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 backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,592
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 Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad?  [Re: appleorange]
#8143250 - 03/13/08 08:16 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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There you go. Something for her to be truly upset about.
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 deranger
Registered: 01/21/08
Posts: 6,840
Loc: off the wall
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: appleorange]
#8143333 - 03/13/08 08:31 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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who wouldn't?
guess you'll just have to wait and see if her boat will float.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: appleorange]
#8143754 - 03/13/08 09:43 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
appleorange said:
I have a very melodramatic artist friend who is going through a strange phase right now. She insists on making herself very sad and depressed because she thinks the most tragic and beautiful art comes from tortured minds. Haha, I know.
But anyhow, I'm not sure how to reason with her that this is ridiculous. She's recently taken up heroin, isolated herself from all but 3 friends and is trying really hard to be sad. I'm not an artist per say, so maybe I cannot relate entirely to what she's doing, but this all seems really silly.
I tried telling her that she could still make "tragic" art while being happy and leading a sane life, but she insists that it's not possible.
This post can be broken down into two questions I guess.
1. Can "tragic" art still be created by someone who is happy?
2. How can I convince her that her life is more important than her art?
*I thought this was more appropiate for philosophy because part of my friends problem is that her philosophy on art is interfering with her actual life.
She is right. Great art needs personal tradegy.Even the positive shit. (consider the moody blues.)
Also....You can't convince her of anything and it's not your business. Her life is her own to live and you are not a good judge of the correctness of her choices. You need to pay attention to your own as you will fuck up so much that you will need all your focus just to get by.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (03/13/08 09:44 PM)
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Rahz
Alive Again
Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,336
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: appleorange]
#8143891 - 03/13/08 10:08 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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The sadness story is a joke, ridiculous as you say. She's stuck in her head, already sad, and obviously not too aware of this fact, looking for higher consciousness/god just like most everyone else. As far as convincing her that her life is more important (trying to save her), people generally aren't open to this type of intervention/unsolicited advice. They can't see through their own ego at the time, and will assume you are trying to "bring them down" (or up in her case ). You could turn her off, and cause further isolation, or not. It can take tough love to make people see through their thought matrix, and thats a very touchy subject because the ego hates to "take things seriously" when the subject is seeing beyond the ego. It can take some leverage, and you don't have much being just a friend.
Instead, just having compassion could be better. Allow her to make her own choices without judging her for it. As long as you stick up for your own values, you won't be feeding her ego, nor will you be feeding your own. A little consideration for everyone with the courage to disagree with lame excuses for not being happy. She'll respect you more if you don't fall for her "sad" story.
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rahz
comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace
"Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free."
~Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
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gluke bastid
Stinky Bum
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Loc: Charm City
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: Icelander]
#8144025 - 03/13/08 10:33 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
She is right. Great art needs personal tradegy. Even the positive shit. (consider the moody blues.)
Bullshit she is right. She's shooting heroin because she thinks it will help her create. It won't. The desire to create great art, if it exists above everything is, is its own tragedy. She doesn't need to poison her life. I've seen countless idiots take this approach and it gets them nowhere. I have never seen a more effective way to kill the creative process than heroin. If she needs help creating, tell her to smoke week and drink coffee.
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Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
- Thomas Paine
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger
Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#8144824 - 03/14/08 04:17 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said:
She sounds immature. Anyway, it doesn't come from "faking it". Real hard times forge this quality, not self induced depression.
QFT
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BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: appleorange]
#8145662 - 03/14/08 11:36 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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There's quite enough sad shit running on in the world. Even a happy one can create insightful and dramatic art which can reflect this reality. Maybe she simply needs more empathy.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: gluke bastid]
#8145674 - 03/14/08 11:39 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
gluke bastid said:
Quote:
Icelander said:
She is right. Great art needs personal tradegy. Even the positive shit. (consider the moody blues.)
Bullshit she is right. She's shooting heroin because she thinks it will help her create. It won't. The desire to create great art, if it exists above everything is, is its own tragedy. She doesn't need to poison her life. I've seen countless idiots take this approach and it gets them nowhere. I have never seen a more effective way to kill the creative process than heroin. If she needs help creating, tell her to smoke week and drink coffee.
You know nothing about what she needs dude. You just think you do. Down the road all these experiences could add up to something for her. I have seen many better ways to kill the creative process then heroin. Like, school, modern parenting, TV, religion, politics, and on and on. Get off your high horse and live your own life.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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gluke bastid
Stinky Bum
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 3,322
Loc: Charm City
Last seen: 5 years, 6 months
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: Icelander]
#8151773 - 03/15/08 10:45 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
You know nothing about what she needs dude. You just think you do. Down the road all these experiences could add up to something for her. I have seen many better ways to kill the creative process then heroin. Like, school, modern parenting, TV, religion, politics, and on and on. Get off your high horse and live your own life.
I'm on a high horse because I'm trying to convince people not to get hooked on heroin? I don't think so, but I would rather get called a snob for trying to warn people against smack than not pointing out that it doesn't do shit for creativity. You're right, I could be wrong on this one, but I've never seen heroin do anything but damage to artists who are in the exact same situation she is in, so my advice to her would never change. I happen to have seen some good talented people fall to heroin, and its tragic everytime. You can theorize all you want but until I see someone having trouble get inspired start shooting up and then jump into action creatively I am not changing my tune. I don't care what people do in the name of art...she can take a shit on a canvas and call it Picasso I don't care...but I think heroin is bogus and it hurts people. It has nothing to do with me being on a high horse, and someone who has many years of experience as being an artist and working with other artists I like to try and impart wisdom to the shorties.
Incidentally when it comes to school, TV, religon and the 9 to 5 lifestyle I would agree with you that they are murder to creativity.
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Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
- Thomas Paine
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TrippinNinjaBuddha
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: gluke bastid]
#8152585 - 03/16/08 08:14 AM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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If you're an artist, any experience that you have will influence your art - neither positively or negatively - just reflexively.
Heroin will change her art. Maybe she is exploring that kind of existence, hoping for some kind of insight. Although this may seem stupid (I think there are better ways to spend your days), there is no way to say that she will get something good or bad out of it.
She will get some things out of it, just like she would get some things from going on a bike ride, eating a tuna sandwich, getting a new pet, etc.
Every piece affects the whole, and the whole is where art comes from.
I don't know how close you are to this person, but try and emotionally distance yourself. A very good friend of mine made the decision to start using crack and heroin for a few years, and I spent a whole lot of energy and time worrying about him, looking out for him, trying to help him. When it came down to it, he only came out of it when HE WANTED TO. Nothing I nor anyone else said influenced his decision at all. Wash your hands, speak your mind if you feel you should, and walk away. Nothing much you can do.
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Jumped in a river, what did I see?
Black eyed angels swimming with me
Moon full of stars and astral cars, all the figures I used to see
All my lovers were there with me
All my past and all my futures
We went to heaven in a little rowboat
There was nothing to fear and nothing to doubt
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GGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/23/99
Posts: 8,946
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: appleorange]
#8157138 - 03/17/08 12:19 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well I guess that there really is no right or wrong was to be an Artist.
Junk can actually add a extra dimension into a persons Art, typically making their lifes work sloppy but closer to being in the moment.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: My Friend Wants To Be Sad? [Re: gluke bastid]
#8157217 - 03/17/08 12:36 PM (16 years, 1 month ago) |
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You're right, I could be wrong on this one
Indeed, your opinion is just that and your experience is limited.
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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