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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #8051926 - 02/21/08 01:41 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

A post twice is long is hardly more 'convenient'. Nor is something totally different 'exactly the same'.

Your post is such nonsense that I will wager $1000 that not one of 5 strangers picked at random will consider them exactly the same.


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8051979 - 02/21/08 01:52 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Perhaps not 'exactly the same' but rather, strikingly similar.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8052047 - 02/21/08 02:04 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

Nothing in your original post is innacurate.



Yay me! :monkeydance:

In the book "Wizard of the Upper Amazon", the author (del Rios?), a self-described shaman in his own right, told how he lived with a primitive Amazonian tribe for over a year after being kidnapped and his fellow rubber harvesters were killed. The elders would take ayahuasca to divine which tribe was going to attack them. They would work themselves into a frenzy and slaughter many innocents in the neighboring tribe who had no such was intentions.





Wizard of the Upper Amazon was admitted to be imaginative fiction by it's author. It is a poor example of anthropology, and it's description of the practices of the Amazonian tribes is inaccurate. You criticised Moonshoe for citing fiction, but you are doing the same.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8052061 - 02/21/08 02:07 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Would you care to wager that I can not come up with an equally moronic story to counter your position?




You are flaming. That is not allowed...no no! Bad!


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8052403 - 02/21/08 03:39 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
A post twice is long is hardly more 'convenient'. Nor is something totally different 'exactly the same'.




Well, it was certainly more entertaining and imaginative. :lol:


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Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



Edited by Tchan909 (02/21/08 03:41 PM)


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #8052461 - 02/21/08 03:56 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

It was perfect to prove the point, imo.


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #8053271 - 02/21/08 06:59 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Wizard of the Upper Amazon was admitted to be imaginative fiction by it's author. It is a poor example of anthropology, and it's description of the practices of the Amazonian tribes is inaccurate. You criticised Moonshoe for citing fiction, but you are doing the same.





At the time I read the book, the author claimed it to be autobigraphical.


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8053277 - 02/21/08 07:01 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Perhaps you should try getting you anthropological information from peer reviewed journals. :shrug:


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #8053279 - 02/21/08 07:01 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
Quote:

Would you care to wager that I can not come up with an equally moronic story to counter your position?




You are flaming. That is not allowed...no no! Bad!




Calling a story about two guys living in feces, moronic, is not flaming. I said nothing against the poster.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8053296 - 02/21/08 07:04 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

So, YOU took a book that discusses telepathy as reality for fact?


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #8053345 - 02/21/08 07:14 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

You know there is very little academic information on ayahuasca and that I was not trying to present a falsehood.

Yet you fail to apply your standards equally, such as to Moonshoe's story. :rolleyes: That is disingenuous.


The fact remains that ayahuasca journeying has yet to bring back demonstrable knowledge that was not learned from an ordinary reality source. At least no strong case for such has ever been made publicly.


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OfflineNiamhNyx
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8053537 - 02/21/08 07:41 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

There is actually a great deal of academic anthropological work done on ayahuasca and other psychedelics, as well as things like the dreaming. This stuff is interesting, of course scientists are studying it! I'd send you links to journal articles, but unfortunately you have to pay to use most of the sites. I have access through my school... JSTOR is an excellent source.

Also, my comment wasn't disingenuous because Moonshoe never claimed his parable came from a legitimate source. He made it up, and it struck me as funny.


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #8053661 - 02/21/08 08:03 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

harmine
Pronunciation: har′mēn
A central nervous system stimulant and potent monoamine oxidase inhibitor obtained from Peganum harmala (family Zygophyllaceae) and Banisteria caapi (family Malpighaceae); psychic effects resemble those of LSD, but sedative and depressive qualities may predominate over hallucinatory manifestations.

Synonym(s): banisterine, leucoharmine, telepathine

[G. harmala, harmal, fr. Ar. harmalah, + -ine]


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OfflinecoulterIV
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #8053680 - 02/21/08 08:07 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
So, YOU took a book that discusses telepathy as reality for fact?






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BREATHE IN LOVE
BREATHE OUT FORGIVENESS
(If you’re not in your breath, you’re in your mind)


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: coulterIV]
    #8053700 - 02/21/08 08:10 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Where are ya'll at??:boxerface:


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OfflinecoulterIV
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8053814 - 02/21/08 08:29 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

backfromthedead said:
Where are ya'll at??:boxerface:




they are stuck in the machine unable to dream their way to the otherside.


--------------------
BREATHE IN LOVE
BREATHE OUT FORGIVENESS
(If you’re not in your breath, you’re in your mind)


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Offlinebackfromthedead
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: coulterIV]
    #8053886 - 02/21/08 08:51 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Tell them all it takes is a stack of blocks.  Preferably not a house of cards.  Something substantial now.
Less blocks the better.
I suspect ONE is best.
But Christ, Lucifer...
Yin.
Yang.
Fight it out and awake with a BANG!!
Telepathy??
Got me.
I was convinced.
I got minced.
Medicine.
Edison.
Seattle.
Battle.

I jumped in the fountain.  It was all seeds and weeds yes.
I climbed the mountain.  Looked down and saw a mess.
I felt connected up there...
To all you out there.
And you all were talking to me, those that care.
But then it turned ugly into a tranced evil stare.
The docs say I'm schizo
I say I know so
I say I know the plan
They pretend like the don't understand
The story.
Rory.
Rogers on ice when I was a kid.
I drank it like that I did.
Then it POPPED.
And it didn't stop.
Voices.
Are you real??
Talk to me.
:uptosomething:


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OfflineLion
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: backfromthedead]
    #8053904 - 02/21/08 09:02 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Are you real??
Talk to me.




--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #8053978 - 02/21/08 09:14 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

NiamhNyx said:
The story points out how ridiculous it is to expect someone's spirit world to magically shield them from physical assault and that the fact that it didn't do so doesn't undermine the validity of the experience.




This conclusion was also reached by CC but I never understood that. If one can "see" then they can see and that's that.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Aboriginal Dreamtime [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8053993 - 02/21/08 09:16 PM (15 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

Wizard of the Upper Amazon was admitted to be imaginative fiction by it's author. It is a poor example of anthropology, and it's description of the practices of the Amazonian tribes is inaccurate. You criticised Moonshoe for citing fiction, but you are doing the same.





At the time I read the book, the author claimed it to be autobigraphical.




True, the author was a liar.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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