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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Icelander]
#8035790 - 02/17/08 10:19 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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They fear your vengeful wrath. Who would dare face your mighty axe? This I ax you.
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Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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I'd ban both of you for derailing another perfectly good thread if you two weren't so entertaining.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Diploid]
#8037265 - 02/18/08 10:08 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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You can't handle the ban.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Boots
Disenchanted


Registered: 07/25/07
Posts: 1,137
Loc: Northwood, Ohio, U.S.A.
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Icelander]
#8037561 - 02/18/08 11:40 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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As soon as you realize you know nothing, you are the smartest man alive.
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BlueCoyote
Beyond



Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 16 days
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Boots]
#8037743 - 02/18/08 12:31 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Often it's enough to learning to know just oneself.
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Bridgeburner
Not spiritual at all.




Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 20,010
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: BlueCoyote]
#8037822 - 02/18/08 12:50 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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faith is believing what you know ain't so.
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BlueCoyote
Beyond



Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 16 days
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Bridgeburner]
#8037901 - 02/18/08 01:08 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Faith is believing (in) what one doesn't know (yet). [Fullstop] It hasn't to be untrue by definition.
edit:hehe, damned, think exceeded upload limit. 'll try 'gain 'morro..
Edited by BlueCoyote (02/18/08 02:39 PM)
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mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
I am talking about faith as it is applied to religious and spiritual ideas.
Basically when one has R/S faith, it means they adopted an idea and will hold onto it like a pitbull to someone's pant cuffs no matter what new ideas or facts are presented. One encounters this form of blind stubborness here regularly.
It is not a strength at all, but a sign of weakness and unchangability. It is stagnation and intellectual death.
As more of an observer than a poster here (until recently at least) I would like to put forth the possibility that the ones with faith aren't the only stubborn posters here.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: mushbaby]
#8038220 - 02/18/08 02:19 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Darlin', I have given 'the believers' thousands of opportunities to knock me from my lofty perch (as in my recent remote viewing challenge and elsewhere). Hasn't happened yet. Each failure only reinforces my position. Hard to change that until I am proven wrong.
To me stubborness means clinging to a position EVEN WHEN CONTRARY EVIDENCE is presented.
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Edited by OrgoneConclusion (02/18/08 02:48 PM)
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mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
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I'm not going to let you draw me into this argument with you.
I'm not going to do it!
But ( ) people not completing your challenges does not mean there is nothing in this world/universe besides what you can prove.
Damn it OC. I just can't help myself.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: mushbaby]
#8038325 - 02/18/08 02:51 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Not everything can be proven, but when people make statements and cannot back them up, how is it stubborn for me to persist with a position that works and has yet to be shown false?
Help me to understand.
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Chronic7

Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: mushbaby] 1
#8038354 - 02/18/08 02:59 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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True faith is only believed when one has experienced the truth so there is no doubt in his or her mind. thats what i feel, i didnt beleive until i experienced.
Now i realise i was weak minded before not after, i agree that people with blind faith can possibly be weak minded/easily led.
But remember no evidence by anyone can be provided to proove that which cannot be prooved in the first place, thats why its called faith.
Science can and never will proove or disproove the divine. NEVER! as it is impure, changing, impermanent, attached to an outcome of an experiment or theory.
All religeon fundamentally is is realisation of ultimate truth, and they try spread it to the masses through religeon. They all have the same fundamentals. I used to have the same exact views as you on religeon/faith until i experienced. I was always the last on to preach!
Experience and faith is all there is, theres is no proof and never ever will be, for, or against it.
If you were talking about blind faith, faith upon hearing and not experience i would agree with you.
But those that experience what faith is placed in, know.
I am a beleiver in buddhism/Taoist philosophy and always be, i love science aswell, multidimensions, string theorys, atoms, etc all tie in with what i beleive they dont go agaisnt it for a second.
NOTHING goes against what i beleive, not even your point of view in disagreement, its still going in perfect flow with what i believe thats whats so great about it!!!
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Chronic7]
#8038363 - 02/18/08 03:02 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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As "faith" is a word with several different definitions, this whole argument is defined by semantics and is inherently meaningless.
Just thought I'd drop that in.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (02/18/08 03:02 PM)
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Chronic7]
#8038383 - 02/18/08 03:05 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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But those that experience what faith is placed in, know.
The way a fundamentalist 'knows'...
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Sage.Phish
Guerrilla Farmer



Registered: 02/17/08
Posts: 598
Loc: City 17
Last seen: 8 years, 8 months
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Chronic7]
#8038393 - 02/18/08 03:07 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I think orgone is talking about the sort faith that anne coulter and FOX news repreasent not the type where you go and find your inner self through a process of religious practices and meditation/prayer
em i right?
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Sophistic Radiance
Free sVs!



Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 43,135
Loc: Center of the Universe
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Sage.Phish]
#8038405 - 02/18/08 03:08 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I don't think what he is saying is that nuanced.
Or maybe it's the language that is too simple.
Maybe it's both.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
Edited by Tchan909 (02/18/08 03:09 PM)
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Chronic7

Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Sage.Phish]
#8038457 - 02/18/08 03:18 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sage.Phish said: I think orgone is talking about the sort faith that anne coulter and FOX news repreasent not the type where you go and find your inner self through a process of religious practices and meditation/prayer
em i right?
nope, he seems to beleive there is no innerself, just the selfish ego, that is all there is that exists.
thats what he conveys anyway, he may be just testing us?
is SEEMS OC only beleives all there is is what can be prooved by science, so if he was born a thousand years ago, the world is all there is to him...just world and sky, and sum twinkly wittle lights in the sky at nighttime.
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BlueCoyote
Beyond



Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 16 days
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: Chronic7]
#8038463 - 02/18/08 03:18 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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"Science can and never will proove or disproove the divine. NEVER!" That's pure bllshit ! They won't discredit eachother !
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TacticalBongRip
Curious Observer



Registered: 08/20/05
Posts: 527
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Orgone,
If faith is for the weak-minded, then would that not make you weak minded as well?
It seems you label faith as a negative because you think you don't have faith in any sort of belief system (at least that is the implication I get from your original post). I once scoffed at those who believed in things/ideas that could not be proven scientifically, until I realized that I was putting my faith in the status quo, in something I was conditioned to believe was true from a young age.
Orgone, what you have done here with your post is express your faith in the beliefs of the majority of the scientific community and/or a materialist viewpoint (that that which you cannot see must not exist). Have you ever considered that science and/or the materialist point of view is just another belief system which may not be capable of explaining certain facets of the reality in which we live?
Faith is a tool which can be used in positive (having faith in yourself to succeed in life) or negative (mass suicide to reach another level of reality) ways. To believe in nothing is still a belief.
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Chronic7

Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 13,679
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Re: Having Faith is for the weak-minded [Re: TacticalBongRip]
#8038486 - 02/18/08 03:24 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Exactly he has his faith in nonfaith 
blue cyote explain plz i dont understand, neither can discredit each other yes, thats my point.
they are both fantastic but will never ever discredit each other.
so science can never proove the divine, as the divine cannot proove itself! just as the divine cannot disproove science
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