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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Heaven's Gate Revisited
#8030129 - 02/16/08 04:27 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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From their website which has been left up AS A WARNING!
Whether Hale-Bopp has a "companion" or not is irrelevant from our perspective. However, its arrival is joyously very significant to us at "Heaven's Gate ®." The joy is that our Older Member in the Evolutionary Level Above Human (the "Kingdom of Heaven") has made it clear to us that Hale-Bopp's approach is the "marker" we've been waiting for -- the time for the arrival of the spacecraft from the Level Above Human to take us home to "Their World" -- in the literal Heavens. Our 22 years of classroom here on planet Earth is finally coming to conclusion -- "graduation" from the Human Evolutionary Level. We are happily prepared to leave "this world" and go with Ti's crew. If you study the material on this website you will hopefully understand our joy and what our purpose here on Earth has been. You may even find your "boarding pass" to leave with us during this brief "window."
We are so very thankful that we have been recipients of this opportunity to prepare for membership in Their Kingdom, and to experience Their boundless Caring and Nurturing.
How does this differ from any of the alien tripe bandied about on M&P? Why the need to wallow in fanciful ignorance? Why pretend there is no danger? How many times must be people be sucked in before they get a goddamned clue?
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Edited by OrgoneConclusion (02/16/08 11:00 AM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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All Hail-Bopp
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Icelander]
#8030804 - 02/16/08 10:59 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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From their 'Mission Statement':
Then on September 25-26, 1995, from a secluded location, we issued a statement that went out - "on line" - around the globe, for our sixth public interaction. The statement entitled "Undercover 'Jesus' Surfaces Before Departure" was posted to the World Wide Web and to 95 UseNET newsgroups on the Internet, potentially reaching millions simultaneously. And in keeping with our policy of "speaking in tongues," on October 11, 1995, we posted a higher, more generic translation, entitled "'95 Statement by an E.T. Presently Incarnate ." The response was extremely animated and somewhat mixed. However, the loudest voices were those expressing ridicule, hostility, or both - so quick to judge that which they could not comprehend.This was the signal to us to begin our preparations to return "home." The weeds have taken over the garden and truly disturbed its usefulness beyond repair - it is time for the civilization to be recycled - "spaded under."
Hmmmm, so the skeptics got another one wrong, did they?
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Archemetis
newbie

Registered: 06/21/04
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be grateful orgone, for without the heavens gater's and their like, you would have nothing to talk about. these people are a service to you.
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falcon


Registered: 04/01/02
Posts: 8,005
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Are skeptics given to ridicule, hostility, and quick to judge that which they can not comprehend?
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: How does this differ from any of the alien tripe bandied about on M&P?
Uhhh... because we don't recommend suicide as a means to enlightenment perhaps? Not to mention a hundreds other things which don't need to be mentioned. But I'd say that's a pretty significant difference.
How does your blanket statement form of skepticism and lumping all things in the same category differ from the Government's War on Drugs and 75 years of blind ignorance and corruption.. criminalizing things without first examining the facts? Your comparisons of Heaven's Gate to EVERY believer in Aliens screams out sensationalism, anyone remember Reefer Madness? Marijuana makes you go insane and kill people. All alien believers think hale bopp is a spaceship and we must kill ourselves to go to heaven. Please.. get a fucking grip.
Quote:
Why the need to wallow in fanciful ignorance?
Excuse me?
Quote:
Why pretend there is no danger?
What danger? Be more specific. I'm not scared of Heaven's Gate.
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How many times must be people be sucked in before they get a goddamned clue?
Suckered into what? Be more vague please.
Far as I am concerned.. people can believe whatever they goddamn want to believe, as long as they are not harming any other human being in doing so. I don't see Heaven's Gate harming anyone except themselves with irrational thinking. But that's their prerogative. You seem to be the only person that gives a damn. Why, who knows.
Our government on the other hand.. believes in lots of things. And they follow through with those beliefs by bombing and shooting people halfway across the world, criminalizing plants of nature, and incriminating harmless people, while the murderers are given medals of honor. Oh, and while we're killing other people.. we might as well go ahead and use depleted uranium munitions, so that the entire area will be radioactive for a million or more years and everyone will end up mutated in some way, if they survive it. It's only fair right? hey... they're just a bunch of brown skins anyway who cares... and fuck the environment it's not like we need it to survive AM I RIGHT OR WHAT?
I wonder what your obsession is with some obscure cult that no one really cares about and doesn't effect anyone but themselves, when there are far bigger problems to be worrying about.. things that effect everyone. Are you paid to distract people from real issues?
Why the vagueness?
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs




Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 3 months, 10 days
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032175 - 02/16/08 06:37 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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There is nothing greater to worry about than a lack of critical thinking.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Redstorm]
#8032195 - 02/16/08 06:42 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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And where do you suggest is the lack of critical thinking?
I propose that our own government is a far greater danger to humanity than a thousand Heaven's gate cults.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs




Registered: 10/08/02
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032215 - 02/16/08 06:50 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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That doesn't mean that both shouldn't be blasted for their deficiencies. I have enough wind to ridicule both of them, as I'm sure others do as well.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Redstorm]
#8032267 - 02/16/08 07:02 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Very true. And I share those sentiments.
However, comparing such a self-destructive cult to an entire group of people for virtually no reason.. is rather short-sighted and does not demonstrate critical thinking, is my point.
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bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032287 - 02/16/08 07:06 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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OP: why are you so hung up on mass suicide?
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: bmiles]
#8032348 - 02/16/08 07:23 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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He likes to think that anyone who believes in spiritual entities, otherwordly entities, supernatural powers, psychic energy, etc, etc.. is the same as Heaven's Gate and that they demonstrate irrational thought that is dangerous to themselves and those around them. Which is why I committed mass suicide with my cult of freaks 10 years ago to join god on his shaceship 
Speaking of unsubstantiated belief systems and illogical thinking...
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Shroomism
Space Travellin



Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032358 - 02/16/08 07:27 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Critical thinking is a form of judgment, specifically purposeful and reflective judgment. Using critical thinking one makes a decision or solves the problem of judging what to believe or what to do, but does so in a reflective way. Critical thinking gives due consideration to the evidence, the context of judgment, the relevant criteria for making that judgment well, the applicable methods or techniques for forming that judgment, and the applicable theoretical and constructs for understanding the nature of the problem and the question at hand. These elements also happen to be the key defining characteristics of professional fields and academic disciplines. This is why critical thinking can occur within a given subject field (by reference to its specific set of permissible questions, evidence sources, criteria, etc.) and across subject fields in all those spaces where human beings need to interact and make decisions, solve problems, and figure out what to believe and what to do.
Within the framework of scientific skepticism, the process of critical thinking involves acquiring information and evaluating it to reach a well-justified conclusion or answer. Part of critical thinking comprises informal logic. However, a large part of critical thinking goes beyond informal logic and includes assessment of beliefs and identification of prejudice, bias, propaganda, self-deception, distortion, misinformation, etc. Given research in cognitive psychology, some educators believe that schools should focus more on teaching their students critical thinking skills, intellectual standards, and cultivating intellectual traits (such as intellectual humility, intellectual empathy, intellectual integrity, and fair-mindedness) than on memorizing facts by rote learning. As defined in A Greek-English Lexicon the verb krino- means to choose, decide or judge. Hence a krites is a discerner, judge or arbiter. Those who are kritikos have the ability to discern or decide by exercising sound judgment
The word krino- also means to separate (winnow) the wheat from the chaff or that which has worth from that which does not.
Critical thinking is important, because it enables one to analyze, evaluate, explain, and restructure our thinking, decreasing thereby the risk of acting on, or thinking with, a false premise.
However, even with the use of critical thinking skills, mistakes can happen due to a thinker's egocentrism or sociocentrism or failure to be in possession of the full facts. In addition, there is always the possibility of inadvertent human error....
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bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032455 - 02/16/08 07:49 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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yoda: wise he is.
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8032551 - 02/16/08 08:15 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Archemetis said: be grateful orgone, for without the heavens gater's and their like, you would have nothing to talk about. these people are a service to you.
The death of another does nothing to serve me and your position is extremely distasteful to this poster.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032563 - 02/16/08 08:21 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Uhhh... because we don't recommend suicide as a means to enlightenment perhaps?
Please go to the original Heaven's Gate website and read the topic: OUR POSITION AGAINST SUICIDE.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Shroomism]
#8032573 - 02/16/08 08:25 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Here is what an independent writer has to say. Not surprising to this poster is the amazing number of parallels to many mindsets on M&P:
The End is Near
The mind of the fanatic, according to social philosopher Eric Hoffer in The True Believer, needs something to worship, even to the point of annihilation. He will sacrifice everything for the impossible dream. Many fanatical mass movements form in our society but only those that act in some dramatic manner, such as announcing the world's end or committing mass suicide, seem to get widespread attention.
Heaven's Gate was among the most startling.
A peaceful and secretive group, they made occasional forays into recruitment, but most of their time was spent in rigorous training for reaching a higher plane of consciousness. While there's nothing unusual about that, they are among the few cults who went all the way. To understand how they formed the beliefs that led to their ultimate actions, we need to look at cults as a whole that hold philosophies of an approaching Armageddon and a savior messiah.
"All mass movements," Hoffer wrote, "generate in their adherents a readiness to die and a proclivity for united action; all of them, irrespective of the doctrine they preach and the program they project, breed fanaticism, enthusiasm, fervent hope, hatred, and intolerance; all of them are capable of releasing a powerful flow of activity in certain departments of life; all of them demand blind faith and a single-hearted allegiance."
Cults that promise a higher order from such extreme discipline appeal to a certain type of mind:
Frustrated with the way things are
hungry for change
confident of the potential for human perfection
eager to believe in a single truth
able to envision an unprecedented society
ready for action Religious scholar Catherine Wessinger calls the groups that form around these doctrines millennialists, and in How the Millennium Comes Violently she says that they're motivated by an ultimate concern: "the belief in an imminent transition to a collective condition consisting of total well-being, which may be earthly or heavenly."
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: bmiles]
#8032581 - 02/16/08 08:28 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
yoda: wise he is.
Does wise equal breaking a public promise and lying to get another member banned?
I call that dishonor and cowardice and not wisdom.
But that is just my opinion.
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bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
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i was referring to shroomish, what are you talking about?
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: bmiles]
#8032732 - 02/16/08 09:11 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Shroomish.
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bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Middleman]
#8032784 - 02/16/08 09:27 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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damnit.
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....



Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
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Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
yoda: wise he is.
. Does wise equal breaking a public promise and lying to get another member banned?
Damn, Yoda did all of that to you.....? 
>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Archemetis
newbie

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 200
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
Archemetis said: be grateful orgone, for without the heavens gater's and their like, you would have nothing to talk about. these people are a service to you.
The death of another does nothing to serve me and your position is extremely distasteful to this poster.
my position is like the goofy kid poking his finger into a fat freinds belly, he chuckles. only my finger is aimed for your ego. as if to say, come on now. and i am chuckling
Edited by Archemetis (02/19/08 09:43 AM)
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bmiles
artist



Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 2,299
Loc: on the left side
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8042114 - 02/19/08 10:00 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Archemetis said:
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
Archemetis said: be grateful orgone, for without the heavens gater's and their like, you would have nothing to talk about. these people are a service to you.
The death of another does nothing to serve me and your position is extremely distasteful to this poster.
my position is like the goofy kid poking his finger into a fat freinds belly, he chuckles. only my finger is aimed for your ego. as if to say, come on now. and i am chuckling
what ??
-------------------- Never go with a hippy to a second location.
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Archemetis
newbie

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 200
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: bmiles]
#8042577 - 02/19/08 11:57 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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they call that a metaphor
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8042610 - 02/19/08 12:03 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Kirk: Scotty, what is the condition of the engines? And DON'T us a metaphor!
Scotty: The engineering panel is lighting up like a Christmas tree and the engines are humming like a girl in May.
Kirk: SCOTTY! WTF did I tell you?
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Archemetis
newbie

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 200
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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scotty uses a simile
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8042765 - 02/19/08 12:53 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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But Kirk didn't know the difference.
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MushmanTheManic
Stranger


Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
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Hail "Bob", not Hale-Bopp.
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Archemetis
newbie

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 200
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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i never did like kirk
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PhanTomCat
Teh Cat....



Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 5,908
Loc: My Youniverse....
Last seen: 14 years, 11 months
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8043920 - 02/19/08 06:16 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Archemetis said: my position is like the goofy kid poking his finger into a fat freinds belly, he chuckles.
Sometimes, that only works in certain contexts....

>^;;^<
-------------------- I'll be your midnight French Fry.... "The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...." >^;;^<
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Middleman

Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Archemetis]
#8043992 - 02/19/08 06:30 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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EternalCowabunga
Being of Great Significance



Registered: 04/04/05
Posts: 7,152
Loc: Time and Space
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Re: Heaven's Gate Revisited [Re: Middleman]
#8044070 - 02/19/08 06:40 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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oh the chuckles we will have, all the chuckles and smuckles
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