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Terence McKenna, crank or profit?
    #808297 -

McKenna came up in a thread and I am wondering what the consensus opinion of this group is about him.

I have always thought that he understood more about the other side than most people who have ever experienced hallucinogens and I am a big fan.

What do others think?

Cheers,

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808331 -

I think a lot of his ideas were real crazy but I wouldn't say he was a crank. I have no idea how many of his theories he actually believed. He wrote entertaining books with a lot of far out speculation.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808379 -

I think he might have started out on the right foot, but somewhere in time he forgot to take the path less traveled and ended up on the $-quest. But hey, who am I to judge? Maybe the only way he could support himself was by selling stories of little elves to trippers-looking-for-meaning-and-direction. IF that's the case, then I feel sorry for him... but that's no reason to respect him or his misleading "work".


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808395 -

In another thread I posted something about a lecture I thought was given by Alan Watts...which, of course, turned out to be one of McKenna's. I didn't say anything at the time cause I wanted to first find out where I had gotten it from. And well, I stumbled upon it just yesterday (quite by accident) and was planning on making the correction some time today...but seeing as this thread is already here I guess it would probably make more sence to just toss it where it belongs. So here it be --> http://www.elftrance.com/Html/ThinkTank.htm
Note: this just takes you to the page it's on, so you have to actually put forth enough effort to scroll down the page to where it's at (hint: the link itself is titled 'here' and can be found between the picture of the greek looking monkey on the soap box and the picture of the Earth with the Rocky Horror lips on it)


--------------------


"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go..." T.S. Eliot

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Sclorch]
    #808429 -

Thanks for your thoughts, Sclorch.

I want to say right up front that I think that McKenna might have gotten caught up in the material wealth his ideas generated. However, for me that does not detract from the central theme of his message(s).

I, for one, think that he is closer to the truth than most others in reference to the beings that appear during hallucino/entheogenic experiences.

In other words, I think the beings he describes actually exist.

There are very deep philosophical implications in his ideas that take a lot of time to explain and I'm hesitant to discuss them.

To the others:

I will download the link when I have a bit more time.

Thanks to all for their opinions.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808578 -

Wow Mr. Mush. Accept my apology please. As soon as I seen the topic and your name replying, I automatically assumed you would say crank and spout some Kant on it.
But I agree with you. I havent read everything by him and I probably don't know the whole story, but while reading True Hallucinations, I was blown out of the water. If he was on to something, and these "things" exist, that is fantastic. If not and he was just tripping his brain matter to edge city, sign me up for that as well. I especially got into the world vibration his brother experienced while on shrooms.
But I can't really answer the question since most prophets are cranks and most cranks become prophets. And just to be an ass. Look at this Jesus guy. Prophet or crank? Nobody knows for sure. The only people who know for a FACT are dead. And they ain't talkin...

But my opinion; Prophet. no crank. wait most definately prophet, i think. Yeah Thats my final answer.


--------------------
"You people voted for Hubert Humphrey, and you killed Jesus." F and L in L.V.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: postalboy]
    #808593 -

Don't assume.

I am a very strange person that thinks too much and is on the verge of a mental collapse. j/k

Seriously, I think he knows more than he thinks he knows and may not ever know the deeper ramifications of his beliefs.

I also think his brother has mental problems, big time.

But those are unfounded opinions as I have never met him and talked to him.

Cheers,

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808637 -

Great writer, great original thinker.

Did a lot of good with the mushroom growers guide too.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #808660 -

Relating to your other post about shared knowledge.. if you share the same ideas as McKenna, he's great. If not. well...

I happen to think he's a good writer and you can't fault a pioneer for missteps so even though I don't always agree with him, I respect him.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: infidelGOD]
    #808789 -

Relating to your other post about shared knowledge.. if you share the same ideas as McKenna, he's great. If not. well...

Thank you. I did not know people counted on my opinion that much. I am humbled my your admission.

Cheers,

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #809400 -

I enjoyed reading McKenna alot... He was and probably still is the one writer who understood what it is like for me on the "Other side" during mushroom voyages. I only started reading him after I had experienced some really insane things while tripping. I loved his descriptions of the Eschaton, the Other (whatever that may be), and language having more power than one might suspect...

I loved the way he spun his words. I had to read his work with a dictionary close by at all times, as his vocabulary was far more expanded than my own.

I am deeply saddened that he died before I could witness his personality in person...

Sclorch, if you wanted to make money, why in the hell would you try and make it by making up stories of elves? Maybe it's just me but if I wanted to make money I would at least come up with something a bit more believable.


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Adamist]
    #809575 -

Sclorch, if you wanted to make money, why in the hell would you try and make it by making up stories of elves?
You bought it didn't you?

Maybe it's just me but if I wanted to make money I would at least come up with something a bit more believable.
Why bother? If it sells, it sells. If it didn't, he would've stopped after the first book.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Sclorch]
    #809600 -

Yeah I'm disgustipated with captilism as much as the next anti-mainstreamer, but hey, if you had the chance to support yourself by writing books wouldn't you take it?

I do think McKenna dramatized or fantasized alot of his writing, but that does not make it any less interesting in my eyes.

If you don't like it don't buy it.


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Adamist]
    #809742 -

if you had the chance to support yourself by writing books wouldn't you take it?
That would depend on my situation. I would have a hard time writing fiction (for non-mainstream readers) and masquerading it as an experience that I had. It's a lie that can only hurt diversity in the end. If I were starving... I'd do it, but I'd throw in some hints that I was bullshitting.

I do think McKenna dramatized or fantasized alot of his writing, but that does not make it any less interesting in my eyes.
Interesting is one thing. Ethical is another thing. I won't argue that it's interesting... it is, but I just think it's misleading.

If you don't like it don't buy it.
Like? That's a pretty vague word when describing the particular intention(s) underlying a decision (in this case to buy a book).


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Sclorch]
    #809770 -

Not sure what planet you're living on sclorch but down here on earth supporting yourself through writing books about magic mushrooms ain't gonna happen. Try it one day and see how long you can support yourself for.

If you want to make any money you need to be selling Harry Potter like quantities, not a few thousand. If Terence had been interested in making money the last thing he would've done was to write books about mushrooms.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Xlea321]
    #810306 -

Not sure what planet you're living on sclorch but down here on earth supporting yourself through writing books about magic mushrooms ain't gonna happen.
I didn't say his was rich and famous. But I don't think he was starving or homeless.

If Terence had been interested in making money the last thing he would've done was to write books about mushrooms
He started out writing as OT Ott. He sold SHITLOADS of those books. You don't think that might have influenced him to write more? Publishing is about SALES. McKenna didn't have a problem writing books that would sell... hence, the publisher kept publishing and SELLING his books. He didn't have to write about Harry Potter... he had his niche market. That's all you need.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Adamist]
    #810316 -

I am deeply saddened that he died before I could witness his personality in person...

I did not know this. That is sad. He had more to teach and learn.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Sclorch]
    #810325 -

In what way was his work misleading?

That is the only point you've made in this thread that I do not understand. Could you elaborate a bit?

Cheers,

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Sclorch]
    #810336 -

Sclorch, check out how much money authors make on a book sale. Mckenna got three books published in around 20 years. At the very best he'd have made $5-10,000 on each book. Over 20 years that ain't exactly the kind of thing you devote your life to unless you have a passionate commitment to it. He'd have made a lot more money flipping hamburgers.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #810630 -

I like McKenna. Sometimes he sounds a bit nuts, but he still has good ideas. Interesting stuff.....


--------------------
Those who know do not speak.
Those who speak do not know.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #811824 -

And I am humbled by your... uh . . humility ... or something

Didn't mean to kiss ass there. Now I feel obligated to bash your next post in order to restore the Cosmic Balance.

You have been warned.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #812101 -

Mckenna is the whole reason I am on the journey I am on. I have read all of his books. Some of his ideas and concepts are incredible. I was saddened by his passing. Mckenna is a must reading for all aspiring psychonauts. Check out this site http://deoxy.org/mckenna.htm

peace out!

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #812583 -

Thank you for the link Eternal.

I just finished reading the story of his last trip.

As a cancer survivor I found it very moving. So much so that I need a break from posting.

Rather than say something maudlin in the emotional state I am in I will say nothing.

Thank you. That is all.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #812705 -

::::: Terence McKenna :::::

1946-2000

Writer & Visionary


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit - NEITHER! [Re: ]
    #812765 -

I think her was a marvelous man, who had deep passions for understanding life, lifting the veil of confusion and corruption, bringing mystery to our world, and making me laugh my balls of when he spoke in tongues.

> I have always thought that he understood more about the other side than most people who have ever experienced hallucinogens...

I think that comes from him being such a serious psychonaut. He's been around the block many times...

I personally have read "The Invisible Landscape" (or what I can decipher from it), and I am currently reading "The Archaic Revival" and "True Hallucinations." I've seen a video that was recorded during a visit he did in Rustlers S. Africa. And I've listened to his audiotapes "History Ends in Green." It's all so interesting, but I don't take it too seriously. After all if December 21, 2012 (Gregorian) is the end of history, then why worry about understanding anything?

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #812767 -

I say prophet, by that I mean has a better idea of what god really is than most people. I agree with most of his ideas, and they make a lot of sense to me. Of course his ideas are far out, and unbeleivable by most people. But I am not like most people.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: mirrorsaw]
    #812791 -

> I have no idea how many of his theories he actually believed.

That's interesting. Indeed, how much of his preaching did he practice? Perhaps it doesn't matter though. I mean when your on 5 dried grams of psilocybin mushrooms or in "the dome with the self transforming machine elves jumping in and out of your chest", nothing needs to make sense!

And I am so humbled by his courage to go to these places and actually fucking TALK to these beings! Whoa!

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Xlea321]
    #812804 -

> If Terence had been interested in making money the last thing he would've done was to write books about mushrooms.

HAHA, that's so fucking true!

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #812882 -

Prophet.
while I disagree with some of his views, and I believe he miscontrued some mathematics (ie, loose adhearance to rigor), but I have incredable respect for the man. The vast majority of his ideology (that which which I am familiar) I find to be incredable.
His passing is a loss to us all.


--------------------
If I made affront, I apologize.
If I made affirmation, I apologize.
I merely came to listen, came to say.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: DinoMyc]
    #813231 -

> I believe he miscontrued some mathematics (ie, loose adhearance to rigor)

I agree with you if you are talking about his mathematical proofs, lemmas, and what not in "The Invisible Landscape." The last few pages are rather simple proofs. Yet I have heard from some sources (ie. Art Bell Show & random articles) that much of his mathematical formulation, the Timewave function, has been looked at by Ph.D. mathematicians on the West coast (and perhaps globally since we are getting closer to 2012). I did find a site that found a flaw in his argument here ( http://www.fourmilab.ch/rpkp/autopsy.html ) by Prof. Matthew Watkins. But I believe it has been adjusted, and now the Timewave function is "workable."

I'm not so sure, someone help me out.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #814092 -

In reply to:
I also think his brother has mental problems, big time.



just out of curiosity, what makes you say that? i've never read/seen/heard anything by him, just T. and i wonder where i could find dome of his crazyness...


--------------------
-akyouser.oner
<(((((((((((((((@~~~

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: akyouser_oner]
    #814246 -

Yeah that kind of struck me too, though I didn't respond to it. I mean Dr. Dennis McKenna is working at the Heffter Research Insitute, how crazy can he be if he's employed there?

Care to share Mr_Mushrooms?

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Brukan]
    #814491 -

Maybe that comment was based on what happened in "True Hallucinations"?

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: mirrorsaw]
    #814689 -

Yeah in True Hallucinations, Dennis seemed to have even more "far out" ideas than his brother. Terence even mentioned in the book that he doubted Dennis's sanity many a time, but eventually after returning to the U.S. he came back to "normal".


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Adamist]
    #815064 -

heh.. yes, normal really should be in quotes with the two of them


--------------------
If I made affront, I apologize.
If I made affirmation, I apologize.
I merely came to listen, came to say.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #815254 -

I have always thought that he understood more about the other side...

Not necessarily. He tossed around many ideas to get people to play with them. He was neither crank nor prophet (profit?), but a juggler. His writings are quite entertaining and have a lyrical quality to them. He viewed the mushroom journey from many different angles, as that of an explorer describing a mountain from different sides and heights.

I don't think he had come to any strong conclusions about many of the possibilities that he painted. I view him more as a catalyst than a messenger. Actually his message was to intrigue us and then to point to the new frontier and say,"Now you go there and report back to us what you see and experience."

One of his better qualities was his self-deprecating humor and ability to challenge his own theories.

I only "discovered" McKenna a year or two before his untimely death and will sorely miss him.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ]
    #820046 -

VVVVV See sig


--------------------





"We are the one's we have been waiting for" - Hopi saying

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: DreaMaTrix]
    #820088 -

Thank you soooooooooooooooooo MUCH!!!!!

That would be awesome!

I do not have any questions for him but I would love to watch it silently.

Again, thank you very much!

Cheers,

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: DreaMaTrix]
    #821828 -

Sounds real cool DreaMaTrix...I'll (hopefully) be in the back row somewhere taking notes


--------------------


"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go..." T.S. Eliot

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Anonymous]
    #9179748 -

I'd like to thank Terence for reaching out through my neuroses during my last trip.  That sample was in just the right place at the right time.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: darkproggy]
    #9179787 -

And I'd like to thank YOU for bumping a 6 year old thread... a Shroomery no-no.

Think any of the original posters will respond?

I'll put my money down on Anonymous.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9180316 -

he's new, chill brah

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: darkproggy]
    #9180348 -

Terence McKenna -> profitable crank

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: DieCommie]
    #9180365 -

I don't know yet, give me 4 years.  :smile:


--------------------
Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9180872 -

Cervantes said:
And I'd like to thank YOU for bumping a 6 year old thread... a Shroomery no-no.

Think any of the original posters will respond?

I'll put my money down on Anonymous.


Bumping old threads is actually encouraged in some forums, would you rather they had opened the umpteenth McKenna thread?

This thread is realy old though, I think it's the Related Threads feature, some old threads deserve to get bumped.

Anyway, Terence McKenna was neither a profit nor a crank.

He was very right about some things and very wrong about others, like anyone else.
His oratory passion and eloquence was extremely rare.

History will remember him as one of the great explorers of our time.

"To say what has never been said, to see what has never been seen. To draw, paint, sing, sculpt, dance and act what has never before been done. To push the envelope of creativity and language. What's really important is the felt presence of direct experience, which simply mean we have to stop consuming our culture. We have to create culture. Don't watch TV, don't read magazines, don't even listen to NPR! Creat your own roadshow! The nexus of space and time where you are now is the most immediate sector of your universe. And if you're worrying about Michael Jackson or Bill Clinton or somebody else then you're disempowered, you're giving if all away to icons which are maintained by an electronic media so that, you want to dress like X or have lips like Y...this is shit-brained! That is all cultural diversion. What is real is you, and your friends, your associations, your highs, your orgasms, your hopes, your plans, your fears. We are told No! You're unimportant, you're peripheral, get a degree, get a job, get a this, get a that and Then you're a player. You don't even what to play that game, you want to RECLAIM YOUR MIND and get it out of the hands og the cultural engineers who want to turm you in a half-baked moron consuming all this trash manufactured out of the bones of a dying world! Where is that at?" -Terrence Mckenna

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Middleman]
    #9182270 -

Have a sense of humor Mid.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9182312 -

lame humor isn't funny

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Middleman]
    #9182354 -

Middleman said:
"To say what has never been said, to see what has never been seen. To draw, paint, sing, sculpt, dance and act what has never before been done. To push the envelope of creativity and language. What's really important is the felt presence of direct experience, which simply mean we have to stop consuming our culture. We have to create culture. Don't watch TV, don't read magazines, don't even listen to NPR! Creat your own roadshow! The nexus of space and time where you are now is the most immediate sector of your universe. And if you're worrying about Michael Jackson or Bill Clinton or somebody else then you're disempowered, you're giving if all away to icons which are maintained by an electronic media so that, you want to dress like X or have lips like Y...this is shit-brained! That is all cultural diversion. What is real is you, and your friends, your associations, your highs, your orgasms, your hopes, your plans, your fears. We are told No! You're unimportant, you're peripheral, get a degree, get a job, get a this, get a that and Then you're a player. You don't even what to play that game, you want to RECLAIM YOUR MIND and get it out of the hands og the cultural engineers who want to turm you in a half-baked moron consuming all this trash manufactured out of the bones of a dying world! Where is that at?" -Terrence Mckenna


it's funny how many people look down on Mckenna like he's just some nut.  i'd like to see them create something like this.  gotta love him for going as far as he did.  his life was an experiment, he refused have some authority create his reality for him. "are you a dreamer?"

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: deranger]
    #9182392 -

I just wish he hadn't come up with his Time Wave theory.

Why?

'Cause when he died, the nutters took his theory as fact. Every time I see a 2012 thread, I get a little more upset at Terry.

That said, I love listening to TM talk, he did have a unique perspective, and several of his theories are quite interesting.

If anything, McKenna is food for the imagination.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: deranger]
    #9182399 -

deranger said:
lame humor isn't funny


Way to double post.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9182434 -

Once a label is on something
It becomes an it
Like it's no longer alive

It's like a loss of vision
Or some dark impression
Or a black spot on your eye

-morcheeba

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9182448 -

Quote:
'Cause when he died, the nutters took his theory as fact. Every time I see a 2012 thread, I get a little more upset at Terry.

Why get upset at all?  People who blindly believe his theory would have blindly clung to other beliefs if his wasn't around.  Where's the harm in a few silly threads?


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Lion]
    #9182477 -

Lion, I love your sig.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: deranger]
    #9182498 -

Thanks :smile:


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Lion]
    #9182534 -

Lion said:
Quote:
'Cause when he died, the nutters took his theory as fact. Every time I see a 2012 thread, I get a little more upset at Terry.

Why get upset at all?  People who blindly believe his theory would have blindly clung to other beliefs if his wasn't around.  Where's the harm in a few silly threads?


The repeated discussions about 2012 get old fast. Especially since before his death, McKenna himself admitted his theory had been disproved.

But try explaining that to the nutters...

Also, if the Mayans could predict the end of time... how come they couldn't predict their own demise?


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9182556 -

They don't get old fast for those who enjoy participating in them.....Would you just rather everyone only discuss issues that you find worthwhile?

And how do you know the Mayans did not predict their own demise?  Maybe they didn't care! :tongue:


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Lion]
    #9182592 -

This discussion has nothing to do with me or my feelings. Do try to stay on topic.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9183745 -

"Terence McKenna, crank or profit"

Should this read "Prophet"?. Or Mckenna: "Crank and Profit"? Or im confused


--------------------
let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: ChubbSubb]
    #9183755 -

He is a genius that might not have ALL of the facts but through the extent of his personal experience and his extreme thoughts I believe that there is at least a large chunk of truth that he brought and still brings to the world.

Plus he brought along the Penis Envy strain haha


--------------------
:mushroom2:This just is and that's okay.:mushroom2:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: mr_kite]
    #9183800 -

mr_kite said:
"Terence McKenna, crank or profit"

Should this read "Prophet"?. Or Mckenna: "Crank and Profit"? Or im confused


I LOVE Terence McKenna... but his theories were wacky.

I'm just impressed by how far outside the box he was able to think.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9184129 -

I love Terence McKenna BECAUSE his theories were wacky.

I still think he has something with regards to his "transcendental object at the end of time."  I remember when I first heard him say it, I got goosebumps.

I truly feel we are accelerating towards something...


--------------------
Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #9184281 -

He was articulate and amusing, had very novel ideas, encouraged direct experience over beliefs and did not shy away from pointing out the flaws of both scientific and psychedelic/paranormal-associated thinkers.

I don't agree with some of his theories but I'm glad they're out there, and as far as psychedelic "prophets" go he seems to me one of the most reasonable and least crankish.


--------------------
No debe haber separación, no puede haber definición.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: zannennagara]
    #9184877 -

:tripping:

he has fed me mushrooms in the forest


--------------------
in all of Infinite
there is but One
and it is nOne
ever and always
in every and all ways

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: MokshaIs]
    #9819005 -

MokshaIs said:
:tripping:

he has fed me mushrooms in the forest


So that's where he is now!


--------------------
Man woke up in a world he did not understand and that is why he tries to interpret it - Carl Jung

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #9819031 -

Terence McKenna, crank or profit?

Just a fun-guy. nothing more.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: darkproggy]
    #9839588 -

So far I've only read McKenna's "Food of the Gods." I found it to be an entertaining and influential read, but admittedly I think his scholarship could've been stronger.


--------------------
"So can you tell me what exactly does freedom mean/
If I'm not free to be as twisted as I wanna be" -Divide by Disturbed

Good Guitars Don't Cry

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: N2loma]
    #9855107 -

After reading many books on psychology I have no doubt that these "entities" are just structures of the unconscious, possibly a collective one.

Many people see a woman telling them "secrets" when they hit DMT, that doesn't sound like anima to anyone else? Had McKenna had a better knowledge of the psyche AWAY from drug use I doubt his beliefs would be the same.

I also think another problem with anyone is that they all fall victim to the power of the mind. You can have a belief and whether it be true or not you can firmly believe it. Add psychedelics to the mix and you have a will that is indestructible.

That is the troble with psychedelics, "reality" becomes a word and not a place or time. I have a place I return to frequently in trips, it is the book I plan to write one day. I can become so immersed in it through my own will and guidance that if I were to stay there for eternity I doubt I would notice. Take this and add more grams or DMT and you have a situation that is as thick as a brick wall, incapable of being destroyed in your own mind.

I do not fault McKenna though or think he is a "crank" I simply think that he was taking the journey that needs to be taken by someone with a better understanding of how the brain works. Oh how I wish substances like Psylocibin and DMT had been available to Carl Jung.


--------------------
With Allure I Look to the Sky With Awakened Eyes

Edited by Rocker232 (02/24/09 10:13 AM)

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rocker232]
    #9855402 -

After reading many books on psychology I have no doubt that these "entities" are just structures of the unconscious, possibly a collective one.


While I always make sure I have a few "doubts" about everything I tend to agree with you here.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Icelander]
    #9855943 -

Terence McKenna was definitly a thinker. I had never thought of time like the was he explained it was. I guess time is holographic though. Its simply mind blowing.

Crank or prophit? Terence is a visionary.


--------------------

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Hubbub]
    #9855953 -

Not sure what you understand by "visionary".


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #9856894 -

Maybe he meant "hallucinary"  :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Icelander]
    #9866076 -

Icelander said:
After reading many books on psychology I have no doubt that these "entities" are just structures of the unconscious, possibly a collective one.


While I always make sure I have a few "doubts" about everything I tend to agree with you here.


Right and these structures are infinitely more powerful than any entity.


--------------------
Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #9866192 -

Uh huh. And what can you/we do with this infinite power?


--------------------

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #9867124 -

Make his wife bake some deelicious cookies?


--------------------

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #9867211 -

Just realized my post was a fulfillment of prophesy.  :smirk:

:sarcasticclap:


--------------------

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #9868096 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
Uh huh. And what can you/we do with this infinite power?


Ever studied Jung?  Ever read a book on mythology?  Ever read Joseph Campbell?  Ever read James Joyce's Ulysses?


--------------------
Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #9869840 -

Penguarky Tunguin said:
Ever studied Jung?  Ever read a book on mythology?  Ever read Joseph Campbell?  Ever read James Joyce's Ulysses?


Ever answer a question with a statement? Were Jung, Campbell and Joyce profits?


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9870042 -

Joyce was. He spoke of quarks before anyone knew what they were. :smirk:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Middleman]
    #9870491 -

And McKenna predicted his own death.

Whoopie.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #9870591 -

Jung and Freud made what we call in french "topiques", organizations and structurations of the mind.

These tend to explain everthing, and seem extremly accurate.

However, the problem is that although Jung, Adler and Freud didn't say the same things, all of their theories work.
It's not psychology, but psychanalysis, wich should be used carefully.

Let's remain skeptical about these things. : )

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Anonymous]
    #9870801 -

terrence bugs me in the way christ bugs me but worse
crank and profiteer
yuck
sorry

at least christ was said to walk on water and heal people which is probably snake oil


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9870917 -

your opinion is terrible.


--------------------
Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time
TRANSCEND


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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Kukaracha]
    #9871795 -

Kukaracha said:
Jung and Freud made what we call in french "topiques", organizations and structurations of the mind.

These tend to explain everthing, and seem extremly accurate.

However, the problem is that although Jung, Adler and Freud didn't say the same things, all of their theories work.
It's not psychology, but psychanalysis, wich should be used carefully.

Let's remain skeptical about these things. : )


I eschew skepticism about things which I can know.  Refer to the philosopher, Karl R. Popper's Conjectures and Refutations: The Growth of Scientific Knowledge for more.


--------------------

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Anonymous]
    #9871839 -

Crank: once elves are talked about in his manner
it is Dungeons and Dragons and no longer science.


--------------------

"I'm looking at you looking at it"

SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL PLEASE! www.youtube.com/apollyphelion



Creator of the World's Worst Comic Book

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Apollyphelion]
    #9871890 -

Dude, like the elves, man... are, like, soooo oh my God!

And the universe is, like, so big and important, but I think it is maybe gonna end in 2012, for real my peoples!! 




Read between the lines and quit judging his sense of humor.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #9875077 -

Mr. Mushrooms said:
Kukaracha said:
Jung and Freud made what we call in french "topiques", organizations and structurations of the mind.

These tend to explain everthing, and seem extremly accurate.

However, the problem is that although Jung, Adler and Freud didn't say the same things, all of their theories work.
It's not psychology, but psychanalysis, wich should be used carefully.

Let's remain skeptical about these things. : )


I eschew skepticism about things which I can know.  Refer to the philosopher, Karl R. Popper's Conjectures and Refutations: The Growth of Scientific Knowledge for more.


You can refute science in the absolute; however, you need to refute reality for that. If reality is accepted, then science is proven, 1+1=2.

Plus, if you agree with Popper, then psychanalysis isn't a science; what do you know about it? What proofs are they? What makes Jung more relevant than Freud or Adler?
I believe that Jung is right on some points, like the Anima (the Animi seem unexplained to me though, why not one Anima in the feminine psyche?), but I still use it carefully.

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9875184 -

redgreenvines said:
terrence bugs me in the way christ bugs me but worse
crank and profiteer
yuck
sorry

at least christ was said to walk on water and heal people which is probably snake oil


jealous


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Rose]
    #9875194 -

Cervantes said:
And McKenna predicted his own death.

Whoopie.


I also predict my death. :hamsterdance:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Icelander]
    #9875415 -

maybe of the walking on water.


--------------------
:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #9875431 -

or the fame.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Icelander]
    #9875468 -

Watch the Monty Python's life of Bryan!
Fame is not alway a good thing for messiahs. :smile:

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Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Kukaracha]
    #9875475 -

It's never good IMO. For anyone.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Terence McKenna, crank or profit? [Re: Icelander]
    #9876136 -

I ment visionary as he imagines what could be. I dont think he ever says anything and concludes to his audience that it is fact. Its just food for thought. And much thought does his food bring.


--------------------

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General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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