nothing cum like at all before the shake. Even now it doesnt look BAD, just a few soaked grains up top but otherwise it looks fine (besides the completly dormant myc)

Moisture content should have been perfect as it was premade, no clumping.

I dont think it was my inoculation technique because most people here dont even use a glove-box and I use one with an alcohol flame.

Im more thinking,
shit happens!
Im not going to know where it came from and will just continue to do what im doing.

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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190125 - 03/25/08 01:47 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

does the wetness at the top look thick or sticky in any way? if its just a lil too much water it should settle to the bottom.

if its bacteria it may not settle to the bottom.

oh well, like you said trial and error is what you need.


--------------------



[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]

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Offlineskattman1982
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: cokaznrebel]
    #8190557 - 03/25/08 08:02 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

cokaznrebel said:


Tommorow im going to open one of the stalled shook jars and smell it for a contaminate.





i'm going to recommend you don't do this...


--------------------
They lie about marijuana. Tell you pot-smoking makes you unmotivated. Lie! When you're high, you can do everything you normally do, just as well. You just realize that it's not worth the fucking effort. There is a difference.-Bill Hicks-

by the way, everything i write is for entertainment purposes and is purely fictional. do not construe these written words with the author having any knowledge of actual persons, places, events, or actions.

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OfflineDr. Penguin
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: skattman1982]
    #8190930 - 03/25/08 10:10 AM (16 years, 7 days ago)

Jars are 100% sterile. In fact I like to let my jars sit for a week or two after sterilization, just to make sure.

Try turning them upside down to drain out some CO2 and get them out of the incubator, maybe you can shock them into regrowth. It would be weird if all of the jars you shook got a bacterial contam and the others didn't... Did they?

I don't know if I would attribute this to bacteria just yet, don't open any jars, but give them a sniff through the filter, bacteria usually has a very strong oder, no problem smelling it through tyvek.

I just read where you said it could be a contam wicked through the tyvek, which is a defiantly possibility if the grain was damp enough to wet the tyvek.

Heres some karma for you, hope these didn't contam.


--------------------
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Offlinecokaznrebel
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Re: jars not recovering from shake [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #8191592 - 03/25/08 01:54 PM (16 years, 7 days ago)

I confirmed the presense of baculus when i went to turn the jar upside down to expel CO2.

I noticed that the grains looked slimy, and the ones that were pressed against the edge of the jar had a white line on the margin of the grain.

I ordered these jars from mycopath and assumed that they were sterile when they arrived. This bacterial growth was noticed about 3 weeks after initial multi-spore inoculation. My inoculation technique was sterile, so im considering that the point of infection was either a bunk syringe or the lack of a proper soak before pressure cooking from mycopath.

Can anyone tell me the probability that a spore syringe had bacterial endospores in it?

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