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 stcore
Stranger
Registered: 07/27/02
Posts: 16
Last seen: 22 years, 5 months
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 Best PF cake substrate ingredients? 
#816181 - 08/13/02 08:05 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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What's the deal? Why isn't there a consensus on the best formula for a cake substrates? I don't want to spend time figuring this stuff out.
For example, if rye berries work better than brown rice, use 100% rye berries. Next, if rye berries don't work as well as so-and-so birdseed, use 100% so-and-so birdseed.
What's the point of combining different well-known ingredients? Just find out the best, and use only all that. What gives people?
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Eightball
whore consumer
 
Registered: 07/21/01
Posts: 3,013
Last seen: 10 years, 6 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: stcore]
#816188 - 08/13/02 08:08 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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some people find using rye or birdseed more difficult than the pf tek. they also require a pressure cooker. if i were newb, i would follow the pf tek with a batch of jars then make another batch of pf tek jars and case them. but instead of using brown rice flour, i would use dark rye flour because it will produce more potent shrooms. good luck.
edit: also you said for cakes which means rye berries and birdseed are out of the question because they are used as substrate for casings and it will not fruit easily without a casing layer.
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If you're frightened of dying and you're holding on.you'll see devils tearing your life away.
But...if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels
Freeing you from the earth.
Edited by Eightball (08/13/02 08:10 PM)
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stwangetweezer
Phamily
Registered: 07/10/02
Posts: 82
Loc: Middde Earth
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: Eightball]
#816225 - 08/13/02 08:25 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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If i was using rye flour instead of BRF would i have to pressure cook more then 45 mins like say an hour and a half or would it be ok to pressure cook at 45 min.
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________________________________________
Everything in this post is ONE BIG LIE.
Holy shit Phish is back the boys have ended there hiatus this one of the greatest days of my life dreams do come true i have chills going down my spine time to go back on phish tour.
Phish will be playing:
madison square garden 12/31/02
hampton coliseum(THE MOTHER SHIP) 1/02/03 -1/04/03
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 mickey_rourke
Illegal Smile
Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 3,333
Loc: Playa del Carmen
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: stwangetweezer]
#816341 - 08/13/02 09:34 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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I believe you handle rye flour the same way you would BRF.
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"I tried to put it all behind me, but my redneck past is nipping at my heels.." -- Ben Folds Five
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lostinautumn7
Hooker With APenis
Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 120
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: Eightball]
#7735473 - 12/09/07 02:53 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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needing a casing layer for fuiting is a complete myth, it is benificial but not necassary, just wanted to clarify that in case someone who doesnt know came across this like my buddy did and it screwed him all up. thats what the dunk and roll is anyhow man. pseudo casing layer.
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"May your mycelia multiply and be fruitful."
- oxohawkoxo
the shroomery is one hell of a community, lots of good people here, and i am damn proud to be a part of it. thanks shroomery and all shroomerites. 
- lostinautumn7
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Nibin
Getting there
Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: lostinautumn7]
#7735585 - 12/09/07 06:35 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
lostinautumn7 said:
needing a casing layer for fuiting is a complete myth, it is benificial but not necassary, just wanted to clarify that in case someone who doesnt know came across this like my buddy did and it screwed him all up. thats what the dunk and roll is anyhow man. pseudo casing layer.
For PF cakes that is true, the same applies to poo, but uncased grain rarely fruits. With grain on it's own you need a casing layer.
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Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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Nibin
Getting there
Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 4,480
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: mickey_rourke]
#7735588 - 12/09/07 06:36 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
mickey_rourke said:
I believe you handle rye flour the same way you would BRF.
NO, you can just plain boil brf cakes but any other grain flour needs a pc.
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Newcomers guide-----> For all things shroomy
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure
Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: stcore]
#7735662 - 12/09/07 08:10 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
stcore said:
What's the point of combining different well-known ingredients? Just find out the best, and use only all that. What gives people?
You might think a T-bone steak is the best food, but try to survive on nothing but T-bone steaks. Mycelium, like humans, benefits from a balanced diet, and that means food from various sources. We're not so much trying to match nature, but to improve on it. You'll find a cow patty in a field with two or three mushrooms on it, but you'll find a cultivated tray with a hundred or more mushrooms on it.
If you want different ingredients to try, you can use rice bran instead of brf, and it will improve performance. You can substitute coffee grinds for all or part of the vermiculite. If growing wood loving species, you can substitute sawdust for all or part of the vermiculite. Experiment.
RR
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Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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nicechrisman
Interdimensional space wizard
Registered: 11/07/03
Posts: 33,241
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7735869 - 12/09/07 09:39 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've wondered about adding lime to my cake mix. Wouldn't it help balance the acidity, as it does in casings? Have you ever tried that RR?
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"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."
John C. Lily
  
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure
Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: nicechrisman]
#7735936 - 12/09/07 10:04 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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You don't want lime in a cake. Mushroom mycelium prefers an acidic substrate, and BRF is already close to neutral, as is verm. Adding lime would degrade performance by raising pH.
RR
--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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lostinautumn7
Hooker With APenis
Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 120
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: nicechrisman]
#7735970 - 12/09/07 10:18 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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I don't think the pf substrate really needs to be Ph balanced, unless you are adding something outside of the original mix, like coffee that is more acidic. Still, not really necessary, mushrooms even tend to like a slightly acidic substrate. Plus RR is the guy who grew on straight coffee grounds, and I don't know for sure but I don't even think he added any Ph buffers, you will never be able to touch that level of acidity. Mushrooms still did fine. In regards to maximizing yield, there are a ton of other additives that you should consider for this mix before lime.
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"May your mycelia multiply and be fruitful."
- oxohawkoxo
the shroomery is one hell of a community, lots of good people here, and i am damn proud to be a part of it. thanks shroomery and all shroomerites.
- lostinautumn7
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Goatfish
Dropped DShrooms
Registered: 08/08/07
Posts: 66
Last seen: 12 years, 1 month
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7735975 - 12/09/07 10:20 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Coffee and BRF does work well. I also noticed the colonization time decreased for me when I used this combination.
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The memories that now rest in this forest
Forever shadowing the sunrise of my heart
Wings leave their nest at my coming
Swaying away unto the cold glowing sky
Dreaming away for a while
My spirit sighs in peace
Gazing unto the stars
Please, take me there
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lostinautumn7
Hooker With APenis
Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 120
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7735984 - 12/09/07 10:22 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
You don't want lime in a cake. Mushroom mycelium prefers an acidic substrate, and BRF is already close to neutral, as is verm. Adding lime would degrade performance by raising pH.
RR
wow, that post wasnt there when i started replying. you are too quick for me RR. as always 
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"May your mycelia multiply and be fruitful."
- oxohawkoxo
the shroomery is one hell of a community, lots of good people here, and i am damn proud to be a part of it. thanks shroomery and all shroomerites.
- lostinautumn7
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AncientBeing
Local Shaman
Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 247
Last seen: 16 years, 4 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7736122 - 12/09/07 11:00 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
You don't want lime in a cake. Mushroom mycelium prefers an acidic substrate, and BRF is already close to neutral, as is verm. Adding lime would degrade performance by raising pH.
RR
But don't you use a pinch of lime per cup of rye?
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"If you have not love you have nothing"
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lostinautumn7
Hooker With APenis
Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 120
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: AncientBeing]
#7736141 - 12/09/07 11:05 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
AncientBeing said:
Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
You don't want lime in a cake. Mushroom mycelium prefers an acidic substrate, and BRF is already close to neutral, as is verm. Adding lime would degrade performance by raising pH.
RR
But don't you use a pinch of lime per cup of rye?
yes, but as we already covered above, grains are not ideal for cakes. so why would you use rye for a cake? unless of course you didnt read the whole thread.....or you are extremely stubborn.
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"May your mycelia multiply and be fruitful."
- oxohawkoxo
the shroomery is one hell of a community, lots of good people here, and i am damn proud to be a part of it. thanks shroomery and all shroomerites.
- lostinautumn7
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AncientBeing
Local Shaman
Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 247
Last seen: 16 years, 4 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: lostinautumn7]
#7736192 - 12/09/07 11:19 AM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Ah, I was just confused by what a 'cake' was. I thought colonized grain was referred to as cakes but I read up so now I know.
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"If you have not love you have nothing"
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nicechrisman
Interdimensional space wizard
Registered: 11/07/03
Posts: 33,241
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7736442 - 12/09/07 12:35 PM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thanks, I was just curious. That being the case, what's the point in buffering casing mix?
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"Cosmic Love is absolutelely ruthless and highly indifferent:
it teaches its lessons whether you like/dislike them or not."
John C. Lily
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lostinautumn7
Hooker With APenis
Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 120
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: nicechrisman]
#7736596 - 12/09/07 01:11 PM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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the higher Ph in the casing mix is just an extra deterrent for contams. the mean green doesn't like alkaline, and when casing the mycelium is already very strong from colonizing the substrate, so it doesn't mind colonizing a little bit of non nutritious, alkaline, casing mix so it can make some nice healthy mushies for you. 
there could also be another reason but from what i understand that is the main reason we do it.
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"May your mycelia multiply and be fruitful."
- oxohawkoxo
the shroomery is one hell of a community, lots of good people here, and i am damn proud to be a part of it. thanks shroomery and all shroomerites.
- lostinautumn7
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ewikk055
token lurker.
Registered: 12/03/07
Posts: 241
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: lostinautumn7]
#7737752 - 12/09/07 06:41 PM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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RR, what ways do you add coffee grounds to substrates, and I'm not trying to be ignorant to the search bar, I've been trying to find good information about coffee additives to a brf substrate and yet have not been able to find one.
I plan on trying an experimental substrate (at least I think it is) of brf, miracle grow, and possibly coffee grounds.
any pointers RR?
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whatever you interpret from my posts may/may not be fictional.
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Molasses
sobriety with aside of what thefuck am i doing?
Registered: 11/03/07
Posts: 564
Loc: Marijuanaville, Vermont
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
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Re: Best PF cake substrate ingredients? [Re: ewikk055]
#7737985 - 12/09/07 07:50 PM (17 years, 1 month ago) |
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So does coffee swap with verm cup for cup? Is fresh coffee ok, cuz i'm not drinking a few gallons of coffee to make some cakes. haha
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